All of the ammo was purchased within the last year. Also, it was purchased brand new. I spoke with my FFL dealer and he also suggested to send it back and has never heard of such a problem with a S&W. I plan on bringing it in on Thursday to ship back again. Hopefully they can straighten it out and it will be up and running. Thanks
642 Club Part Deux
- Thread starter fiVe
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BADUNAME37
Member
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- Aug 10, 2008
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Do the primers look as though the firing pin is striking them hard? My 642 puts quite the dent in the primers, in all of them, regardless of brand.
Geezer59
Member
Pachmayr Compacs are my grips of choice for my J-frames that aren't wearing CT LG-405 laser grips. Both very comfortable in my experience.wjh2657 said:
308win
Member
I would call S&W and get an RA and let them fix it. Advise them this is the second trip back to the factory and you would appreciate accelerated handling.
BADUNAME37
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When you dry fire it, does the hammer dropping sound the same every time? It sounds like the hammer or other crucial component is somehow binding thus slowing the and/or restricting the hammer movement.
442 misfires
weavpi:I agree with 308win and Inspector. Check the end-shake of your 442 (if S&W replaced swing arm and cylinder they probably think that this was the problem). A properly fitted revolver should have a minimum end-shake of .001" to a maximum of .003".
UNLOAD YOUR 442 then close the cylinder and pull the trigger very very slow. You can hear a first click; keep on pulling the trigger you can hear a second click (cylinder stops from rotation). Holding the trigger in this position check the end-shake of your 442. If the cylinder is tight rear-forward and left-right everything is working well. Check also the end-shake with the trigger in its rear position (after the hammer falls): the cylinder has to be tight also. Make this check for each chamber (so you can also check the timing of your 442: if you can't stage the trigger first click-second click-bang, there's something wrong on the timing). If you pull the trigger fast, timing issues are not decisive (the inertia of rotation align the cylinder every time). If you pull the trigger slow, timing issues can make your revolver to misfire (sorry for my english).
As Inspector told, listen the sounds of your 442 (UNLOADED
). When you pull the trigger look if the firing pin protrude enought from the shield (to do that hold the trigger in its rear position after the hammer falls). Maybe it is a little too short (sometimes it happens on S&W revolvers).
Anyway if the problem is too much end-shake you can order a set of "Power Custom Endshake Bearings S&W J-Frame Centerfire .002" Package of 10" from Midway or Brownells or the Power Custom site and make them installed by a smith (usually one bearing solves the problem).
That's all I can tell you. Hope it can help.
Best regards, 5-SHOTS.
weavpi:I agree with 308win and Inspector. Check the end-shake of your 442 (if S&W replaced swing arm and cylinder they probably think that this was the problem). A properly fitted revolver should have a minimum end-shake of .001" to a maximum of .003".
UNLOAD YOUR 442 then close the cylinder and pull the trigger very very slow. You can hear a first click; keep on pulling the trigger you can hear a second click (cylinder stops from rotation). Holding the trigger in this position check the end-shake of your 442. If the cylinder is tight rear-forward and left-right everything is working well. Check also the end-shake with the trigger in its rear position (after the hammer falls): the cylinder has to be tight also. Make this check for each chamber (so you can also check the timing of your 442: if you can't stage the trigger first click-second click-bang, there's something wrong on the timing). If you pull the trigger fast, timing issues are not decisive (the inertia of rotation align the cylinder every time). If you pull the trigger slow, timing issues can make your revolver to misfire (sorry for my english).
As Inspector told, listen the sounds of your 442 (UNLOADED
). When you pull the trigger look if the firing pin protrude enought from the shield (to do that hold the trigger in its rear position after the hammer falls). Maybe it is a little too short (sometimes it happens on S&W revolvers).Anyway if the problem is too much end-shake you can order a set of "Power Custom Endshake Bearings S&W J-Frame Centerfire .002" Package of 10" from Midway or Brownells or the Power Custom site and make them installed by a smith (usually one bearing solves the problem).
That's all I can tell you. Hope it can help.
Best regards, 5-SHOTS.
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308win
Member
Inspector - 5shots went into more detail than I did. if you are interested in doing more yourself, read this sticky to guide you in evaluating the mechanical soundness of your 642.
