686 or 625?

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benzy2

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Looking to buy my first DA/SA revolver. I plan to use it mostly as a fun gun with the off chance that I might get into a little IDPA. Basically I'm looking for a very nice revolver that will be fun to play with as a range toy yet can be taken to an IDPA match if the desire arose.

I've thought about Rugers and I think they are out. Nothing against them, but with the game trend the way it is, a Smith seems like a more logical option. If I need anyone to work on the pistol it seems quality S&W guys are pretty common.

In the $500-$1000 market that seems to put me in a S&W. The two that have really caught my eye are the 686 SSR and the 625JM. Both seem to fit their division of IDPA well and both seem like well made revolvers. I know the decision of which class to shoot is up to the shooter, but outside of IDPA, which option is more fun in your personal opinion? I think I'm leaning slightly towards the 625JM at this point but with any real valid suggestion could go either way. Something about an N frame shooting a .45acp sounds like fun both on and off the range, though I can't say the 686SSR doesn't sound fun too.

I suppose the correct answer is to buy one of each, and that may be what happens sooner or later, but if that is the case, which one first?

I am open to any other suggestions for a range/IDPA revolver in the $500-$1000 range.
 
Wow, tough choice. I don't know IDPA rules since I only shoot USPSA. I have a 686 and a 625, and the clips for the 625 is a huge advantage. Of course a 627 would be even better, but don't know how it fits in the rules.

For a range toy I think the 686 is a slightly better choice. I find light 357 loads to be more accurate than 45, but that might just be my specific guns.
 
I start drooling at the thought of a 625 and a bucket of loaded up full moons.

A similar option would be a 610. A 10mm revolver that also shoots .40S&W using full or half moon clips.

The 686 is a sweet gun as well. But with .38Spl rounds I've read a lot about the amount of fumbling needed if using moon clips. Due to the length and the fact that the moonclips have no V shaped groove to lock into they don't load half as smoothly as the shorter cased .45's or .40's. So they really are more of a speed loader option. Certainly nothing wrong with that. It's just that it lacks the speed and smoothness of using the full moons.
 
If regular USPSA shooting's a possibility as well, go with the 625. Otherwise, I'd recommend the 686.

The moonclip/speedloaders thing isn't an issue in IDPA since they shoot in different divisions.

Moons can make reloads easier, but you still have to load & unload the clips themselves. Some don't mind, while others find it drudgery.


outside of IDPA, which option is more fun in your personal opinion?
Click to expand...

I prefer the 686 myself:

Fit: The 625 is a big gun, and it's size alone makes it harder for me to shoot well. The bigger cylinder & heavy ammo also makes the action feel harder to pull at speed (more inertia to overcome). I tuned the action down to 6lbs so I wouldn't be wrestling with the gun as much at speed.

Recoil: .357mag notwithstanding, the 625 shoots ammo with a higher power factor. It's not like it's a .44mag, but after a long match, I'm "done".

Ammo cost: .45acp costs more, both to buy and to reload.

625JM: I read mixed reviews about the JM version. I like the interchangeable front sight and full underlug, but too often I read about issues with the chromed hammer. I also hate a serrated trigger. I'd tune it anyway, so both the trigger and hammer would get replaced, at an additional expense. If I were to buy a new 4" 625 (mine's 5"), I'd likely get the current one from the Performance Center.
 
After years of shooting competitions (PPC and Bullseye) and hunting, I have whittled my revolvers down to two calibers, 38 and 45. In the 38 calibers, I have only one that is chambered for the 357 Magnum and from it I generally us only the 38 Special. In the 45 caliber, I have revolvers that are either 45 ACp or 45 long Colt. OF the two revovlers you mentioned, I would advise the one that accepts the ACP cartridge. BUT, I am not aware of requirements for the game you want to play, I just know that the M25-2 I have and the 4" 45 ACP I built are two of the most accurate revolvers I have seen on the line.
 
