A solution to knives and motorcycles.

[The Tourist]

something that in the dark could allow me to put a knife in my hand

And that's a valid strategy. However some older southern sheriffs used to nickel plate their shotguns. They wanted everyone to see them get out of a squad car with that firearm.

And that brings up the strange problem with a "biker knife." The act of defense is only one of the uses and needs for that knife.

Unless I wish to ride a dresser, I have limited storage areas and pockets. Clothing and sleeping gear take up almost 2/3's of the volume I have to work with. If I carry tools, that's dead weight. A passenger loads the biker down even further.

To that end, the engines Harley offers in 103 ci and 110 ci are strokers. That is, engines to "twist hard" coming from a dead stop.

My knife is for everything. It's a weapon, it's a food utensil (primarily), a wire stripper, and even a barter commodity. If we were to look for "real bikers" we would simply look for how the guy is "worn out." That is, how do his tires look, are his jeans faded or ripped, has his boots seen their share of rain and mud, and where has he staked his money--on a knife, or just fancy silver conchos.

Like I say, I love my Striders. But if the summer day is sunny, then I need a biker's knife. I'm going to pound it, drop it, wear it down and probably destroy it before its time. Most likely I will never use it as a weapon, although that is one of its uses.

 

[TimboKhan]

Ha! Rokon! My dad has a Rokon back when I was younger and it was slow and stable enough that he let me ride it around largely unsupervised. I used to climb some unbelievably steep stuff with that thing...

Tourist, it strikes me that it would be fairly simple to modify a regular old belt pouch and just attach it to your bike. I mean, it doesn't have to be in your pocket, right? If you added it to your handlebars in some unobstrusive place, it would be fairly inconspicous, and if you wanted to carry it into a roadhouse or something, you just take a second and slip it into your pocket. You could actually probably zip-tie it on with complete satisfaction, and I don't even think it would look cheap...

 

[wheelgunslinger]

I've been riding with a Firstgear Kilimanjaro jacket for the last 3 years (I'm a daily rider, not a weekender) and really am happy with what it will hold.
The two map pockets on each side of the chest hold plenty and are lined so they don't scuff or abrade items.
The chest pockets work really well and have small keeper net pockets on the inside to hold items in there. But, the best part is that they will "tear" open with one hand to reveal the contents. So, if you need to get to a knife, you can. And, it stays put until you need it.

This way, I can park my bike and not have to worry about it being ransacked. I ride and park all over the place too. So, that's a real concern for me.

 

[BigG]

I have a fork bag on my sissy bar. There is really no storage place on most Hog cruisers.

 

[The Tourist]

Tourist, it strikes me that it would be fairly simple to modify a regular old belt pouch

Oh, I'm not saying you couldn't.

Periodically we have posts about problems carrying weapons/tools while on a motorcycle, a bicycle, out jogging, in a gym, sitting in a car all day, etc.

For me, this is the biggest problem. And it is akin to being on a job sitting all day. When I ride I'm more of an "iron butt." It's when I work that I stand all day.

I also feel that carrying a weapon/tool in this manner might save a biker some broken ribs in a fall.

But you are obviously correct. Bikers modify just about everything they touch. I'm picking up Black Betty today. I'm going to post a pic if I can think up a caption that is gun related.

 

[SeanSw]

The only time I went down hard the bundle of coins in my hip pocket dug into my skin and left marks of their own. Even the double stitched pocket hem left a scar over my hip bone. Going down on a folding knife sounds terrible in any configuration and I'll never wear one on my belt while riding. I love knives and if there isn't one on me you can bet there is one around me, but whatever utility they serve while mounted must be precarious. I'll leave mine in the saddle bag.

I ride an old Honda 900f year round and tuck something accessible in the throw over nylon saddlebags when I'm going for a long haul. These old bikes need lots of tools, dont'cha know.

 

[Valkman]

I've been riding with a Firstgear Kilimanjaro jacket for the last 3 years

My jacket of choice also. When I went down a few years ago it protected me well - it ripped, my gloves and boots had holes in them but I was fine. Progressive paid me for that stuff and when I went to buy a new one it was marked $380 and rang up at $110. Now that was a steal!

Here's us at the Grand Canyon a few years ago:

 

[The Tourist]

As you know, I have been looking at ways to carry knives/tools with me with comfort, and in such a way that I do not land on them in a wreck.

I used to carry a fork pouch, something I'm not sure I wish to do now. As you can see, I have replaced the stock fork with one from a 2006 style CVO Dyna inverted fork. The fork itself is brand new, simply a model year that meshes with my 2004.

Any ideas now that you've seen it?