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Moonclip informations for twoclones
twoclones: if I remember well I've red something in the Part1 of this thread. Onestly I can't remember the post number or the page. The guy that modified his 642 also indicated the specialist that did the work. Anyway I think that someone like Gemini Custom can do that. I remember that the work was VERY expensive but after this the 642 (with the proper moonclip) can also fire 9mm Parabellum cartridges (the diameter of 9mm bullet is .355 against the .357 diameter of .38SPL). Probably firing 9mm the accuracy is not as good as firing .38SPL. Certainly firing hot 9mm stress the 642 a little bit (don't fire any 9mm +P or +P+ out of a 642).
twoclones: if I remember well I've red something in the Part1 of this thread. Onestly I can't remember the post number or the page. The guy that modified his 642 also indicated the specialist that did the work. Anyway I think that someone like Gemini Custom can do that. I remember that the work was VERY expensive but after this the 642 (with the proper moonclip) can also fire 9mm Parabellum cartridges (the diameter of 9mm bullet is .355 against the .357 diameter of .38SPL). Probably firing 9mm the accuracy is not as good as firing .38SPL. Certainly firing hot 9mm stress the 642 a little bit (don't fire any 9mm +P or +P+ out of a 642).
GRAYRID3R
Member
I got a 642 stainless for my wife last month and I'm sorry I did! Now I'm going to have to buy another one for myself. I just wanted to get one and used her as an excuse, but it backfired on me (not the gun the plan)and she won't let me have it. It is fun taking her to the range on weekends, even though the wait is almost an hour now due to the large amounts of wives and girlfriends out shooting . She does pretty good with the 642 and really likes the fit. So she's shooting the S&W and I'm shooting the Colt 1911. We traded once and that was the only time I got my hands on the 642. Can I still be in the club? I bought the gun, she just won't let me shoot it.
BADUNAME37
Member
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- Aug 10, 2008
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- 4,434
Yes, GRAYRID3R, you may be in the club.
Your story is so good, you deserve to be in the club and I wish we could all pitch in to help you buy the second one.
I'm glad your wife shoots with you, be glad she does. I can't get my wife interested in the least, not about any of my guns, including my 642. Maybe some day!
trayzor, Welcome, and welcome little friend! That is a nice little friend you have there!
OK, I just "ran" all the tests listed in 5shots post.
The only movement I can see is just a bit of cylinder rotation (left/right) while the cylinder is locked just before the hammer drops, and after it has dropped.
As for front/back movement of the cylinder, if I press fairly hard, there may be movement about the thickness of an ordinary piece of paper, if that.
So, I guess my gun passes! I know it is accurate -- the few times I have shot it.
Why are there three more posts after this one? I waited and checked to make sure nothing was posted and nothing was, even after five minutes and refreshing the page each time, and it kept coming back as an error on the page. Now a bunch of posts.
Your story is so good, you deserve to be in the club and I wish we could all pitch in to help you buy the second one.
I'm glad your wife shoots with you, be glad she does. I can't get my wife interested in the least, not about any of my guns, including my 642. Maybe some day!
trayzor, Welcome, and welcome little friend! That is a nice little friend you have there!
OK, I just "ran" all the tests listed in 5shots post.
The only movement I can see is just a bit of cylinder rotation (left/right) while the cylinder is locked just before the hammer drops, and after it has dropped.
As for front/back movement of the cylinder, if I press fairly hard, there may be movement about the thickness of an ordinary piece of paper, if that.
So, I guess my gun passes! I know it is accurate -- the few times I have shot it.
Why are there three more posts after this one? I waited and checked to make sure nothing was posted and nothing was, even after five minutes and refreshing the page each time, and it kept coming back as an error on the page. Now a bunch of posts.
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BADUNAME37
Member
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- Aug 10, 2008
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OK, I just "ran" all the tests listed in 5shots post.
The only movement I can see is just a bit of cylinder rotation (left/right) while the cylinder is locked just before the hammer drops, and after it has dropped.
As for front/back movement of the cylinder, if I press fairly hard, there may be about the thickness of an ordinary piece of paper, if that.
So, I guess my gun passes! I know it is accurate -- the few times I have shot it.
The only movement I can see is just a bit of cylinder rotation (left/right) while the cylinder is locked just before the hammer drops, and after it has dropped.
As for front/back movement of the cylinder, if I press fairly hard, there may be about the thickness of an ordinary piece of paper, if that.
