.45LC or .45-70 Lever Gun - Can't Decide!

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ShunZu

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I'm going back and forth for the last couple months trying to make a decision. Maybe someone here can help me decide which way to go. Here's what I know for sure:

1. I want an old-style lever gun in .45LC or .45-70. Must have octagon barrel, case hardened receiver preferrably, at least 22" barrel (26 preferred), authentic Winchester looks and handling. It must be very nice to look at, but it's going to be used, too. I have very few gun safe queens.

2. Hartford, Cimmaron, Marlin, Uberti. Who am I leaving out? I've disqualified each of the above for one reason or other: Hartford - no .45-70 available. Cimmaron - a bit pricey and I know virtually nothing about them. Marlin - No case hardening and looks too new, even the cowboy model (although the cowboy has most of the other characteristics I'm looking for). Uberti - Way proud of their pieces price-wise imho.

Advantages of .45LC -- I have Vaqueros and there's something neat & nostalgic carrying the same cartridge for rifle as handgun, but I sold my horse & saddle 20 years ago. :) But I -DO- have the John Wayne 100 year Commemorative and this rifle is intended to be its compliment.

Advantages of .45-70 -- Since I sold my old Trapdoor, I don't have one in the safe. And it would be nice to dust off the reloading dies and start dialing in some nice loads again.

I'm not going to hunt with the piece... just some occasional target work and maybe a visit or two to some local cowboy action matches this coming Spring and Summer. And perhaps a scabbard if I get another horse.:D

Interested in hearing your opinions and thoughts. Thanks.
 
I know of no .45-70 repeaters except the Marlin and some Miroku-Browning-Winchester 1886 repros that might still be in the system. The 1876 replicas coming out of Italy now are NOT available in .45-70 and .45-75 is NOT the same thing. Rifle calibers are NOT allowed for CAS main match guns, they are limited to side matches. I squandered a lot of money on nice side match guns that are seldom shot.

On the other hand, I don't consider a .45 Colt rifle to be much for "target work" outside the short ranges of CAS.
 
I love my Puma '92! I have one in .454 and while it is picky about what .45 Colt loads it will feed(they have to be long) it will feed some. I don't know if they make an octagon bbl, but I've never looked.
 
If you plan to do allot of hunting a reproduction 1886 Winchester/Browning would be worth looking for they can still be found on the different gun auction sites.

If SASS or plinking is the order of the day then a copy of the 1892 Winchester is hard to beat its smoother and stronger than the 1873 action and more rugged if a hot handload shot ever find its way through your rifle.

Both use the same breech locking mechanism one is scaled up for the larger cartridges.

Best of luck if all else fails get both over time.:D
 
Historically speaking....

They originally did not chamber 45 Colt in model 73s or 92s because the rim was rather small and the straight sided case made black powder residue blow back along the case walls and foul the chamber faster than it should have. So the 45 Colt was not reliable in lever guns as an ORIGINAL chambering.

Modern 45 Colt brass is produced in a different method and the extractor groove is deeepr.


As for price:

A lever gun takes some nice machining and fitting to work right. And to work smoothly.
You may save a couple hundred bucks , only to spend that much to get the gun to cycle correctly. I had a really pretty 45 Colt Rossi M-92 clone with a half round /half octagon barrel (24 inch) that was rerally sharp to look at. But I had to spend a bunch of time working on the action.

Most of the Clone M-92s and 73s are all made in the same place (Uberti). They often have other brand names on them as they are contract guns for outfits like Cimmaron.
If you want to shoot hot loads, you need to use a M-92 (1892) style action. The 73 actions are not strong enough to push.

The 1892 action was (is) a scaled down 1886 action (45-70 size)

Your choice seems to have come down to a pistol cartridge or a large game hunting cartridge. That's a pretty big split.

Check out the for sale section of the SASS site. (Single Action Shooting Society)
 
Not Oct. Barrel But...

I bought a Marlin 1895 XLR in 45/70 and when you shoot it you know it's there, but it's a real pussycat! Great gun and incredibly accurate. Again I'm just giving you a recommendation in 45/70. Easily available in the 500 dollar range.
 
I've got an 1895 Cowboy so that's what my vote is for. You're right that it does look "too new" but mine has nice checkering on the stock and forearm and is a hoot to shoot. There's just something cool about sliding those long shells in through the loading gate and then shucking them out as you hear the slugs "thwack" into the berm. I think it's one of my favorite guns to shoot just for fun.

That being said I really want an 1892 in .45 LC as well. :)

My dream gun is one of those browning 1886's . .but I haven't found one in my budget yet.

Have a good one,
Dave
 
I would have to pick the 1895 in 45-70 and I have.

But you have the Vaqueros which makes it interesting.

On another note, Browning chambers the BLR in 450 marlin
 
Find the '92 replica of your choice in 45LC. The action is strong enough that with a little load work you can resize 405gr LFN to .452 and work up a load that will duplicate the classic 45-70 load (405 @ 1200fps) and have the best of both worlds!
 
Marlin 1894 Cowboy can make your decision easier.

Buffalo Bore has some really hot .45LC loads, if you want it for hunting, but it will still shoot low-recoil cowboy colt loads as well. The Marlin can take the extra pressure and pounding, no problem. It's a solid top receiver, solidly built.

