.45 ACP Primer Size

[TheDomFather]

Before anyone flames me, I have read about 5 million threads about the differences between .45 SPP and LPP cases, and about 2 million of them were here on THR.

I am just getting into reloading .45 ACP after loading only 9mm and rifle rounds for a long time. I just got a brand new 1911, and have decided that I might actually start shooting enough .45 ACP to warrant reloading for it.

I have been collecting .45 brass for a while, but not really pursuing it actively, and I have may 500-100 cases collected that are most likely a mix of SPP and LPP.

To break in my new gun, I bought 1,000 rounds of factory ammo, 500 with SPP (CCI Blazer Brass) and 500 with LPP (S&B). After these 1,000 are gone, I will be reloading from then on (at least, that is my plan).

My original plan was to stick to LPP, but I am now starting to rethink that plan. I load an absolute boatload of 9mm each month (Dillon XL650), and I have a large amount of SPP on hand to draw from.

However, I do prime offline (I know, go ahead... flame me) on an RCBS APS bench priming system. I think it is much more reliable and safer than the Dillon tube system, and I can honestly whip through the cases pretty quickly, it is worth the extra effort... FOR ME. (YMMV)

Someday however, I might finally give in and just start priming on the press, and then it would be advantageous to just stick with SPP for both 9mm and .45 ACP.


To my question... (finally!)...

If you were just starting out to reload .45, would you load SPP, LPP, or segregate and load both?

It probably makes sense to make the ultimate decision now before I get into it too deeply.

A lot of the threads I have read say that the manufacturing trend is moving towards SPP, so maybe it makes sense in the long run to just standardize on SPP myself.

Maybe I will just start out with SPP, and continue to save the LPP cases in case I change my mind, or use it for trade fodder to swap the LPP for more SPP cases.

I did read somewhere here on THR that the LPP rounds seem to generate a few more FPS than SPP rounds (15-25 fps I think I remember reading). This is probably not a big deal to me, I am not sure how much competitive shooting I will be doing with the 1911 vs. all my 9mm guns, but it may rear its ugly head sometime in the future.

I just ordered some RMR 230 gr. FMJ RN and some SNS 200 Gr. SWC bullets. I have a lot of W231/HP-38 that I no longer use in my 9mm rounds, so I will probably start there, but I also have a bit of Power Pistol and a TON of TiteGroup that I might try. I also will probably pick up a lb. each of Bullseye and AA#2 just to try out.

Thanks for any input...

I am in the same boat as you are my friend and I prime off press on a Lee benchtop primer and it works frigging great. I will no longer prime on press as I find mine to be A: unreliable and B: pain in the ass to switch from large to small and back and I load mostly .45 ACP and 9mm so taking it off press is the right decision from me. I have about 1000 cases of LPP brass, once those are worn out I will switch exclusively to SPP, yes there is a slight difference in velocity but its very slight and I dont load to maximum anyway. I try to religiously stay .2 grains under maximum load as I know my powder measure in my hornady LNL will sometimes throw .1 or .2 grains over and have no need to shoot max velocity for target ammo or even in a competition. Also having to have only SPP on hand is better than having to have both. All this being said brass seems to last me for a long while. I am shooting my 9mm brass 10 - 15 times before the brass is no good anymore, Havent gotten that far with .45 yet but once all the LPP brass is gone it will be SPP only.

 

[TheDomFather]

I've been following the "Small vs. Large Primed 45 ACP" broohaha for several years and while I don't run across them the only thing I see "wrong" with small primed 45 ACP brass is a lack of inspection by progressive press owners (they were first used in "Green ammo" attempts). Seems there are reloaders that just dump cases into their auto reloaders without looking at them and then, of course, the small primed case jams up the press when an attempt to insert a large primer occurs...

I only needed to learn this lesson once, now the second I come back from the range I dump all of my pickups and sort them by caliber and then I sort the .45 ACP into two seperate bins LPP and SPP I toss any military crimp .45 ACP as well

 

[Toprudder]

I only needed to learn this lesson once, now the second I come back from the range I dump all of my pickups and sort them by caliber and then I sort the .45 ACP into two seperate bins LPP and SPP I toss any military crimp .45 ACP as well

I mark the bottom of all my loads with a sharpie. That way, when I come back from the range, I sort the brass and I know that my brass is all one type (usually SPP) and goes back into its own bin. The range pickup, I sort LPP and SPP while I am decapping them (I wet tumble).

 

[TheDomFather]

I mark the bottom of all my loads with a sharpie. That way, when I come back from the range, I sort the brass and I know that my brass is all one type (usually SPP) and goes back into its own bin. The range pickup, I sort LPP and SPP while I am decapping them (I wet tumble).

Great minds think alike, I use a Lee universal decapping die, pop out the spent primers then wet tumble so I get clean cases inside and out as well as clean primer pockets!

