A British Navy "Sea Service" repro pistol

[.38 Special]

I've wanted one for a couple of decades, but the choice was either high dollar custom or India-made junk. I've been hoping that Pedersoli would decide to offer one, but alas. So here's my brand new piece of India-made junk!

I have a caplock rifle, built from a kit in the 60s or 70s, that is arguably worse quality (it was made by my grandfather and carries enormous sentimental value, but is otherwise worthless) but aside from that, this thing certainly is the worst gun in the house. I have some work to do to get it into any kind of useable condition, and of course will need to drill the vent. The muzzle is actually laughable: it looks like it was attacked by some kind of steel-eating rodent. I honestly doubt it can be loaded without tearing the patch, but also doubt it will matter, as the thing has no sights. I'll fix it anyway...

If the importer is telling the truth, the springs are properly tempered, the frizzen hardened, and the barrel made of quality seamless steel, so I am persuaded that I might be able to make it go off, and not blow myself to flinders. (You're all welcome to argue the latter point, but you'll probably do it without me; I've read enough on the topic to fill a lifetime - however long or short it may be .)

Anyway, I don't have anything I need for loading a .62 smoothbore, powder excepted, so am off to Track of the Wolf. If you look for me at the range, I'll be the guy behind the big cloud of smoke, with the pristine target!

 

[Roverguy]

Well, the importer will want your pictures then, because it looks nice there.

Hope it all goes well.

 

[hawg]

I used to hear bad things about the India made guns bur for the last 10 years or so I haven't heard anything bad. I've seen where several people have bought them and had no complaints. It does look good.

 

[Heir Kommt Die Sonne]

I used to hear bad things about the India made guns bur for the last 10 years or so I haven't heard anything bad. I've seen where several people have bought them and had no complaints. It does look good.

I had a baker rifle made by them; sold it. The lock wasn't tempered nor probably fitted. Would've called for completely replacing it.
It fired fine however, but it just stopped working entirely after a few shots. Hammer wouldn't go to full cock.

This being said... where do you find those indian repros for sale? I got mine from Veteran arms.

 

[.38 Special]

This one came from Military Heritage/Access Heritage. It was a fairly easy decision as, out of the half-dozen importers I am aware of, this is the only fellow who can a gun shipped off in under three months.

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

I had a doglock pistol from India many moons ago, it required a lot of work to make it shoot. Sold it and actually made a small profit. Hope yours is easy to fix. Alexander A shoots India stuff I think. He is a good resource for info on these things.

 

[Slamfire]

I used to hear bad things about the India made guns bur for the last 10 years or so I haven't heard anything bad. I've seen where several people have bought them and had no complaints. It does look good.

I remember the WW2 generation thought all Japanese products were junk, That is until the 1970's when cheap Datsun trucks out lasted anything Ford and Chevy were making. Now Japanese made products are considered quality, too bad most of their industry went to China.

It is impossible to summarize India in one word. Over one billion people, American Colleges graduate more Indian PhD's in science and engineering than "Americans". If India wants to make a good product, they can.

At a state fair, got to look at Mahindra tractors. They looked good. Did not get to drive one. Got to sit on a Royal Enfield motorcycle and the owner loved it. The 650 looks like what a motorcycle should look like, and the in print reviews are all positive.

The Israeli's went to India, not the USA to set up a joint manufacturing of Israeli small arms designs

PLR Systems: Journey of India’s First Private Small Arms Manufacturer

https://raksha-anirveda.com/plr-systems-journey-of-indias-first-private-small-arms-manufacturer/

India, Israel forge partnership for small arms production

https://www.defensenews.com/land/20...-forge-partnership-for-small-arms-production/

PLR Homepage

http://plrsystem.in/index.html

Small Arms Development: Can Private Players Hit the Target?

https://raksha-anirveda.com/small-arms-development-can-private-players-hit-the-target/
Scroll down through the article to see other Indian small arms manufacturer's and what they are making

 

[AlexanderA]

Alexander A shoots India stuff I think. He is a good resource for info on these things.

No, I've never owned an India-made gun, although at times I've been tempted. I do have some Indian (or Pakistani) edged weapons and armor. Even those are of mixed quality, at best. Their Civil War-era bayonets are worthless (and overpriced). Better to pay a few dollars more and get an original.

Here's my rack of reproduction muskets. They're all Italian (and in one case, Japanese). The bayonets, starting with the M1842's (4th from the left), are all originals. (I wasn't able to find a Brown Bess, M1795, or M1816 original bayonet at a reasonable price.)

ETA: Correction. One of the M1842's is all U.S.-made, including an original lock, trigger guard, buttplate, and other parts. The barrel and stock are U.S.-made reproductions.

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

Sorry Alex, I must have confused you with another member, possibly on another forum that I no longer participate in. This person was a big fan of India muskets, never had any of the typical problems.

 

[Heir Kommt Die Sonne]

Sorry Alex, I must have confused you with another member, possibly on another forum that I no longer participate in. This person was a big fan of India muskets, never had any of the typical problems.

Loyalist Dave, I think. He brags about how nice his Indian ones are. (And his are)

 

[Heir Kommt Die Sonne]

although at times I've been tempted.