BTW, today was the first time I rode Black Betty with her new fork, front wheel and performance cams.

Yikes...

 

[eliphalet]

Buy a vest

 

[sm]

Nice Bike!!

Seriously, I do see one place, maybe two, where perhaps a lock-box, custom made and it would best to be chromed.

What is that metal "really" like at the rear of seat where I can see the rear wheel?
My mind pictures that area, beefed up, with a chrome box, with a quality custom lock and key installed by a professional locksmith.
Done right, it might not be too thick for comfort, and if you put saddle bags back and over, they would not protrude to give them away, instead conceal even more.

Hide in plain site - if you will, and if done right, works better than concealed.

 

[eliphalet]

Across the frame on the downtubes, a nice black or chrome waterproof tube can be bought, made for just what your wanting. Look in the bike catalogs, vest is still better IMHO.

To the untrained eye it would be in the open but look like it belonged there, a good idea as Steve suggested.

 

[The Tourist]

it would be in the open but look like it belonged there

I was thinking the same thing.

If I put some kind of a lock-box somewhere on the bike, a theif might think that if I secured it, it must be worth stealing.

Harley makes a chrome triangle-shaped tool box from the 1930's, but everyone that rides a Harley knows what it is.

However, if it just looked like a "mechanical thing," people might leave it alone.

For example, in my old house I found a section in my basement where numerous PVC pipes crossed the floor joists. I went to the hardware store, bought a similar section of tubing and two end caps. Bingo, instant home safe for jewelry, knives and firearms.

Well, we moved. I had emptied out the safe months before that, and forgot about the thing completely. By dumb luck, the house had been purchased by my doctor's nurse, and their family remodeled the basement. I told her the story of the false pipe.

She called me a few weeks later. Her husband had torn out a lot of stuff during the remodeling and thought I was joking--until he looked! He couldn't believe that he had spent so much time down there and failed to see a false pipe.

 

[eliphalet]

Folks don't seem to mess with a bike much is my experience. I know it happens but think it is sorta rare.

Bought the one I have now new over a dozen years ago. It has been rode all over the Western USA to Sturgis a couple of times, parked in front of motels, bars, restaurants and at runs, from HOG events to parties like ya see in Easy Riders etc. all over the place under a variety of conditions and no one has ever messed with nuttin.

When I am going to be taking leathers on and off a lot I do wear a older pawn shop jacket and not the Vanson, so I can toss it over the window or use a bungee and leave it and not worry to much. Always kinda expect to have to ride home in the cold with no coat but done that a hundred times and so far so good.

I was sitting in front of a rural restaurant/store once having a cold drink and had a guy ask me " aren't you worried some one will just on ride off before you can get there?" I told him "no that bike can't go faster than the lead I have here in my pocket." He just nervously laughed but I tend to think a lot of would be thieving jerks think that same thing about messin with a guys bike, "it's a good way to get hurt" so they tend to leave em alone. I do lock it if I am out of sight or over night, avoid cities like the plague, and pay my insurance so feel OK and don't really worry. I would hate to lose her or any part, but it's just a Harley and can be replaced.

 

[The Tourist]

Folks don't seem to mess with a bike much

When I am close to home, that has also been my experience. When I ride/rode with my MC I could leave a bag of diamonds on the seat and no one messed with the bikes. But that's not always the case. I like to ride by myself more and more.

As much as I loved Sturgis, I'm not sure I have that in my near future. It's a good time to work, and being off +one week hurts the pocketbook. Having said that, you might just find me on I-94 headed west to play with the youngun's. I'm sure looking for some saddle time.

Another point. You are always reponsible for the weapons you own. If I have an unsecure method of carrying firearms and knives--and a teenager gets hold of one and blows his head off--then I am responsible. More to the point, I would feel bad even though he was a felon.

In fact, I had that thing happen to me once before. One of my first handguns was a Colt Trooper in .357 Magnum. I traded up to a Python by selling the Trooper to a friend. He tired of it and sold it to his friend. Then a woman bought it...and so on.

About fifteen years later, I got a call from the Madison Police about the "parentage" of the revolver in an investigation.

Somehow that gun had wound up in the hands of a crack dealer. One night he heard something outside, and being paranoid, went out to check the area. Like a rookie, he cocked the Trooper with his finger inside the trigger guard, tripped over a garden hose in the dark, fell on the Colt, and put a bullet through the bottom of his jaw and out the top of his head.

I don't begrudge the twist of fate, but it was still with my old gun.

 

[sm]

We all know it is best to have personal defense choices on person.
Not only as we can access them, also control over them as they are in our possession.

