$325 for Colt Police Positive 1922?

[BigBlock]

I was at the gunshop yesterday and saw a really nice looking Colt on the wall. I thought it was newer, but the sign said 1922 manufacture. It was a 4" .38 special Police Positive, which looked hardly used at all. You could fool me into thinking it was a 1998 model. I'd say the blueing is 95%+.

They want $325. Is that a good deal for that kind of condition or just average? I thought the old ones were worth more than that...

 

[MMCSRET]

I just paid $450.00 for a 1929 PP, 32, 5" on the 38 frame in 90%. I also have 2 PP, 32 4" on 32 frames that I paid $300.00 each Today I'd say yours is priced to sell. They are becoming more desirable all the time, as are most all Colt revolvers. Go over to the Coltforum and talk to them, that is where the expertise is located.

 

[XavierBreath]

A year or two ago, that price would be called a fisherman's price........ Fishing for a sucker or a haggler.

Today, that is a pretty fair price for a 38 special Police Positive with finish such as you describe. Especially if the grips are original and unbroken.

At least that seems to be the case around here........

 

[Hawk]

If you're registered on Gunbroker you can do a search for closed auctions to see what stuff is actually selling for.

The 325.00 seems reasonable based on my quick check.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=110002040
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=109868836
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=110712512
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=111259333

Perhaps Fuff will check in. 300.00 or 325.00 strikes me as pretty darn good for a 1922 Colt. Maybe I need to be paying more attention to these PP things. Given the wild a whooly stuff going on with DSs I wouldn't be surprised to see people calling 325.00 PPs the "good old days" a year or three from now.

I share your surprise - I thought those from that period would be more than they're apparently going for. Post pics when you get it.

 

[clang]

Just remember - a .38 Police Positive shoots .38 S&W or .38 New Police. It will not shoot .38 Special.

If you want one that fires .38 Special (or .32-20), it will have to be a PPS or Police Positive Special. The PPS has a longer cylinder to accomodate the longer cartridges.

 

[krs]

Watch out for a refinished pistol. When they're that old it's not uncommon that the blueing has at least begun to go brown in areas. Often times it's on the backstrap or the underside of the trigger guard, but it's pretty unusual for any of them to maintain a finish that's like a new pistol unless it's either been kept very carefully or it's been expertly refinished. This is especially true of a "working" firearm - one that typically was carried and/or used.

 

[Old Fuff]

As a general rule the short-cylindered Police Positive sell for a bit less then the longer cylindered Police Positive Special that was usually chambered in .32-20 WCF or .38 Special. I used to be able to steal them, but no more.

I would say that at $325 a Police Positive Special @ 95% was close to the high end of the present market. If the buyer intends to shoot the revolver one made between (about) 1927 through 1948 is sometimes prefered because they have more visable sights with a square-notch in the rear.

They are good revolvers, exactly the same as a Detective Special, but with a 4, 5 or 6 inch barrel. Unlike they're Smith & Wesson small frame counterparts the cylinder holds 6, not 5 rounds; and they all had a positive hammer block that permitted one to safely carry the gun with all 6 chambers loaded.

 

[Hawk]

Well, that bursts my bubble. If I add the term "special" to my search string it appears everything spikes by around 100.00, or more.

I guess I'll dig the DS out of the safe tonight and be glad I got it for 300.00-odd dollars a bit ago.

 

[Old Fuff]

Until recently collectors haven't shown a whole lot of interest in smaller Colt hand ejectors made during the first half of the 20th century.

On the other hand there has been some shooter interest in those made from the 1930's forward. As you are aware, Diamondbacks, Detective Specials and Cobras led the pack, while the Police Positive and Special lagged behind, with the Official Police somewhere in the middle.

One thing that has hurt is the lack of good reference books, where there are several that cover Smith & Wesson's and Rugers.

But as other collectable Colt's have priced themselves out of the "ordinary collectors" market interest is turning toward these revolvers that display craftmanship we don't see being made today. But it's early enough in the game so that only those that are in exceptional condition attract exceptional prices.

That said, I recently saw what was probably an unfired Official Police .38 made in or about 1934 go at auction for a benchmark $1,350.

That ain't chick'n feed.

 

[BigBlock]

Especially if the grips are original and unbroken.