I mean, just to have a pretty functional piece to play around with on the range a few times, or a throw-away backup to reenactments , its not a bad bargain.
I too fell for this though with my flintlock Baker and Jackrabbit knows how I feel about that. Flintlock mechanisms have to be hand made and fitted. Their percussion guns though, not a thing wrong with them.

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

You're right!! That's the guy I was thinking of!

 

[Speedo66]

Wouldn’t mind seeing an Indian made copy of a Webley Mk IV brought here.

 

[forward observer]

This one came from Military Heritage/Access Heritage. It was a fairly easy decision as, out of the half-dozen importers I am aware of, this is the only fellow who can a gun shipped off in under three months.

I bought the exact same pistol from Military Heritage last December. I ordered it a few days before Christmas and got it under 10 business days--which was amazingly fast considering how far behind most carriers were at the time. I may be mistaken about this but I seem to remember the owner telling me that he had a warehouse in the US that helped to expedite items when in stock as most of theirs seems to be. It was my second purchase from them and I have been pleased with both.

The previous purchase from them was an all-steel Scottish highland (Murdock style) officer's flintlock maybe a year ago. The India-made guns offer the buyer unique historical firearms that cannot be obtained from any of the Italian or Spanish makers unless one gets a one-off custom-made item that will potentially cost 5 or 6 times as much--and at a price of much less than the Europeans are presently getting.



I was quite surprised at how massive this thing is at just over 19 inches long and was also impressed that they went to the trouble to replicate all the British-proof marks on the barrel.


I also have a long land pattern Bess with a lock stamped from Dublin castle that came from Loyalist (Nova Scotia importer of India-made muskets and the like) although I bought it directly from a local muzzleloader/black powder shop. I've shot the Bess numerous times over the past four years while the Murdoch maybe only two or three. I have not had a chance to take the Sea Service to the range yet. However, they all spark like crazy and I have yet to have any mechanical issues.

Cheers

 

[.38 Special]

So far my only real gripe is the trigger. It probably goes 15 or 20 pounds. Judging by that and the hammer pull, I suspect the world's heaviest mainspring lurks inside the gun. I'm not going to be a trigger snob on this one, but I do intend to get it under 10 pounds.

 

[forward observer]

So far my only real gripe is the trigger. It probably goes 15 or 20 pounds. Judging by that and the hammer pull, I suspect the world's heaviest mainspring lurks inside the gun. I'm not going to be a trigger snob on this one, but I do intend to get it under 10 pounds.

Mine's not nearly that heavy but acceptable for what it is so I probably won't mess with it ---luck of the draw I guess.

Cheers

 

[.38 Special]

Mine's not nearly that heavy but acceptable for what it is so I probably won't mess with it ---luck of the draw I guess.

Cheers

Your pictures are fantastic! I am very glad for your posts.

 

[Heir Kommt Die Sonne]

I bought the exact same pistol from Military Heritage last December. I ordered it a few days before Christmas and got it under 10 business days--which was amazingly fast considering how far behind most carriers were at the time. I may be mistaken about this but I seem to remember the owner telling me that he had a warehouse in the US that helped to expedite items when in stock as most of theirs seems to be. It was my second purchase from them and I have been pleased with both.

The previous purchase from them was an all-steel Scottish highland (Murdock style) officer's flintlock maybe a year ago. The India-made guns offer the buyer unique historical firearms that cannot be obtained from any of the Italian or Spanish makers unless one gets a one-off custom-made item that will potentially cost 5 or 6 times as much--and at a price of much less than the Europeans are presently getting.

View attachment 1146389

I was quite surprised at how massive this thing is at just over 19 inches long and was also impressed that they went to the trouble to replicate all the British-proof marks on the barrel.
View attachment 1146390

I also have a long land pattern Bess with a lock stamped from Dublin castle that came from Loyalist (Nova Scotia importer of India-made muskets and the like) although I bought it directly from a local muzzleloader/black powder shop. I've shot the Bess numerous times over the past four years while the Murdoch maybe only two or three. I have not had a chance to take the Sea Service to the range yet. However, they all spark like crazy and I have yet to have any mechanical issues.

Cheers

In the bottom pic that is a US 1860 naval Cutlass.

 

[forward observer]

Yes, I know but rather than point it out I knew some internet commando would come along and do it for me.

 

[hawg]

Yes, I know but rather than point it out I knew some internet commando would come along and do it for me.

 

[Heir Kommt Die Sonne]

Yes, I know but rather than point it out I knew some internet commando would come along and do it for me.

I wasn't pointing it out for you, but to anyone who was interested to know what it was.

It was based and copied on the previous French 1833 naval pattern cutlass, which is the same blade but the hilt was made of cast iron coated with black japaneing. Essentially the best cutlass pattern of the 19th century.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Well, I don't know which side of the fence to sit on, India or the rest of the world, or whatever. However, man the Sea Service pistol has always been what I really really really wanted. And yes, it does look good. What a small game pistol it would be loaded with shot!!!

Dang, Slamfire had to bring up motorcycles. !!!! I'm a motorcycle maniac. The Royal Enfields coming out of India are indeed good bikes. So it's not like the Indians can't make anything of quality, and a reliable bike is a little more complicated than a Sea Service pistol. As long as the lock can be made to function well, and I don't see why not, I think you'll enjoy it immensely.