 

[Bad Dog 1973]

Posting on an older thread here, but thought I'd chime in as I too am a fairly new reloader. I also purchased a case of blazer ammo for the 45 this spring. I'm shooting the FNX TACTICAL. First off, I've found that this pistol will eat just about anything and shoots it pretty well. Most likely more capable than me. I've reloaded the SPP blazer brass several times, as well as LPP from Win, Fed, and Rem. I don't own a chrono yet, and stick closely to new load data from several sources. I've used Power Pistol, CFE, and about to load with Accurate. I've used Hornady, lead cast, Rainer H.P., and RMR. I've had some trouble with some plated bullets, but NEVER had any trouble with RMR. I've stuck to 230g bullets so far. I find that the bullets from RMR are just as accurate as the BIG BOYS BRANDS. They are truly a pleasure to load, and in my experience, very consistent. Their customer service is second to none. Truly a pleasure to do business with. Having said all that, I haven't found them making any HP for 45 yet. I'll continue to use their RNP for the range, for as long as they make em. As for the differences in primers for my loads, I haven't found much difference in performance at the range. Good luck, and stay safe!

 

[Carl N. Brown]

All I can say to the OP is: stay consistent with what works for you.

My situation may be a little different.

I have three .45ACP firearms.
Two strike basically centered (my cut .455 Webley Mark IV and a Numrich AO Thompson TM1 carbine) and work well with small pistol primer (SPP) .45ACP casings.
One strikes slightly off center (my Numrich AO .45 M1911A1 clone) and I prefer to use large pistol primer (LPP) casings only.

I have to handload for the Webley but keep within .455 Webley spex; I have decided not to use any factory .45ACP in it.
I have handloaded for the 1911A1 clone within .45ACP spex, but prefer factory loads.
During the drought, I bought .45 ACP SPP for use in the TM1, but won't use reloads.

Basically now any .45ACP SPP I shoot or find, I put in the box for the metal recycler; I keep .45ACP LPP for reloading because it works with all three guns. That's just my problem though.

 

[LiveLife]

brand new 1911 ... To break in my new gun, I bought 1,000 rounds of factory ammo, 500 with SPP (CCI Blazer Brass) and 500 with LPP (S&B). After these 1,000 are gone, I will be reloading from then on (at least, that is my plan).

My original plan was to stick to LPP, but I am now starting to rethink that plan. I load an absolute boatload of 9mm each month (Dillon XL650), and I have a large amount of SPP on hand to draw from.

If you were just starting out to reload .45, would you load SPP, LPP, or segregate and load both?

It probably makes sense to make the ultimate decision now before I get into it too deeply.

I did read somewhere here on THR that the LPP rounds seem to generate a few more FPS than SPP rounds (15-25 fps I think I remember reading).

Since you now reload, no worries.

Why?

It is true that LP primers produce larger flash size and duration than SP primers (Winchester LP primers produce even larger flash hence they could be used for standard and magnum loads). So if you were loading for full power loads with slower burning powders, I would use LP primers.

But most of us don't use full power reloads in our 1911s. Ask bullseye match shooters and they will show you their lighter target loads using faster powders that are very accurate. So if you are not reloading full power loads, smaller flash size and duration of SP primers are fine for developing accurate target loads.

I just ordered some RMR 230 gr. FMJ RN and some SNS 200 Gr. SWC bullets. I have a lot of W231/HP-38 that I no longer use in my 9mm rounds, so I will probably start there

230 gr FMJ and 200 gr Lead SWC and W231/HP-38 are great combinations, almost like bread and butter.

While I like 5.3 gr of W231/HP-38 with 230 gr FMJ and 4.8-5.0 gr for 200 gr SWC, I also like lighter recoil 200 gr SWC with 4.0 gr of Red Dot/Promo. All of these loads do fine with SP brass.

And that's the beauty/joy of reloading, as we can tailor the loads for our pistols whether SP or LP. And shooting lighter target loads that are very accurate not only reduces the wear and tear on your pistols but easier on your wrists so you can write without issues the next day.

 

[Doublehelix]

Thanks bds. A lot of water has passed under the bridge since I first posted this.

I worked out a few loads using HP-38, but I got distracted with a lot of USPSA shooting this season, and I am just about ready to get back to .45 load development. I have a couple of different loads that seem to work well for me from an accuracy perspective with 230 gr RN and HP-38: 4.7 gr and 5.3 gr. But like you, I favor the 5.3 gr. loads overall.

I am finding both LPP and SPP brass at my range, but it is mostly LPP, so I am focusing on that for now and keeping the SPP separate and will most likely use it in some capacity.

I am not going to be loading full power loads as far as I know at this point, but I feel pretty good about sticking with the LPP for now.

I have HP-38, Bullseye, TiteGroup and AA#2 ready to work up some loads, so we will see where this journey takes me in the next few weeks.

 

[LiveLife]

I have HP-38, Bullseye, TiteGroup and AA#2 ready to work up some loads

Those are great choice of powders for lighter target loads.


Another side benefit of SP 45ACP brass is igniting harder cup SP primers. During the shortage, particular lot of Tula SP primers was determined to have harder cups which caused occasional failure to fire but using SP 45ACP brass in 1911/M&P45/PT145 fired them all regardless of headstamp - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ts-your-experience.630512/page-5#post-7840156

When life gives you lemons, you make lemonade.

 

[weeniewawa]

my thoughts on the size issue is maybe even the manufacturers had a hard time getting components during the "bad times" and switched to only one size as most of the highly demanded ammo besides 22LR, was semi auto pistol and .223, all of which use the small size. They may even use the same exact primers in each as we don't even know exactly what powders they load with.

I switched to the SPP just to mainly use one size of pistol primers I use in my 1050 as it is faster to switch calibers as that is just one less thing to switch and after I got the Dillon primer system working, it has been perfect but before that ggrrrr.