So, I guess my gun passes! I know it is accurate -- the few times I have shot it.
rdrancher
Member
trayzor - Looks like you got one of the new 642-1's. Congrats and welcome!
rd
rd
Another test
Inspector:everything is normal in your 642. A few left-right play is normal also: belive or not in an italian gun magazine I've red that during the fire the perfect and final alignment chamber-barrel is made by the air flow pushed forward by the coming out (from the cylinder) bullet. Of course if the timing is not correct the air flow can't recover all the play and the gun becomes inaccurate (or in worst cases it doesn't fire due to badly off center strikes). Not your case!
Please everybody: next time you go to the range fire a cylinder or two hesitating a few seconds after the second click before bang (this will put in evidence the effective power of the rebound spring in unfavourable conditions and you will make super accurate shots also). Then check the stikes on your spent cases: if they are well maked and centered there's no end-shake or timing issues to be worry about.
Best regards, 5-SHOTS
Inspector:everything is normal in your 642. A few left-right play is normal also: belive or not in an italian gun magazine I've red that during the fire the perfect and final alignment chamber-barrel is made by the air flow pushed forward by the coming out (from the cylinder) bullet. Of course if the timing is not correct the air flow can't recover all the play and the gun becomes inaccurate (or in worst cases it doesn't fire due to badly off center strikes). Not your case!
Please everybody: next time you go to the range fire a cylinder or two hesitating a few seconds after the second click before bang (this will put in evidence the effective power of the rebound spring in unfavourable conditions and you will make super accurate shots also). Then check the stikes on your spent cases: if they are well maked and centered there's no end-shake or timing issues to be worry about.
Best regards, 5-SHOTS
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Pics I've promised
From left to right (or, if the thumbnails disappear, from up to down):
1)S&W 649-1 with stock grips
2)S&W 649-1 with Pachmayr Decelarator grips
3)S&W 649-1 with Pachmayr Compac Pro grips
4)S&W 649-1, Ruger SP101 DAO and S&W 686 Plus 2.5"
Sorry again for multiple posts, not only my guilt.
From left to right (or, if the thumbnails disappear, from up to down):
1)S&W 649-1 with stock grips
2)S&W 649-1 with Pachmayr Decelarator grips
3)S&W 649-1 with Pachmayr Compac Pro grips
4)S&W 649-1, Ruger SP101 DAO and S&W 686 Plus 2.5"
Sorry again for multiple posts, not only my guilt.
Attachments
BADUNAME37
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The server must be doing some kind of maitenance when the posts don't show up, or it may be bogged down and running reeeeeeaaaal SLOW!
That's all I can think of.
I have been pulling the trigger very slowly with most of my shots. I can actually feel the first "click" and then the second one, then just a hair further and BANG!
I find I am most accurate when I shoot double action like this. However, I should work on accuracy with fast shooting, but will work up to that.
All the shooting I've done in the past has always been pull the hammer back, aim and shoot. Shooting double action is new to me, and something I must get used to (especially since the 642 is only double action).
That's all I can think of.
I have been pulling the trigger very slowly with most of my shots. I can actually feel the first "click" and then the second one, then just a hair further and BANG!
I find I am most accurate when I shoot double action like this. However, I should work on accuracy with fast shooting, but will work up to that.
All the shooting I've done in the past has always been pull the hammer back, aim and shoot. Shooting double action is new to me, and something I must get used to (especially since the 642 is only double action).
AStone
Member
<laughs>
Apparently, neither are the mods.
They can delete extra posts due to server hangs.
Been away for a while.
Just thought I'd drop in for a visit.
Nice to see the club still up and running.
Nice to see folks from Italy here.
(Please bring wine & ravioli.)
Hey, how 'bout that 642?
Now we have TWO 642 Club Part Deux! Why?
Hello everybody. With very big surprise and disappointment I've discovered that there are TWO 642 Club Part Deux threads, one on TheHighRoad.US and one on THR.org.
I try to explain you the situation: till about post #2714 (Page 109 of both Threads) the two Treads were exactly alike (same people, same posts). From that point the two Threads proceed parallel as they were two different things.
Infact when I became a member of The Club in December 28th 2008 on THR.org I was asking myself why king fiVe, Nema, DAdams, jt1 and the others mythical members didn't post anymore since that date.
And of course today I must made another registration on THR.US to post in that Thread.
I don't like this situation. It's like we had a schism...
Sorry for my outburst but I think we are one people.
