9mm ammo choice

[YammyMonkey]

I've always carried a .45 1911, but my recent dress code change had me picking up a Kel Tec P11 for daily carry and while running, etc...

I've done some searching around here and the net but since I can't get into Ammolab anymore (looks like they're not taking any new subscriptions) and most of the other info I found was dated I have a few questions.

I'm looking for a few rounds to test that would work well out of the shorter bbl of the Kel Tec. I'm more of a heavy bullet/penetration kind of guy than a light fast lots of violent expansion one.

I'm considering the 124/147 weights in the Gold Dot, Golden Saber and Ranger lines, +P and +P+ where available.

Any input on those choices? I like a 14" minimum for penetration in Jell-o, 16" is preferred as well as consistency between the bare and denim-clad tests. As far as muzzle flash goes, is one better than the others? Are the SXT rounds from Winchester the same as the Rangers?

Thanks.

 

[Dr. J Frame]

From Ammolab-

Lab & Street Proven Loadings

We receive tens of thousands of email and messages each year from readers who want to know if we have street shooting files. The answer is no we do not, we do consult on dozens of court cases each year but those files are the property of our clients and the Agencies they work for.

Having said that and acknowledged that we do not have access to secret information here is a list of handgun loadings that have worked effectively for the LE Officers who depended upon them that have also tested very well in the laboratory:

9mm-
Federal 135gr LE9T5
Remington 147gr Golden Saber
Speer Gold Dot 124gr+P
Winchester Ranger 127gr +P+ RA9TA
Winchester Ranger 147gr RA9T

I carry the 147gr Golden Saber in my Glock 26 and Kahr PM9. Both sub-compacts.

Good Luck

 

[RecoilRob]

Another vote for the 147 GS in the P-11. You also might consider the 20lb Wolff mainsprings for that round. Reduces the perceived recoil and has proven to be totally reliable in my gun. The Extra-Power firing pin spring is a good thing too. Reduces the drop firing chances greatly without compromising ignition reliability.

 

[tlhelmer]

In my longer bbl 9 mm I use 147 gr. and in my shorter bbl guns I use 127 or 124 gr. bullets.

I like Speer Gold-dots, but I prefer Winchester rangers.

 

[147 Grain]

* Double Tap 9mm 147-gr. +P Gold Dots at 1,145 fps in Glock 17

* Ranger T 9mm 147-gr. at 990 fps in Glock 19

 

[YammyMonkey]

I saw that list on Ammolab, but they give a thumbs up to the 135gr Federal load that another source, I think it was the Firearms Tactical site, said was not so hot. . .

And therein lies the problem. I'm trying to find a few loads that are consistently, source-to-source considered to be good penetrators and reliable expanders from a 3" bbl.

Anybody have a source for the Ranger-T's for us non-LEO's?

I ordered up a bunch of Rem GS in 124 and some Speer GD also in 124, we'll see how they work for starters.

 

[147 Grain]

Again and with respect:

Nothin' beats Double Tap or Ranger T in 9mm 147-gr.:

* Double Tap 9mm 147-gr. +P Gold Dots at 1,145 fps (5" pipe): www.DoubleTapAmmo.com (866) 357-1066 $22.50 per box of 50.

* Ranger T 9mm 147-gr. at 990 fps (4" pipe): OMB Police Supply (800) 566-9739. $125.00 per case of 10 (50-round boxes)

 

[YammyMonkey]

Thanks, I'll check it out.

 

[DaleJunior]

YammyMonkey-

Your question is a valid one, and was danced around by some of the responses above. Unfortunately, you likely won't be able to find any useful penetration & expansion figures for commercial loads shot from 3" barrels available for viewing on the internet (at least for free), short of some very unofficial & unscientific backyard "wet pack" tests.

FWIW, when pressed to say what round he would carry in a 3" pm9, the founder of ammolab suggested he would likely carry the 124 grain +p GD. That bullet is also listed as an acceptable round for SD by Dr. Roberts on tacticalforums.com. I find that it shoots easier than the 147 gr out of the short barrel, so that helped in my decision. I will stick with that until I see gel tests specifically from a 3" barrel that suggest otherwise (including the new "Short-Barrel" GD bullets).

Hope this has been of assistance.

 

[W Turner]

Having owned and shot a couple of the little Kel-Tec's, I can say that you may want to reconsider carrying +P or +P+ in those little guns. I am a big fan of KT's in general, but the 9mm version is very snappy to me and this was just made worse by adding the higher pressure and recoil that comes with +P.

My carry load with these was either the standard pressure 124gr. Gold Dot or the 115gr. WWB load. The lighter weights will help that little hollowpoint get up to speed to help with expansion.


W

 

[Berettafan21]

I would second Double Tap Ammo. Take a look at the 115 gr.

 

[Universal]

I like the Speer Gold Dot 124 grain +P.

 

[m39fan]

FWIW, guys that carried 9mm's in our department were issued the 147gr. Ranger "T"s so when I bought a 9mm later on I bought the same ammo (same police supply house). To make a long story short, they aren't impressive. Accuracy IS good. However, using the same gun that I was winning with last year (Federal 115gr. FMJ - Gov't overruns), I couldn't reliably knock over, let alone off, bowling pins this year (using LEO ONLY boxes of 147gr. T's). Take it for what it's worth but I changed my carry ammo that day!!! I now carry Gold Dot's just as I do for my .40's.

HTH,
Mike

 

[kbr80]

Winchester Ranger 147gr RA9T, carry it all the time. Good round.

 

[armoredman]

I base my selection on two things - price, and Evan Marshall. Wow, hear the groans! I carry the Remington 115gr bulk JHP, because they are functional, inexpensive, and I am not allowed to carry my handloads by our Democrat County Attorney. Evan tested some generic JHP some time ago, and found that the bulk stuff performs up to standards of some very expensive HP ammo. I will probably start testing firing the EFMJ from Fed when i get $ to do so, but I feel OK with this stuff for now.

 

[147 Grain]

You could be sorry with the 115-grainers some day. While I hope they never let you down, you're much better off with the Ranger T's in 147-gr. (RA9T) or Double Taps 147-gr. +P at 1,145 fps in a Glock 17.

 

[armoredman]

The EFMJs are even lighter, at 105gr, but I have heard they work great. Nothing concrete yet.

 

[147 Grain]

EFMJ's will always expand very well, but it doesn't always penetrate enough on a consistent basis, especially in going through bone where it performs poorly.

 

[B Coyote]

RangerT, 147 grain.

bc

 

[147 Grain]

There yah go!

 

[flip180]

I've clocked RA9T 147gr. Ranger's out of my G19 at 982 fps average. That's plenty good for me.

Flip.

 

[147 Grain]

That's good, but did you know that Double Tap's * 147-gr. +P Gold Dot load is under SAMMI specs (only 200 psi over standard ammo) and yet it achieves 1,135 fps in a Glock 17, using specially blended cooler burning powders not commercially available.

http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/ca...products_id=121

 

[YammyMonkey]

Thanks for the info guys, if I decide to keep the Kel Tec I'll definitely look into some of those Rangers and the Doubletaps.

 

[Lennyjoe]

I use Black Hills Gold 124gr +P with the Gold Dot JHP bullet out of my BHP and G19 when I had it. The BHP still has that load in the mags. The G19 is not here anymore but it shot the ammo very well.

 

[dolanp]

I am using the Gold Dot 124gr +P, but not for any special reason other than it's supposed to be one of the good ones. Sounds like some of the 147gr loads people mention are good as well.