45LC vs. 30-06 for Bear
- Thread starter ericm275
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rcmodel
Member in memoriam
I don't know if California allows 8-shot semi-autos for bear hunting.
Many states have 5-shot restrictions on semi-autos, and Kali being so Enlightened, Smarter, and a Leader in reasonable gun laws, I would think they might too.
Have you checked the fish & game rulebook on bear hunting?
Anyway, the .45 Colt would do fine for bear if you use the proper full-power hunting ammo.
Just don't shoot a bear with a 700 FPS Cowboy Action load, or he might get get really PO'd and eat you.
rcmodel
Many states have 5-shot restrictions on semi-autos, and Kali being so Enlightened, Smarter, and a Leader in reasonable gun laws, I would think they might too.
Have you checked the fish & game rulebook on bear hunting?
Anyway, the .45 Colt would do fine for bear if you use the proper full-power hunting ammo.
Just don't shoot a bear with a 700 FPS Cowboy Action load, or he might get get really PO'd and eat you.
rcmodel
1KPerDay
Member
I'd use the highest-power round available, personally. If they don't allow 8-shot clips you can get a 4- or 5-round clip IIRC.
MCgunner
Member
.45 colt buffalo bores or equivalent handloads will work fine. Black bear are easy enough to kill. Folks hunt 'em with .357 magnum revolvers, after all.
koja48
member
The difference is between "will work" and "will work better." If the Garand is legal in CA, I'd opt for the Garand, were it me. Some bears can be difficult to dispatch (personal experience speaking); they can also hurt you. Before that, you owe the critter the most efficient & swiftest demise possible.
22-rimfire
Member
I'd use the one that was biggest and legal.
Harve Curry
Member
I already did the 45 Colt in a 1873 Winchester on a 300+ pound black bear. Mine was an original relined to 45 Colt, 20" barrel, 225 grain SWC cast bullets at about 1000 fps MV.
I did not intend to hunt bear and was invited, all I had was this project 1873 short rifle and the ammo mentioned. The day before I'd sighted it in and new exactly where it was hitting from close up to 50 yards. This bear had killed 3 calves and was chasing livestock including horses, so a predator permit was issued. After a week of tracking and chasing him we took a day off. I rode that day anyhow and crossed fresh bear tracks in wet sand a mile south of my house. The hinds were 9" long X 4.5" wide. The fronts were 5" wide. Next day we met with hounds and horses and went to the spot just south of town. The dogs took off before we hit it and up the mountain they went. My horse was wore out so I decided to travel down the creek and meet up later. Well I heard the dogs and rode to them. I dismounted and walked to one of two dogs that were barking at the ground. I failed to look up a few yards ahead. The bear was waiting for me in a tree about 6 feet up, head downwards and a front leg ready to swat me.
I retreived my rifle from the scabbard and kept a deadfall tree between me and the bear. At about 50 feet I put a bullet into the base of his neck angling into the vitals. The bear disregarded that and turned on the tree so easy to go up, but when he did I shot another into his armpit, and still no reaction. I thought this bear was going to get away because I didn't have enough gun and we'd be after a wounded bear. Now he was on a long limb that was against a hill and I figured he was getting away. I shot at the right rear hip, thats all I could see. He fell with a thud. I chabered another round and got to a point where I couold see and he was dead. But the first 2 bullets had taken awhile to kill him. Maybe 45 seconds but it seemed like forever.
So the short answer is I'd use a 45 Colt if the ammo was faster, heavier bullet then what I had or use the M1 30-06 with the 5 round hunting enbloc clips.
I did not intend to hunt bear and was invited, all I had was this project 1873 short rifle and the ammo mentioned. The day before I'd sighted it in and new exactly where it was hitting from close up to 50 yards. This bear had killed 3 calves and was chasing livestock including horses, so a predator permit was issued. After a week of tracking and chasing him we took a day off. I rode that day anyhow and crossed fresh bear tracks in wet sand a mile south of my house. The hinds were 9" long X 4.5" wide. The fronts were 5" wide. Next day we met with hounds and horses and went to the spot just south of town. The dogs took off before we hit it and up the mountain they went. My horse was wore out so I decided to travel down the creek and meet up later. Well I heard the dogs and rode to them. I dismounted and walked to one of two dogs that were barking at the ground. I failed to look up a few yards ahead. The bear was waiting for me in a tree about 6 feet up, head downwards and a front leg ready to swat me.
I retreived my rifle from the scabbard and kept a deadfall tree between me and the bear. At about 50 feet I put a bullet into the base of his neck angling into the vitals. The bear disregarded that and turned on the tree so easy to go up, but when he did I shot another into his armpit, and still no reaction. I thought this bear was going to get away because I didn't have enough gun and we'd be after a wounded bear. Now he was on a long limb that was against a hill and I figured he was getting away. I shot at the right rear hip, thats all I could see. He fell with a thud. I chabered another round and got to a point where I couold see and he was dead. But the first 2 bullets had taken awhile to kill him. Maybe 45 seconds but it seemed like forever.