Best regards, 5-SHOTS
Hello everybody. With very big surprise and disappointment I've discovered that there are TWO 642 Club Part Deux threads, one on TheHighRoad.US and one on THR.org.
I try to explain you the situation: till about post #2714 (Page 109 of both Threads) the two Treads were exactly alike (same people, same posts). From that point the two Threads proceed parallel as they were two different things.
Infact when I became a member of The Club in December 28th 2008 on THR.org I was asking myself why king fiVe, Nema, DAdams, jt1 and the others mythical members didn't post anymore since that date.
And of course today I must made another registration on THR.US to post in that Thread.
I don't like this situation. It's like we had a schism...
Sorry for my outburst but I think we are one people.
Best regards, 5-SHOTS
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fiVe
Member
Geezer59 said:
I like Hogue Bantam grips.
rdrancher
Member
5-Shots I'm calling POST PADDING!
Just kidding. It looks as though there was (or is) a glitch in the server since I saw the same thing on a couple of other threads. I couldn't even see fiVe's post until I went advanced to post this.
The other day I lost my favorite speed strip pouch (loaded with Gold Dots) from my pocket while under a house checking out a foundation repair. The house is over 60 miles from mine so I was hoping that I got the job. I did! Now to see if I can locate the pouch.
rd
Just kidding.
It looks as though there was (or is) a glitch in the server since I saw the same thing on a couple of other threads. I couldn't even see fiVe's post until I went advanced to post this.The other day I lost my favorite speed strip pouch (loaded with Gold Dots) from my pocket while under a house checking out a foundation repair. The house is over 60 miles from mine so I was hoping that I got the job. I did! Now to see if I can locate the pouch.
rd
642-2
Just completed taking the infernal lock out of my shooter and all went well till I pulled the hammer and associated parts out, there is a tiny (and I mean tiny) spring that keeps the front portion of the hammer extended to accept the sear and engage said sear. Put it all back together again and for the life of me couldn't figure out why the hammer wouldn't engage the sear. Upon further inspection I saw a small recess on this little pawl, and with magnification found what appeared to be a recess that houses a spring, which of course was by now MIA, and in my work area to find a spring that resembles a hair wound in a coil, is beyond needle in a haystack. Wife and I are now on all fours with l.e.d headlamps fully realizing the futility of the situation, and lo and behold, like a miracle, is this slightly high spot on an otherwise smooth floor. Yup, you guessed it, the spring! After offering appropriate sacrifice, I proceeded to put her back together, and Voilla, it works. Long way round the cautionary note to those who would undertake such an effort, BE CAREFULL OF SAID SPRING!! Nuff said.
Just completed taking the infernal lock out of my shooter and all went well till I pulled the hammer and associated parts out, there is a tiny (and I mean tiny) spring that keeps the front portion of the hammer extended to accept the sear and engage said sear. Put it all back together again and for the life of me couldn't figure out why the hammer wouldn't engage the sear. Upon further inspection I saw a small recess on this little pawl, and with magnification found what appeared to be a recess that houses a spring, which of course was by now MIA, and in my work area to find a spring that resembles a hair wound in a coil, is beyond needle in a haystack. Wife and I are now on all fours with l.e.d headlamps fully realizing the futility of the situation, and lo and behold, like a miracle, is this slightly high spot on an otherwise smooth floor. Yup, you guessed it, the spring! After offering appropriate sacrifice, I proceeded to put her back together, and Voilla, it works. Long way round the cautionary note to those who would undertake such an effort, BE CAREFULL OF SAID SPRING!! Nuff said.
Replacing Side plate front yoke screw.
I want to replace the front side plate yoke screw on my 642-2 as I nicked it with my screwdriver. (And yes I used a hollow ground screwdriver)
Any way when I looked at the parts list on the S&W site it listed two yoke screws.
One which just said "Yoke screw" and the other said "Yoke screw glass bead". So what is the glass bead , and which screw do I need to replace the original on my 642-2?
Also how tight should one torque on this screw?
I always mark the screw slot position before I remove it so I can get it close to the same tightness.
I also see that some guys remove the crane and cylinder for cleaning. Will repeated removal of the side plate yoke screw cause the threads in the alloy frame to become sloppy? And last but not least. When replacing the side plate yoke screw with a new screw is there anything special that should be done in preparation for fitting of the new screw?