I've owned my 625JM for over seven years! I've shot the nasal drippings out of it in that time. I've used it for SPC and just general plinking - with moonclipped ball ammo and .45 Colt bullets (255gr LSWC) in .45 AR cases. Never a hiccup - once S&W sent me an unground strain screw - I had put mild Wolff springs in it and the 'Pro' ground factory screw intruded into the spring's hump, lessening the pre-load. I use only Federal primers. My hammer and trigger are lightly marred from rubbing, but that's it. I put a .250" height Classic/DX HiViz in the first week - great aid in 'fast' sighting, although I suspect that gold beaded Patridge is better for bullseye shooting. I've tried other grips - but for a fast, comfortable, and non-fidgety grab, the JM's are fine - that fact just isn't intuitively obvious. I encourage you to try them.

Ammo wise, WallyWorld still has 250rd UMC ball ammo <$90. That's $18/50 - commercial .38 Special range - and it's a big bore. Really whacks a steel plate, too. Yields an odd ftf, one every couple of moonclips, with my lightened hammer spring, but shot 100% with the stock spring. Moonclips - from S&W's source - Ranch Products - were ~$35/100 delivered blued. They take Starline and Remington brass easily by hand - the empties strip and stow in the ~$15 nutdriver style de-mooner from Brownell's. You can have 'ready ammo' moonclipped and ready pretty reasonably, too. Here are 105 moonclips, which fit in five layers, separated by a phenolic board, of twenty one each in a metal 5.56mm ammo box:

IMG_0594.jpg

Now, if you like the .38 Special - and aren't tied to six rounds - consider the 627 Pro. It's also a 4"-er - but takes 8 .38/.357M - even on moonclips. BTW, they are more expensive, $75/100 from R.P., flimsier, more tempermental of case brand, and slower to reload than those 625 moonclips. The 5starfirearms.com speedloader & loading baseplate are universal, however. It, the 686SSR, and the 625JM should be essentially the same price - and equally easy or difficult to find.

IMG_0622.jpg

I told you the JM grips grow on you - I bought a JM grip for my 627, too!

Stainz
 
Reload your shells and size of your hand

IDPA is shot with the gun from a concealment holster. The L frame would be easier for most people.
I use a 625 for USPSA and its almost to big for my hand fingers.
I really like my K frame for ICORE and fun shooting. Quick in my hand and easy to carry. The L frame has a K frame grip.
If you don't reload you own shells I would get the L frame cut for moon clips.
 
If this gun's going to be used in IDPA, forget about machining a 686 for moons. Too many reasons to get into before my morning coffee. ;)

If you want a moonclipped gun, but an N-frame's too big, keep your eye open for a 646, an L-frame chambered in .40S&W. They're relatively rare, and priced accordingly, though.
 
I'm not planning on machining the 686. I figure I'd simply play in SSR if I went with the 686 and ESR if I went with the 625. There are a couple other options that look to be available locally used that I'm going to check out today. Hopefully I run into something decent at a good price.
 
Mr Boreland is in the room, and he, again has spoken wise and sage words... I would listen..

Added note, as stated the N frame is difficult for many to master, and it is a handful over the course of a day at the matches.. but in the N frame, the felt recoil of a 45 ACP is almost negligible.. The L-Frames, High power loads don't bounce you around near as bad as say, a K frame, but it to can be a chore over the course of a day of competition...

To me it boils down to a trade off, the N frame, heavier, but due to the felt recoil, for me easier on the hands over time...

The L-Frame, a touch more in the recoil, but its a bit lighter pistol, than the N-Frame..Giving you less back and shoulder strain over a full day of shooting.. Both very great guns...Bottom line, it comes down to your individual preferences...

The only true logical answer, is buy both... I would.... But I'm funny that way....

In any case, with either gun, a good quality trigger job is mandatory...
 
