Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by pwillie, Oct 11, 2016.
I have owned a 9mm Keltec 2000.....whats out there that is better?
A good 9mm AR. Beretta Cx4. CZ Scorpion. Sig MPX. HK Mp5 clones.
My Colt 6450 is the best of the bunch, I believe it is currently offered under a different model number.
Another vote for the CX4 Storm. Or, a 9MM AR. There are many choices out for them now.
The Storm isn't perfect but it's a really great gun. The Scorpion EVO is also terrific. The Storm has some real virtues. It's extremely short for starters. My Storm is actually 4" shorter than my AR with the stock fully collapsed. In fact I think it's within a half inch of the shortest length a rifle can be legally. Ergonomics are generally superb. It's handy, it points well and is very comfortable. Reliability is fantastic, at least my own has been flawless. I have the version that takes Beretta 92 mags which are cheap, plentiful and very reliable. 20 and 30 round version are also easy to find and cheap while being just as reliable.
The Storm has a few negatives, though. The trigger is absolutely atrocious. Mine is so heavy that even with thousands of rounds through it I still sometimes have to look and make sure the safety is off. While the ergos are good I'm not a fan of the safety- it's a cross bolt type like a shotgun. Some may like it but loath it. Lastly the sights kind of suck, and there's nothing in the aftermarket for the Storm. Still, slap a RDS on it and you're good to go.
I've got the pistol version of the EVO and there are many things I like better about it vs the Storm. The CZ has a much better trigger (still not a great one though), better sights, and better control layout. But the carbine version of the CZ weighs more than an AR! That is ridiculous IMO. The EVO mags also don't seem to be as well built as the Beretta mags.
I have a Kel Tec Sub 200 and Z Skorpion. The Skorpion is by far the better gun. It is a bit heavy for what it is, but it's still not that heavy and shoots great. Almost no recoil and easy to handle. It's happily eaten any ammo I've given it, including several different reloads. I think the mags are built fine.
I can't necessarily say that the old Sterling Mk.VI semi-auto carbine is any better than a Beretta Storm or an AR 9mm. but it sure is a lot of fun to shoot and you can use less expensive STEN mags with it too. A 100 rounds of WWB goes pretty quick with 30+ rounds per mag!
Cx4 is awesome, as reliable as they come. I have a just right carbine takedown version. Reliable, I would like to see a few changes, but all in all having a carbine to share glock mags in a reliable takedown unit is nice.
Ruger stopped making the PC 9 carbine about 10 years ago. I love mine. Handles like an M1 carbine and it is my go to for bump in the night.
I believe the 9mm Colt is now sold as a 6951. Pretty sure that's what mine is. I love it. It's a flat-top configuration so you can do whatever you want with it in terms of mounting sights or optics. I also have a brass catcher I can mount on the rail which is very convenient for reloading. I keep it setup the same as my Colt 5.56 gun so it is a great training tool. I can use it at my nearby indoor range where 5.56 is not allowed except on the dedicated rifle sit-down/slow fire section.
This kind of sounds like a Ford-Chevy debate. I picked up a Kel tec Sub 2000 2nd Gen a few months back. It fits a lot of my wants and needs for a pistol caliber carbine. And, other than a .357 lever gun, it is the only pistol caliber carbine I own. I'm not one to replace a gun just because another one is on the market. My Kel Tec has functioned flawlessly with the factory mag, my Glock 19 mags and the Glock 33 round mags. I've run 115 grain, 124 grain and 147 grain ammo through it with no issues. I guess you could argue different bells and whistles - but for basic function, I've been well pleased with mine.
I fired a Keltec and did not like it as much as the JR 9mm Carbine. I have fired a CZ and a Sten but I have not had a chance to fire others, but I like the JR 9mm best so far.
Didnt we just have this conversation a few days ago??
Kriss Vector in 9mm sure is an intriguing design.
If we didn't repeat subjects in forums they would be dead in six months.
I like my Kel Tec Sub 2000 9MM, but I love my 9MM AR. The Ruger Doc mentioned has always been of interest to me, I just never stumbled onto one at a good price. I had a CX-4, and it is a good gun, but didn't fit me well. The Hi Point carbine always gets good reviews.
If you feel like eating ramen noodles for a few months, the MP5's are still king. The POF (Pakistan) MP5's are probably the best deal right now at around $1,200.
Though I haven't yet had a chance to fire one, I'd go for the CZ Scorpion if I were in the market to buy one.
Short and handy, plus it's totally ambidextrous. Uses Colt pattern magazines.
By all accounts the POF guns are well made but you'll have 922r issues if you to do anything fun with them.
.....sorry I asked a question....
I have a AR clone that takes Glock mags in 9mm
a .357 levergun and a Ruger PC-4 .40S&W
Got my handgun calibers covered!
pwillie, ya might as well get used to it. I have yet to receive any type of definitive answer. These threads usually go all over from the top to the bottom... LOL.
You think this is a fine example I dare you to ask the same question regarding 1911's.
Lets hear more about this AR that takes Glock Mags, please.
Separate names with a comma.