Reality is, there are no firearm areas as set forth by legislation by government regulations from Fed, State, County and City levels.
One cannot walk into a local FBI or State Police building with a gun, not where I am anyway.

Add, other restricted areas, as statues allow folks to post no-weapon signs as their discretion.

Then again, just like a lock box for a vehicle, sometimes it is not a gun, instead valuables.
This for me goes way back, before CCW was even a deal in my state, heck back as a kid folks had lockable containers in vehicles.

Taking a trip and before credit cards, having some emergency cash, checkbooks, later traveler's checks ( or copies of those numbers) later, credit card, or important papers like family social security numbers, bank account numbers for kinfolks, maybe relatives out of town, like a kid going to college or parents/grandparents out of town.

Going to a another HS to play ball, swim team , or being a cheerleader and not wanting to trust school lockers, kids that had vehicles had lockable containers.

Going to work out at the gym, well if one does come in, and advertise rings, watches, jlry, and the like, less chance one's locker gets into, or one is later tailed and followed and a victim later on.

So this safe, secure storage is not a new thing, just it seems to have cycled back again as it does from time to time.
CCW , and some requirements for lockable containers with CCW laws and regs adds to this need (even though folks with common sense would do so anyway).

Bikes have always presented a challenge, while they offer one some sense of Freedom on the road/trails they in essence have an equal and opposite restriction aspect as well.

I guess that is why some folks get older, get rid of a bike and get a convertible sports car.
I know one lady that got a Miata for pretty much this reason, and a gentleman got a convertible Mustang as well.

Bikers though, are different, there is a earned trust or respect if you will.
I hate to say "honesty amongst thieves" still this saying applies.

Heck, even real outlaws on bikes don't mess with another bike that belongs to a law abiding person.

If some punk messes with a good guy's bike, these honest outlaws on bikes will come down on them.
There is a Code and that Code runs deep.


Out of site out of mind is still a good rule.
Back in the day folks had these sheet metal and metal workers I mentioned earlier, make a metal box, with a good lock.
They added a cable or chain, that would insert, and the lock was inside the box with valuables.

That idea is now on the market, I forget whom makes these, and in different sizes, I know they will hold a full size 1911 or Med frame revolver with 4" bbl on one size offering.

Back in the day we did not have CD players and what all.
Still folks put those metal boxes made into factory storage area, secured by chain or cable.

Ladies on bikes and girls on scooters, had a small purse, easy to insert and retrieve.
Guys on bikes and boys on scooters, had more of a problem, guys did not do fanny packs, or day planners , so they used "calculator" containers, later something a Sony Walkman with cassette player and radio and smaller head phones to conceal that box.

It actually was just better for boys to use a paper sack, heck even a fast food sack, as folks would rip off a Sony Walkman.

This same metal box with chain or cable worked in cars then, as they do now.
Rental cars for instance, heck even in town and one rents a car as their is in the body shop.
Chain or cable around where seat belt attaches for instance and under the seat.
Easy to access, and easy to remove to take into home, business or hotel/motel.
If one uses a hotel safe, items are in a lockable container, and not a 'Jlry box".


I will say, as I know for a fact, some of these items do not need to be advertised.
Criminals know what these secure containers are, and "hidden containers" are.

They know about false outlets in a home, and can spot one in a split second.
Fort Knoxx did ( maybe still does) books, of various sizes and thicknesses and these are THE worst to get.

Everyone advertised these, retail folks had them out, so not only did criminals already know what these were, folks would visit other folks and look at bookshelves to find that "hidey-hole" book.

Different Book Titles and Authors, still when punks come in, and flip a house, they know to flip books.

My take, and one I harp about a lot, is not advertising.
Too many folks advertise way too much.
Internet does not help, as criminals use Internet, as do wanna be criminals and they get ideas and educated.

Hence the reason one ought to come up with something custom and keep mouth shut about it.

There is a place, for example, with trusted folks, like family, to know what something is, in the event something happens and others need to access it.
Like a bike/ car wreck, or disaster in the home or business.

The Tourist for example, if he came upon something, and he has a trusted friend, or client, and shared , then whom he shared with getting a lockable container would also have to abide by the Code , to not share with another - unless - that person was trusted family or someone like he /she is to The Tourist.

I hate to be this way, just my life experiences have too many real life horror stories of folks getting hammered.
Most often by family and friends.

Folks advertise too much, and others don't mean to, just say and do things where illegal eyes and ears pick up on these.

i.e.
In a public place, making conversation and "well my daughter keeps a spare key to the house with the alarm code in a decorative rabbit in her back yard landscape she did, so if the kids locked them selves out, they could get into the house".

