.38+P vs. .44 Special

[BluesBear]

Someday I'll find an affordable early 696 with the firing pin on the hammer.

But until then my 2" Taurus 445 will do just fine.
In colder weather I often carry my 3" S&W 29-3.

 

[tbeb]

That's a good question, Mike. I'm no expert, but I do not prefer .44 special over +P .38 special. I do prefer .45 ACP over +P ,38 special. So, I'd say get a .45 ACP revolver with at least a 4" barrel. (I have 2 loaded handguns in my house. One is a .38 special revolver and the other is a .45 ACP semi-auto pistol.)

 

[Mike Kerr]

What a great thread. Thanks for posing the initial question, Mike. As I read your question you asked which was the best HOME DEFENSE round. Not what is the best round to carry in a snubby. We may be talking about very different rounds.

I agree with those who said the 44spl + P, in a large frame revolver. In fact I have a loading of 240 gr lead 44spl which I fire out of a Ruger Redhawk 5.5". It is pretty quick on follow up shots and is a very powerful round. I believe the so called 44spl + P out of a revolver which is strong enough to safely handle the round is a sleeping giant. ( Not an aluminum framed Bulldog). If market demand was high enough to encourage industry R&D I believe you could safely have 44spl loadings substantially higher than presently available in commercial loadings. The existing 44spl nominal factory loading of 746 fps for a 246 gr bullet is far less than you can obtain with a good handload.

Just think about it, Elmer Keith was pushing the 44spl to velocities way beyond anything you can find in loading manuals. I have been told he reportedly blew up a few guns along the way and as a matter of prudence I don't exceed published load levels; but I freely admit I load right up to the max loading with two or three powders. The 44 spl so loaded is a thumper. A real thumper, and it makes a big hole.

P.S. I realy like a 38spl + P for concealed carry in a snubby because I can control it even in very rapid fire. But my house guns are in 44 (the Redhawk) and a 45acp in a Para Ordnance P14.

Regards,





I

 

[MikeJ]

I really appreciate all of the responses but the bad thing is now I want another gun. I typically use my S&W 2 1/2" 66 or 3" Ruger GP100 loaded with 125 grain .38+P Gold Dots for home defense but now I am really starting to lean towards the 200 grain Gold Dot. I do have a 5 1/2" Redhawk available but the idea of a 3 or 4" S&W 629 is really appealing. I realize that either round will do the job if I do mine but it just seems as if the .44 might be a little more effective in a wider range of scenarios. Why can't we gun nuts just buy something and be happy with it?

 

[BluesBear]

Mike Kerr there really is no such thing as a .44 Special +P. I believe what you are referring to are simply near max loadings.

The heavy loads Elmer keith used were loaded in the old folded head or balloon head cases. Those loads will not physically fit into a modern drawn, solid head case.
Don't forget that the guns Elmer blew up were Colt Single Action Armys and S&W N-frames.

Some of the loads he put into .44 Special cases are still migty spicy in .44 Magnum brass!
I know that I woudn't dream of firing one of Elmer's big loads in my Taurus 445.

 

[Mike Kerr]

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BluesBear wrote:

" Mike Kerr there really is no such thing as a .44 Special +P. I believe what you are referring to are simply near max loadings"
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BluesBear you are 100% correct.



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BluesBear also wrote:

Some of the loads he put into .44 Special cases are still migty spicy in .44 Magnum brass!
I know that I woudn't dream of firing one of Elmer's big loads in my Taurus 445.
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Thank goodness, BluesBear. If you did I'm afraid we would have to remove some parts of that Taurus from you piece by piece. When I read the velocities he and others in that 44 loading group puportedly got, I realized that several of my 44mag loadings did not generate those velocities. When I read how he mixed powders I really became aware of how lucky some people are. I don't usually have that kind of luck in life :banghead: and I won't start trying now. However, between the polar extremes of anemic factory loads created over 75 years ago and Elmer Keith's ballistic rockets there is a great 44 spl load waiting on a ballistician to discover its secret.

 

[BluesBear]

I don't know if I "discovered" these or not but years ago I loaded the Hensley & Gibbs #237 200gr gas checked SWC to about 1000fps and the H&G #35 240gr SWC to about 900. My 4" Charter Arms Police Bulldog seemed to handle them well. I considered them to be about max for the Bulldog and wouldn't hesitate to fire them in my Taurus. I'll have to dig around and see if I can find the exact load I used.

I had been looking for a H&G #245 mould since it is exactly the same as the .45 caliber H&G #68 only in a .429 size. I stumbled across the #237 and since it had an actual crimp groove I went with it and was never sorry.
I used it on a feral dog hunt in Georgia in 1981 and they performed very well from a 5½" Colt New Frontier.


Speaking of good .44 Special loadings, has anyone heard any more about the Black Hills 250 gr load that was to marketed specially for the S&W Thunder Ranch Model 24? Supposedly the sights on the S&W are regulated to POA with this ammo. I keep checking the Black Hills website but have never seen another word about it.

Since the guns are abundant where is the ammo? Inquiring minds want to know!