.357 Full Power & Practice Ammo that Shoot to Same Point-of-Aim?

[DougB]

We're giving my father-in-law a new 6" .357 as a Father's Day/birthday gift. He is a relatively inexperienced shooter (his only other firearm is a CZ-75 9mm with .22 conversion kit). We'd like to get him some .38 Special practice ammo that is inexpensive, low recoiling, and reasonably accurate. We also want to give him some full-power .357 Magnum ammo. What ammo in each category might shoot closest to the same point of aim? (I'm hoping there's some combination like 125 grain .357 shoots close to 158 grain .38 round nose). Since I think most of the light practice .38 ammo uses 148-158 grain bullets, maybe I should be asking what magnum hollow point loads shoot closest to these (lighter or heavier bullets). This will be primarily a range/plinking gun, though I'm sure he'll want to try some magnums once in awhile just for fun.

Doug

 

[Marshall]

There's a loaded question. LOL

Good luck, I haven't really noticed a match. Though with a 6" barrel, it would surprise me if you noticed a whole lot a difference.

 

[ChristopherG]

Best bet to minimize difference in point of impact due to velocity is to keep the same bullet weight. There may be some difference, but less than you might anticipate. For instance, if you bought him a bunch of cheap 158 RNL from Zero and then some 158 Gold Dot HPs from Proload or CCI, they probably will be fairly close. The greater force of the magnums does cause the muzzle to rise faster, true; but the bullet also exits the barrel faster--and this balancing act of quicker flip vs. reduced dwell time seems to work pretty well across the board. So if you want 125 gr mags, look for 125 gr RNFP cowboy loads for practice. Etc.

 

[Jim March]

What Chris said. 148 practice 38s (target wadcutter) may be reasonably close to a 158 357 combat load, but in general run the same weight.

In terms of a defense load, a big healthy 6" barrel gun like that will perform REALLY well with Gold Dot 158 357s. Speer, Georgia Arms, Proload, Black Hills all load the same projectile at around the same fairly mellow speed, 1,250fps from a 4", a bit more in your 6".

If those are too hot to handle, scale back to any good 38+P; there's been a number of recent threads on this subject. Short form (all these are 38+P):

Winchester or Remington 158+P lead hollowpoints are good stuff;

Winchester's 130grain Supreme +P works;

Gold Dot 125+P as loaded by Speer, Georgia Arms, Proload, Black Hills is about on par with the Winnie 130;

Speer's new 135 Gold Dot +P is the replacement for the GD 125 and seems to be even better; only Speer has it in loaded ammo so far and it's *scarce* as heck;

Remington Golden Saber 125 +P - not sure I like these out of a 2" but a 6" will fling 'em out plenty fast enough.

Hornady XTP 125 +P - consider this a specialty load of sorts - it has a delayed expansion (brass jacket vs. copper) and doesn't go as "fat" as some of the others, but punches VERY deep. Good for cold-weather situations but only from a 4" or (pref.) 6" barrel; doesn't do well out of a 2". The whole XTP line is really a hunting load, not a defensive JHP series, but works in some limited circumstances.

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At present, those are the only loads I'd recommend in 38+P.

Bufallo Bore will soon be shipping wild-hot variants of the 158 lead hollowpoint +P (similar slug as Win/Remmie above but over 150fps faster, 1,000fps from a 2" barrel!) and a super-hot loading of the Gold Dot 125+P. When they ship, both will be VERY worthy of consideration, esp. that 158 - it beats ALL other 38+Ps for raw power, it's the blown nitrous-injected 500inch drag motor of the 38Spl world.

Cor-bon is shipping a new "uber-38", their 100grain Pow'R'Ball. While the idea of a round that "cannot possibly clog on clothes" is great, I'm concerned as to how light it is and want to see independent test data on it before I'd ever use such a thing. That said, the 45ACP 165grain Pow'R'Ball was a respectable performer in short-barreled 45s so...I ain't necessarily knocking it, I just want some data.

 

[christophera]

No offense but for I guy that doesn't shoot that often, is the half an inch difference really an issue? For a non-experienced shooter, they'd do a good job just hitting the target.

Plus, wouldn't a light .38 and heavy .357 shoot closer than ones of the same weight. They'd be closer, velocity wise.

 

[ChristopherG]

is the half an inch difference really an issue?

Well, it's not a half-inch; in some cases, it can be several inches or more even at comparatively short distances. How big a deal is it? Perhaps not that big; but the idea is to instill absolute confidence in the shooter that the bullet will go where the sights are aligned and pointed--so there's absolutely no hesitation in a critical situation, e.g., one where he/she is defending their life. Even for the much less critical situation of competition, I want to know for sure that my practice loads hit at my point of aim every time; no uncertainty, no hesitation when the stuff hits the thing--or when the buzzer signals the start of the stage.

wouldn't a light .38 and heavy .357 shoot closer than ones of the same weight. They'd be closer, velocity wise.

Nope--bullet weight influences it much more than velocity. That's why, on guns with fixed sights, you'd say they're 'regulated for 158 grain (or whatever grain) bullets' (rather than 'regulated for 800 fps'). Doesn't matter how fast it goes, if it weighs the same, it's gonna hit about the same place--see the explanation above.