9mm meanderings…

[Kerf]

After many years of shooting and reloading, I’ve finally had my 9mm epiphany (hat tip) in the form of a CZ 75 B SA, along with the obligatory custom part upgrades. So, in the course of researching the 9mm, (because, I don’t know anything about it) and gathering components and myriad other stuff, I came across a few articles I found enlightening. I’m sure you guys here probably are thinking ‘Well, that’s not news, everybody knows that’. I didn’t. Just thought I’d share my meanderings.

Powder first: BE-86 – never heard of it. What caught my eye in the article is, he lists a load for a .40 S&W with a 135gr bullet at 1434 fps. Yikes!!! That’s movin’ out. I wonder if that’s a misprint? Looks promising for use in 9mm.
BE-86: http://www.shootingtimes.com/reloading/performance-of-alliants-new-be-86-pistol-powder/

BULLETS: realguns has some opinions on bullet selection. Evidently some premium class bullets don’t all perform that well. Further research confirms most of his findings. I haven’t been able to locate any Gold Dots. Win, Sierra, and Gold Sabers are readily available. From other sources, there may or may not be issues with Gold Sabers shedding their jackets; I haven’t tested them yet, but I’ll find out.
Bullets: http://www.realguns.com/Commentary/comar153.htm

BRASS: While loading some +P .38 Super rounds, mention is made that the Win/Rem were bulging into the unsupported area of the chamber. Whereas, the Starline brass held up and didn’t bulge. I wish I had known that before buying my brass. Who knew?
Brass: http://www.shootingtimes.com/reloading/super-powders-for-the-38-super/

Now I really feel the need for a .38 Super. Don’t know who makes one; maybe STI, Kimber, CZ or Tangfolio?

Kerf

 

[Duvel]

You can get the Witness in 38 Sup.

 

[gamestalker]

Nope, that 135 gr. .40 cal. estimate is not a misprint. I've loaded a lot of 135 gr. Nosler JHP's with Longshot, and they get going real well, they're right in that neighborhood for FPS. from a full size XDM, and they quite well considering.

GS

 

[Gearhead Jim]

Are you reloading for practice ammo, or to carry for self defense?

There are lots of good self defense loads out there, Federal and Winchester 115 gr +P+ both have compiled an impressive record on the street with hundreds of actual shootings. Speer 124 gr +P Gold Dot is also doing well. I don't think handloads are a good deal for SD.

For practice, almost anything that cycles the gun and is reasonably accurate at SD ranges will work well. Some of the plated bullets are quite cheap and just as accurate, for most of us, as expensive JHP.
If you are reloading practice ammo, I do recommend using a flat point or (more money) actual JHP, to help detect any feeding problems in your gun. My pair of third-gen G19's will start stubbing a JHP into the feed ramp if the mag spring gets just a little tired, but they don't have that problem with RN.

 

[Dudedog]

I really like the RMR 124gr 9mm Plated for practice. They have a thicker jacket and a harder core than some plated bullets. RMR offers THR members a 5% discount with the code. Code is Thehighroad5. Just put your THR screen name in the comment box. I have also had good results with MBC coated lead bullets for practice ammo. They also offer THR members a discount with a code.

brassfetcher.com has some neat high speed footage of Golden sabers being shout in to gel.
(as well as other things) Check out what a .50BMG with an AMAX does to the gel block

Widners did have 9mm Golddot bullets in stock a while back, don't know if they still do or not.

I think Alliants BE86 data in 9mm runs to the hot side. If it was me I would back off more than 10% to start, but that' just me.

I like loading 9mm so many thing work well.

 

[Kerf]

thanks for the replys...

Because I have never reloaded 9mm before, I need to work up a target load and then a load for personal defence. I have a chrono set up in the barn similar to the way Realguns does his. Not so much scientific as a pass fail bullet to bullet comparison. I bought a lot of the Gold Sabers; and 300 of the Sierra 125gr, and the Win Notched JHPs. I have a 2 cavity mould in 9mm and Missouri Bullet is on the route I take to the range. (Drove by them for years and never knew they were there.)

