45 acp reload issue

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Charley345

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The attached picture shows two reloads that the bullet moved out while in the magazine when firing previous rounds. They were long enough that the slide did not go fully forward to lock up. Out of three mags this happened two times. Once on the second round of the mag, once on the third round of the mag. All other rounds fired normally. I still have about 200 rounds of these left.
Can I add a tiny amount of crimp to hold these tighter? They measure .471 to .4715 diameter now. Shooting from HK45c, no limp wristing going on here.
 

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Long is safer to shoot then being set back. Run them through the seater die to correct the long length. Now you need to fix the problem. You do not have enough neck tension. Measure your new bullets and see what size they are, then pull one and measure it, they should be the same. If the same you need to turn down the expander to gain neck tension. If your using a LFCD, loose it or remove the sizing ring from the base. If these are RP brass they tend to be softer and thinner than the others. So a reduction in the expander will be needed or save them for Lead which is sized larger.
 
Various brass headstamps will result in less than optimal neck tension due to different wall thicknesses. I had this problem with Hornady and RCBS dies, reloading for USPSA major. I went to an EGW-U die (crimp at .469-.470) and never had that problem again.
 
Is that a groove in the bullet design or was the bullet damaged from crimping? your crimp on the middle two rounds looks just right with none of the case digging into the bullet.
 
That grove, more of a line, on the outside two rounds is where the case mouth was crimped to before the bullet moved.

Hoping that I can run the remaining 200 rounds through the crimp die only. They are all winchester brass on second or third reload.

Chuck
 
are you using a factory crimp die? In your picture, your crimp looks right, but that line on the bullet indicates you are in some way crimping and damaging the bullet leading to poor neck tension
 
I am reloading on a Lee Classic Turret press with four stations. Seating the bullet on station tree then run it through the Lee factory crimp die on station four. So should I be crimping slightly on station three while seating the bullet? Then skip the factory crimp die?
 
I would increase the crimp myself. It's not going to adversely affect you, but that's just me.
 
I would increase the crimp myself. It's not going to adversely affect you, but that's just me.
Click to expand...

A proper taper crimp does little more than iron out the bell and press the case lightly into the side of the bullet.

Increasing the amount of crimp on a case that headspaces on the mouth doesn't do a lot as far as gripping the bullet tighter, but a little too much can cause the case mouth to get past the chamber shoulder and into the throat...which can be an issue with headspace and pressure.

Measure. My money is on undersized bullets.
 
Undersized bullets or inadequate neck tension is my guess.

Try a couple without using the expander. If they are OK, the expander is too big. If not, the sizer is too big.

More "crimp" is not the answer. All you need is enough to remove the bell or a hair more. I adjust my crimp die so that all the belling is removed on the shortest cases, which ends up with a bit of inward "crimp" on the longest ones.

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You could also be using TOO MUCH crimp pressure. The brass is more springy than the soft copper jacket and lead core. Too much crimp could be swaging the bullet down too much then letting the case spring back out and thus you're reducing the neck tension too much.

I'd start by pulling apart those rounds that crept out with an inertia puller and measure the diameter of the bullet ahead of the crimp and behind it. Compare to new bullets. I'll bet you an e-beer that they are smaller in the crimp area and tapering to the base by a couple of thou and that's why they are creeping.
 
I use the FCD in .45 and 9mm with no problems with cast lead bullets, However if you crank it down to much you end up resizing the bullet.
Measure a bullet, then run one thru the seater and pull it, measure it.
Then run one thru it and the FCD and measure it If the FCD is sizing the bullet smaller that may be your problem. Back off the FCD or skip useing it. I happen to like it.
I adjust my seater to do no crimp and the FCD to apply a light taper crimp.
It is easier for me to seperate the two steps since I own the FCD.
IMO the bad rap the FCD gets is due to improper use / adjustment.
 
It's funny how so many of these threads about crimp issues seem to involve a Lee FCD.
Click to expand...

I don't know what the others are like but the Lee FCD is a pretty simple bit of kit. It works just fine. But it has no stop of any sort so if folks feel that they have to have an easily seen crimp then it's crimping too much. It's not the die, it's the poor judgement of the user until they know how little it takes and the fact that a proper taper crimp is not visible to the eye.

No amount of backing off the FCD will stop it from sizing down bullets. That happens when it enters the die at the carbide sizer
Click to expand...

Say what? Are you suggesting that the first sizing die is forming the neck down too far and that swages the bullets to be too small due to neck tension? I'm not sure I'd buy that one. Or are you referring to something else?
 
After reading the article about reloading 45acp that mikemyers linked to in another post (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=775769) it was clear that I had not over crimped. In fact I just needed to crimp them a little bit more and they worked flawlessly. They may have been slightly undersized bullets because I have not had problems before this with crimping to .471. As I did not have any more of those that were not already loaded I am unable to measure.

I have been using Lee Factory Crimp dies for two years in 45acp, 9mm & .40 and have not had any problems with them at all.

Thanks for all the replies
Chuck
 
9mm is a tapered case, so unless the bases gets sized by the die to the same size as the case mouth, backing off the die will work. At least in my experience.
From Lyman 49
9mm base .391, mouth .380

Just measured a couple of 9mm run thru my FCD.
Base .388 - .389 mouths .378 - .379
The ring at the base of my 9mm FCD appears to be .385-.386 so it is bigger than the case mouth.

Even .45 APC with is a "Straight" wall case has a tiny bit of taper.
Just my opinion.

People tend to like the FCD or hate it, I happen to like it.
To each his own.
 
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BCRider said:
You could also be using TOO MUCH crimp pressure. The brass is more springy than the soft copper jacket and lead core. Too much crimp could be swaging the bullet down too much then letting the case spring back out and thus you're reducing the neck tension too much.

I'd start by pulling apart those rounds that crept out with an inertia puller and measure the diameter of the bullet ahead of the crimp and behind it. Compare to new bullets. I'll bet you an e-beer that they are smaller in the crimp area and tapering to the base by a couple of thou and that's why they are creeping.
Click to expand...
+1

too much crimp causes the brass to spring back, leaving the bullet deformed around the crimp ring

you need 1/8th turn worth of crimp on your seating die

if you set the dies up properly, you don't need a FCD

http://www.ysterhout.net/docs/crimp_setup/index.html
 
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