So the short answer is I'd use a 45 Colt if the ammo was faster, heavier bullet then what I had or use the M1 30-06 with the 5 round hunting enbloc clips.
achildofthesky
Member
Superior firepower aside, hunting with a Garand, if legal in Ca., is simply a pretty cool idea for me. As much as I like lever guns I'd take the Garand any day if it was my hunt. Enjoy the hunt and post pix.
Be safe
Patty
Be safe
Patty
hmmm
Can the Urberti shoot the Corbon .45 colt loads? If so, then I would say that would be a honey of a bear rifle. If not, I would still be inclined to think it would work well.
The .30-06 is a fine round for black bear as well, but the Garand isn't my favorite delivery system for it. It is heavy and unweildy when compared with a carbine.
My take, use the .45 colt. First find out if it can shoot the Corbon and other hot loads. If not, then get a large hollowpoint backed up by a hard cast (federal hard cast) load. Practice shot placement and shooting two rounds in quick order.
Edit:
Corbon - DPX 1200 FPS / 720FT LBS
vs.
Winchester - 255 RN 820FPS / FT lbs 380
Ballistics coming from a carbine will be better, but there you go.
If you go with the carbine carry a sidearm.
Can the Urberti shoot the Corbon .45 colt loads? If so, then I would say that would be a honey of a bear rifle. If not, I would still be inclined to think it would work well.
The .30-06 is a fine round for black bear as well, but the Garand isn't my favorite delivery system for it. It is heavy and unweildy when compared with a carbine.
My take, use the .45 colt. First find out if it can shoot the Corbon and other hot loads. If not, then get a large hollowpoint backed up by a hard cast (federal hard cast) load. Practice shot placement and shooting two rounds in quick order.
Edit:
Corbon - DPX 1200 FPS / 720FT LBS
vs.
Winchester - 255 RN 820FPS / FT lbs 380
Ballistics coming from a carbine will be better, but there you go.
If you go with the carbine carry a sidearm.
MCgunner
Member
We got over 1400 fps/1300 ft lbs from a 300 grain Hornady XTP from my son-in-law's Rossi M92. It clocks 1200 fps out of my TC's 7" barrel for 1000 ft lbs and about 1125 fps/840 ft lbs (or somewhere close) from my 4 5/8" Ruger Blackhawk. It's loaded with 20.0 grains of 2400, will do anything a 44 magnum will do.
Exactly.
Personally, I'd load my .308 M7 Remington with 140 Barnes X at 2850 fps for the hunt and live happy.
Exactly.
Personally, I'd load my .308 M7 Remington with 140 Barnes X at 2850 fps for the hunt and live happy.
California has no restrictions on hunting rifles, other than requiring centerfires for certain game. There's a handgun barrel length minimum for Black Bear, but I believe it's 4".
If you can legally use a centerfire rifle, you can use any centerfire you want. 8 rounds is fine.
Owning certain rifles or configurations is a different issue.
If you can legally use a centerfire rifle, you can use any centerfire you want. 8 rounds is fine.
Owning certain rifles or configurations is a different issue.
huntershooter
Member
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The Uberti should NOT fire +P loads-i.e. "Corbon", etc.
Harve Curry
Member
Anyone know what the SAAMI spec's or Italian Proof is of a modern made Winchester 1873 copy??
Trade the Uberti in for the a M92... That way you can shoot the 45 +p type (Corbon) ammo...
If that doesn't work, I know that Henry's Big Boy, in .44 mag, would do a fine job.
Good luck.
I drink to that... Depending on the terrain / cover and what not, I would be sorely tempted to take my 30-30.
If that doesn't work, I know that Henry's Big Boy, in .44 mag, would do a fine job.
Good luck.
MCGunner said:
I drink to that... Depending on the terrain / cover and what not, I would be sorely tempted to take my 30-30.
Harve Curry
Member
I know that EUROARMS imported a 1873 Winchester copy in 44 Remington Magnum. I've not heard of one blowing up.
A 1873 Win copy in 44 magnum is pretty high pressure, then one could determine that a +P45 in a 45 Colt or a +P44spl in a 44 special chambered copy would be within the operating range/pressure limits of a modern copy.
So the question remains what is the pressure or proof of the Italian copies rated at with modern steel?
I posted this question on the RIFLE section but no replies yet.
A 1873 Win copy in 44 magnum is pretty high pressure, then one could determine that a +P45 in a 45 Colt or a +P44spl in a 44 special chambered copy would be within the operating range/pressure limits of a modern copy.
So the question remains what is the pressure or proof of the Italian copies rated at with modern steel?
I posted this question on the RIFLE section but no replies yet.
Mike Franklin
Member
All I can tell you is that the '73 and it's clones are not strong guns. It might not blow up but it might very well fail. Yours is a rebuild of an old gun with old parts and an old frame. The '92 is stronger the '94 stronger yet. You apparently have bears living in the area. Look for a '76 clone in .45-75, that'll knock'm in the dirt.
Harve Curry
Member
Mike,
Yes mine is an old rebulild.
But your skipping the part about the 44 mag import copies.
Yes mine is an old rebulild.
But your skipping the part about the 44 mag import copies.
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