My 5 inch 625 has been a favorite revolver for competition for me for quite a few years, It handles everything from pipsqueak 150 grain lead loads up to some nasty 260 grain 460 Rowland loads for hunting. Clark will do the cylinder on your 625 if you want to load the Rowland btw. The moon clips make for the fastest speedload possible and the extra bullet diameter can cut a scoring ring the smaller caliber will just miss. The N-frame are extremely smooth and to me the weight just makes the cylinder rotate smoother. I would vote for the 625 JM.
 
I called half a dozen local shops within a couple hours drive. One I couldn't get to answer, just a busy signal. On my way to see a used 686SSR I stopped in to the store who's phone was busy. They had a 625JM for less than budsgunshop. A few others had said they could order them and that they would be about $950. I told them I'd think about it. When I saw the new JM on the shelf for $770 I took it. Maybe not the best buy for IDPA in the world but deep down I knew I had more desire for the 625. I haven't had the .45ACP dies out for a while though I do have a bunch of components that have needed put together for a while now. I'm going to need some more moon clips and need the moon clip tool as well.
 
Congrats, benzy2.

btw, for accessories such as an IDPA-legal moonclip holder, check out 4wheelguns.com. Bob Purdue has a great reputation among competitive wheelgunners, and his service & stuff is 1st rate.

Smooth reloads are critical for IDPA/USPSA wheelgunners, so once you get your dies set up, make some dummy rounds and get a bunch of practice in.

We'll expect pics & a range report soon, eh? :D


7:15am and you haven't had coffee yet??!!
Click to expand...

Yeah, I know. Cruising THR at 2AM is why I'm hating life at 7AM, lol.
 
I bought a http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...2/products_id/61700/S&W+M686+PRO+357+5+MCLP+S last year - 7 shot, 5" slab bbl, 686+ Pro Series with factory moonclips. The ad doesn't say so, but the S&W website does. I wanted something my wife could enjoy, and I prefer a 1911 for .45acp, and a S&W revolver for .38/.357.
It's not a gun you see at the range often, but if you want moons from a factory piece, it fits the bill. Also loads just fine from speedloaders or bare hands....
 

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I have a 686SSR, a 625JM and a 625PC. I prefer the PC, but I also like the others. My JM came with the worst looking forcing cone I have ever seen. It looked like it was cut with a pen knife. Fortunately it cleaned up nicely. I also had to take some very fine sand paper to the serrated trigger to take a little of the sharp edge off the serrations. Now it is fine. I replaced the rebound spring and smoothed the internals. Now it is very nice. The PC got the rebound spring change, but otherwise was good as it came from the factory. Any of them would work, but I like the PC.
 
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Congrats on buying the 625. I have both the 686 and 625 which I enjoy shooting equally well. Both are very accurate and reasonable to reload for. I'm sure in time you will add the 686 to your collection.
 
Ammo prices aren't a huge concern. I have loaded my own for a bit now. Thought about casting my own but don't think I'm going to jump into that boat yet. Still, seems like you can find cast bullets for $40/500 which is well within reason and with the moon clips I have a feeling I'll be collecting a higher percentage of my brass this way too.

I'm actually heading to a gunshow tomorrow to look for a nice used 686 so who knows, it may be in the collection sooner than later.
 
What's not to like? The empties all just sit there in a nice little clump!

Up this way not many 625's come up for sale. But somewhere along the way I'm going to get either a 625 or a 610 and get into playing at my competition shooting with moonclips.

With having the N frame 625 already you may want to get a somewhat smaller K frame instead of the L framed 686 just so there's more of a difference between the two revolvers. Don't get me wrong, I've shot some 586's and 686's and loved them. But being in between the K and N frame sizes there's not a lot of variation in the collection if you get one to go alongside the 625. Something like a Model 66 or a proper blued 19 might give you a little more variety if that's what you'd like.
 
4wheelguns.com. will set you up with everything you need. I've shot with Bob Purdue several times. no finer man walks the earth.

Now you need to get your cylinder chamfered, hammer bobbed, ball Detent on the crane and a trigger job.

I have 3- 625's. My double action pull is at 4-1/2 pounds.
 
71Commander, who did your trigger or was it something you did yourself?
 
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