.45-70 is a PITA to reload, at least if you want accurate and/or hunting power loads. I've been doing it lately. I like it, but I hate it, too.:) For a single-shot, it can be fun to do. With a lever gun, though, I like to shoot more than 25 rounds when I shoot it, and while the Marlin is a good deal easier to clean than a Winchester, BP fouling still gets into nooks and crannies. Sharps look nice with octagon barrels, too, and they're a real snap to clean, even when full of BP fouling

The 1894 Cowboy is a good saddle gun; the 1895 Cowboy is a bit long and heavy, I think. I still like it...

I understand the octagon levergun lust. I just found a rare 39M with an octagon barrel, and felt compelled to buy it. Couldn't help myself.
 
The Boise Cabelas currently has a Nice Winchester 1894 (year of mfr not model) Oct Barrel 45-70 lever action in there Gun Library (Near Mint Condition) but the price would bankrupt most here ($10,000.00)

I've been looking at the Marlin 1895 Cowboy myself, so-far by my standards it's the most comfortable feel and has the smoothest action of all of the sub $1800 Lever Guns (strangely I'm most Comfortable with the heaver ones)

BTW: The Marlin 1895 Cowboy goes for these prices.
$699 @ Cabelas
$629 @ Sportsmans

Havn't bought one yet but was planing to get one for this year's elk season, unfortunately my hours at work got nuked so I can't afford either the rifle or the elk permit this year... :(

FYI My Ideal Hunting gun though would be a Browning BAR in .300 Win or .308 with a Leupold or Ziess scope, but that kind of gun will have to wait a year or 2.
 
are you only going to use it in CAS matches or is it a real life working gun?

The browning copies of the 1886 are pretty good guns and can be found for about a grand. There are a fair number of decent used wichesters that can be found in that price range that are the real deal, and that is far more cool than a fancy looking package from Italy.
 
1894 Marlin case hardened receiver

The only Marlin 1894 that I'm familiar with that has the color case hardened receiver was the Centennial model with the 26" Octogan barrel in 45 Colt and 44 WCF. I have one of each in the safe unfired new in the box. They were pricey new 14 yrs ago compared to the blued models.
 
Wow . . . .you made my day!

BTW: The Marlin 1895 Cowboy goes for these prices.
$699 @ Cabelas
$629 @ Sportsmans
Click to expand...

I picked mine up about a year ago at Gander Mountain for $550. I don't know if they still have them or if they're anywhere near that price but now I feel better. :)

Have a good one,
Dave
 
I have Marlin Cowboys in both calibers. They are among my favorite rifles. No case color receivers but I like the aesthetics.

1894 CB, 20" barrel adds 200-300 fps using the same loads as my Vaqueros. It cycles everything very well including over length Keith style SWC. Even 1.500" cartridges feed flawlessly and single loading is as easy as dropping one in the ejection port, no alignment required and closing the lever. Accuracy is very good with most loadings 250g up to 325g. I haven't played around much with lighter bullets but early tests were less promising than heavier loads. I like it so much I hunt Deer with it using 320gr RNFP GC bullets over IMR 4227 or 2400.

The 1895 CB is beautiful, accurate and a pleasure to shoot. I have no complaints with it either. Adds 100-300 fps compaired to my shorter barreled 1895GS Guide Gun.
 
Pete, it's going to be used for CAS -if- I can find a local event this coming Summer. It'll also be a working gun on those dangerous paper targets and an occasional coyote that trots through my timber. Nothing wrong with overkill. :)

Hey, thanks for all the advice guys. How I ever survived reloading for over 30 years and built a modest collection without THR, I'll never know.
 
Again, if for CAS main match use, it must be in a revolver caliber. A .45-70 would only be allowed in side matches which are short and not always offered. Not a good investment.

I think the Marlin 1894 Cowboy would be your best bet, even though not available with blotchy case colors. The 1873 repros from Italy are prettier but they are not as strong and cost more. The 1892 repros do not look as good in person as they do in advertising.
 
I'm leaning towards the .45LC for 3 reasons. CAS, convenience of going to the range with only 1 caliber for both pistol and rifle... AND because my wife, who is a learning shotgun (card/target) shooter will want to shoot it. She enjoyed shooting my Vaquero so much that it's now being referred to as "hers". :)

Maybe if my old '03 brings enough in the auction, I'll be able to swing the $$ for something else in .45-70. Thanks for all the advice guys, keep it coming and it IS appreciated.
 
I recently bought a rifle to use in Cowboy matches that I think you should consider. It's a Puma 92 with a 24 inch octagon barrel with brass receiver and buttplate. It's a good looking rifle and is very accurate at 50 yards (the only distance I've shot it at so far). With relatively light loaded .45s, there is almost no recoil.
 
'92 copy +1
I have a older rossi 92 in 45colt with 24" 1/2 round 1/2 oct its a thing of beauty and shoots great also.
 
Puma looks like a very nice piece. Made by Rossi? There's a beaut on gunbroker.com with lots of engraving, but way too rich for what I want to spend -- $1400. If you don't mind me asking, what does the 24" barrel, case hardened receiver in .45LC cost? Thanks
 
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