I know too many questions, but hay I rather ask first than be sorry.:banghead:
I want to replace the front side plate yoke screw on my 642-2 as I nicked it with my screwdriver. (And yes I used a hollow ground screwdriver)
Any way when I looked at the parts list on the S&W site it listed two yoke screws.
One which just said "Yoke screw" and the other said "Yoke screw glass bead". So what is the glass bead , and which screw do I need to replace the original on my 642-2?
Also how tight should one torque on this screw?
I always mark the screw slot position before I remove it so I can get it close to the same tightness.
I also see that some guys remove the crane and cylinder for cleaning. Will repeated removal of the side plate yoke screw cause the threads in the alloy frame to become sloppy? And last but not least. When replacing the side plate yoke screw with a new screw is there anything special that should be done in preparation for fitting of the new screw?
I know too many questions, but hay I rather ask first than be sorry.:banghead:
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For falcon195
falcon195, I'll try to properly answer your questions.
Few weeks ago I've ordered a front side plate yoke screw from Midwayitalia for my 649-1 just to have it as a spare part. The description said "yoke screw glass bead". The other was a simple side plate screw. Take a look on Midwayusa or Brownells: you can see a pic of the part and then you can order the right one from S&W if you want. The price of the others two side plate screws is neglegible so don't worry if you take also one of them.
"Glass bead" is the same of "sand blasted", it concernes the finish of the part not the appearance. Not the best mode to distinguish two parts that have the same finish...
Or maybe it means a "glass" of steel containing a "bead" of steel.
"How tight should one torque on this screw?": you have to tight the screw well. Just not exaggerate! Stop when it stops from screwing. The problems of S&W's side plate screws is that they could become a little loose after every range session. So check them sometimes. To tight the screws on my Smiths I use one or two rounds of plumber's teflon around the thread's screws. If you do this make sure that the screw is fitting properly when you re-install it: is easy to screw it croocked. Belive or not teflon works well for me.
"I always mark the screw slot position before I remove it so I can get it close to the same tightness": if you install a new one I doubt it is necessary. The new one could have a different head cut position due to building differences.
"Will repeated removal of the side plate yoke screw cause the threads in the alloy frame to become sloppy?": yes. I don't like to do that even on my stainless steel revolvers go figure in an alloy frame one...IMO there's no reason to do that after 100 or 200 rounds. Maybe after a year of shooting.
"When replacing the side plate yoke screw with a new screw is there anything special that should be done in preparation for fitting of the new screw?": no. UNLOAD YOUR 642, close the cylinder, remove the old screw, set the new one. Then open the cylinder and check if the yoke is tight (no back-forward play).
Hope it can help you. Best regards, 5-SHOTS.
falcon195, I'll try to properly answer your questions.
Few weeks ago I've ordered a front side plate yoke screw from Midwayitalia for my 649-1 just to have it as a spare part. The description said "yoke screw glass bead". The other was a simple side plate screw. Take a look on Midwayusa or Brownells: you can see a pic of the part and then you can order the right one from S&W if you want. The price of the others two side plate screws is neglegible so don't worry if you take also one of them.
"Glass bead" is the same of "sand blasted", it concernes the finish of the part not the appearance. Not the best mode to distinguish two parts that have the same finish...
Or maybe it means a "glass" of steel containing a "bead" of steel.
"How tight should one torque on this screw?": you have to tight the screw well. Just not exaggerate! Stop when it stops from screwing. The problems of S&W's side plate screws is that they could become a little loose after every range session. So check them sometimes. To tight the screws on my Smiths I use one or two rounds of plumber's teflon around the thread's screws. If you do this make sure that the screw is fitting properly when you re-install it: is easy to screw it croocked. Belive or not teflon works well for me.
"I always mark the screw slot position before I remove it so I can get it close to the same tightness": if you install a new one I doubt it is necessary. The new one could have a different head cut position due to building differences.
"Will repeated removal of the side plate yoke screw cause the threads in the alloy frame to become sloppy?": yes. I don't like to do that even on my stainless steel revolvers go figure in an alloy frame one...IMO there's no reason to do that after 100 or 200 rounds. Maybe after a year of shooting.
"When replacing the side plate yoke screw with a new screw is there anything special that should be done in preparation for fitting of the new screw?": no. UNLOAD YOUR 642, close the cylinder, remove the old screw, set the new one. Then open the cylinder and check if the yoke is tight (no back-forward play).
Hope it can help you. Best regards, 5-SHOTS.
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