Grrr...it's got some ugly oversized grips, but they do have the Colt logo on them...maybe they are real Colts?

If you want one that fires .38 Special (or .32-20), it will have to be a PPS or Police Positive Special. The PPS has a longer cylinder to accomodate the longer cartridges.

That must be what it is. I am sure I saw .38 special on the gun. I am very careful to avoid the .38 S&W.

So, if I found a pair of original grips...do you guys think this gun would be a good investment? If it's been reblued does that make it basically worthless? I was looking for another Blackhawk...but the PP has been on my list....

 

[Old Fuff]

Part of the value of original grips is that they were individually fitted to each frame, and then the serial number was marked on the inside of one or both panels. You can buy modern but correct style replacements for about $30.00, but a collector won't be impressed. A shooter might not give a hoot.

If the revolver has been reblued and the stocks are incorrect replacements, most collectors wouldn't give it a second look. However if the bore and chambers are clean, it locks up tight, and the timing is spot on it is still a good revolver for someone who intends to use it the way it was made for. However in that case I would say it is overpriced by at least $100.

 

[owlhoot]

I just want to plug the gun. I have a PPS with 4" barrel, and it is just a terrific gun. It's small enough to easily carry. It's big enough so that recoil isn't an issue. It is made like a watch. And it is a pleasure to own, shoot, and carry. Chances are the gun you're interested in is a re-blue and that should give you some haggling room. If it is not a re-blue, go for it.

 

[Old Fuff]

To be sure the Old Fuff isn't misunderstood...

There is nothing wrong with a reblued gun as such, and if one intends to use it as owlhoot does it may even be a plus. He gave a pretty good number of reasons why one should consider a Police Positive Special as a user.

The only thing though is that one shouldn't pay inflated collector prices when the gun doesn't meet collector's pickky standards.

 

[Old Fuff]

Just for perspective, I notice a late-production Police Positive Special .38 / 4" on Gunbroker. It appears to be unfired, but the cylinder is ringed so it was dry-fired or handled. It has about 99% of its original blue finish. I don't think that most serious collectors would be interested, but if I was looking for a carry gun this could make a good choice.

Asking price is $400, with no bids so far. We shall follow it and see...

 

[BigBlock]

Hmmm...well, I guess I'll have to pass this one up, I don't think it is "collector grade", and I'd definately want it to be a shooter. It was a really great peice though, might be worth that much to someone for target shooting. It's amazing how light the little thing is even though it's just made with plain old steel.

 

[Old Fuff]

I don't know that I'd pass it up. Condsider making a cash, out-the-door offer of not more then $200 if the revolver has been reblued and the stocks are a mis-match from another model. Not a whole lot of folks are interested in older 4" .38 Specials these days. The only hot sales that are going on are for 2" snubbies. I don't think a pack of potential buyers are going to beat a path to the dealer's door.

In the meantime this is the other one I mentioned.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=118570375

 

[Storm]

I've been in a Colt mood lately and have jsut bought my first, a Colt Detective Special (the shrouded ejector version- 3rd version?). I actually had my choice between two of them. The clerk told me that they have never seen so many Colt revolvers show up for sale all at once. They have numerous Police Positives in the $350 to $450 range. Yours sounds like a decent price. I guess with the economy more guns are hitting the market as folks sell them off to raise needed cash, especially around Christmas. A month ago there was three or four, now there are five times as many.

I've got to say that my Colt is about the tightest gun that I've handled with a truly great trigger. I see a few more Colts in my future.

 

[bil]

How do you figure percentages on these old pistols? My .38 PP, 5", has some worn places, some tiny rust spots. Looks like it was carried on duty, maybe.
Thanks,
Bil
ps- Has the original checkered wood grips, with a silver Colt medallion. Has the initials(?) "D" on one grip and "S" on the other. Is this from the factory?

 

[Duke of Doubt]

Sshhh!

I've been getting into vintage Colt double action revolvers lately, mostly ones just a little bit older than the ones under discussion (Colt Army Special, Colt Officer's Model Target, etc.). Let me snap up some more before they get popular and pricey, please.

Bring on the ponies!

 

[Old Fuff]

Let me snap up some more before they get popular and pricey, please.

Ah.... No!

Not that the Old Fuff is greedy - but the fact is he wants them all....

It's an obsession...