Looking forward to testing the Bulls Eye-86 along with 3N37 and maybe some N350. If I keep some good notes, and time permits, I'll try and post some results of my testing.

Only regret is not having bought the Starline brass. Drat! I couldn't help but notice that CZ Custom has .38 Super Comp Starline brass at a very good price; cheaper than 9mm. Guess I could trim them to 9mm. (Joking-not that cheap.)
I am becoming intrigued with the .38 Super though. If CZ came out with one, I would probably run out and buy it. I should get this project finished first.

thanks again,
kerf

 

[GoldieMI]

Now I really feel the need for a .38 Super. Don’t know who makes one; maybe STI, Kimber, CZ or Tangfolio

I bought a RIA Government Model in 38 Super as well as a CZ Dan Wesson Guardian 38 Super in a commander size. Both are fun to shoot, the DW can be easily carried as well.

 

[noylj]

>Powder first: BE-86 – never heard of it. What caught my eye in the article is, he lists a load for a .40 S&W with a 135gr bullet at 1434 fps. Yikes!!! That’s movin’ out. I wonder if that’s a misprint? Looks promising for use in 9mm.

135gn in .40 is like a 90gn bullet in 9x19. A really light bullet. Longshot and Power Pistol can, given the right lot of powder and mix of components, get you close to 1500fps with a 135gn bullet in .40.
BE-86 is not much more than another Alliant entry in the same area as Unique and Power Pistol--and PP is THE most accurate powder I have found for 9x19.
If you want to shoot 90 gn bullets in your 9x19, you can get over 1500 fps with 3N37, N350, Unique, and Herco.

>BULLETS: realguns has some opinions on bullet selection. Evidently some premium class bullets don’t all perform that well. Further research confirms most of his findings. I haven’t been able to locate any Gold Dots. Win, Sierra, and Gold Sabers are readily available. From other sources, there may or may not be issues with Gold Sabers shedding their jackets; I haven’t tested them yet, but I’ll find out.

Realguns? Who are they? Are they talking 9x19 or HOT rifle loads and using the wrong bullet for the given game?
Bullets depend on the gun. For hunting, they then depend on terminal velocity and the game being shot.
I find that Zero and Montana Gold jacketed are the best for accuracy in my 9x19s, 9x21s, and .38 Supers. They aren't hunting bullets and I don't shoot reloads for carry or home defense. You may find something else. I find that, in general, 0.356-0.357" jacketed bullets are more accurate in 9x19 than 0.355" bullets.

>BRASS: While loading some +P .38 Super rounds, mention is made that the Win/Rem were bulging into the unsupported area of the chamber. Whereas, the Starline brass held up and didn’t bulge. I wish I had known that before buying my brass. Who knew?

Who knew what? If you have 9x19 brass, this info is meaningless to you. Did you buy .38 Super brass?
ALL .38 Supers, guns and ammunition are labeled +P per SAAMI.
If you are shooting .38 Super and trying to make the old IPSC 175 power factor for major, it is of some importance. Current 165 PF is easy. If you are simply shooting .38 Super, then, again, it doesn't matter. Over load your ammo, and a supported chamber or marginally stronger cases will be of little aid. 9x19 tends to be a 140-145 PF cartridge and .38 Super is a 150-155 PF cartridge, so all MAJOR loads for either will tend to exceed SAAMI pressures, except for a few slow powders. So, if you are loading to less than MAX loads in your manuals, it really doesn't matter.
I wonder what SAAMI would call a real +P loading for the .38 Super?
I shoot .38 Super and have loaded a lot of rounds HOT for IPSC and used ALL case brans and never had an issue.

 

[Rule3]

If you use the MBC 9mm 124 gr small ball bullets you will fine that they need to be seated very short in the CZ 75. If they are the pointier Parabelleums they will chamber easier.

The CZ 75 has a tight chamber.short leade, Any jacketed bullets will fit normal. Those Small balls are fat and need adjusting,