Bingo! How hard is it to find out who that ladies daughter is?

"Yes I am supposed to go see my daughter later today and assist her on some wall paper trim".
How hard to follow this lady and then be led to that daughter's house.

"Yes my son-in-law is a hunter, he got a nice deer this past fall, he has all sorts of nice guns".

See what I mean?
This happens every day, hundreds of times.

 

[The Tourist]

sm, yes, I believe you. However, I don't find the "honor amongst thieves" to be working as good as it once did.

Let me give you and example. Several years ago I made the comment (in a forum) that there had been relative peace between the pimps, bangers and the bikers in my area. One youngster responded that if a biker bothered him he would "taser their azz."

He's right, of course. He was too young to remember serious gang wars and turf problems. In fact, my club once sat down with a national outlaw club because our rags were the same color. At a distance, they might be confused.

As to this debate, I'm wondering if anything I do for security will be respected at any time. If younger guys don't follow any code, that means that they will steal from or trash a bike. Truth be told, I keep my bike within sight unless I'm at a biker event.

Additionally, things have changed legally. Thirty years ago if a townie tried something with a bike, he got stomped. If any cop responded at all (and at that time it was a big "maybe") the most often heard response was, "Well, it looks like justice prevailed..."

The cop would smile as he left and say something funny like, "Oh, and get a muffler on that thing..."

Our club enforcers now report (and right to my face) that if we lived now as we did then we would be under constant scrutiny.

I cannot rely on the "old boundaries." Oh, I don't mind getting physical with some idiot, but I also keep my attorney's number on speed dial on my cell phone. (Yikes, the fact I even own a cell phone disgusts me many times.)

If memory serves, I don't even think the old HD tool kit fits on a Dyna. In that regard it's getting harder and harder to seek safety and still stay in the confines of the law. If any factor plays in my favor it's because now I have gray hair.

However, I will continue to look for some locked device. Your comment on custom fixtures wll be one of the areas I'll check on.

 

[eliphalet]

I guess that is why some folks get older, get rid of a bike and get a convertible sports car

.Some yes but I hope I never have to, but time will tell. Few years ago I had rode out to Neah Bay the farthest NW point in the lower 48. We stopped at a casino to eat on the ride back where I met neat older guy that was on his Goldwing. Told me he was 81 and of the 52 year old he was chasing. Gave me hope at least. Been over 40 years since I got my first motorcycle and I think I enjoy it now as much if not more than back then.

I keep my bike within sight unless I'm at a biker event.

Probably one of the riskiest places to leave a scoot unattended. Life long buddy of mine's friend lost a new 25-35K Big Dog at the Love ride last year, thieves haunt rallies etc. Buy one of the alarms that will alert you up to a mile or two away if it is so much as touched, and remember it is pretty but replaceable, so do things, go places, and enjoy it. I know you do too I guess i am saying I usta worry but life is to short and on good advice I have relaxed and quit worrying so darn much if somethings gets stolen, It ain't a heirloom.

Thats a pretty one you have there Tourist but being afraid to let it out of sight reminds me. A few years back we had rode down to So. Cal. met a bunch hen rode on out through Twentynine Palms to Amboy on the old Route 66 then on to that River Run thing they do in Laughlin. One guy from Ca. that was gonna go had just built this really nice chopper. He had about 60K in it I was told. Well, the paint and chrome was nice and meant so much to him he didn't wanna take it across the desert so he stayed home and missed a fun time. To me that is akin to a custom gun you don't dare shoot. Nice to look at and valuable, but in many ways worthless.

Ride safe, shoot straight, but most of all have fun cause none of this is forever.

 

[The Tourist]

biker event...Probably one of the riskiest places to leave a scoot unattended.

I meant at a pig roast or a "bikini bike wash" held by my club.

Heck, you or I could leave our keys in the bike or the dashboard knob unlocked and still enjoy the afternoon. In the five years I rode as a full-time MC member I never lost anything, and our bikes were parked at the old Wisconsin Inn--facing Paterson Street, and thief's quick getaway to East Wash.

Different times, and change has not made it better.

 

[sm]

If younger guys don't follow any code,

This is a huge key to a lot of today's problems in society.
Folk's ain't being raised right.

Granted some youth today are being parented and mentored , still there is much truth in " I was born in the last great decade".

Being more honest some youth being parented and mentored are not being parented and mentored "right" although the parents and mentors mean well.

Youth are not often prepared for the real world.
Book smarts are fine, grades, GPAs, and graduating early and having college credits earned in HS, does not mean some have street smarts, and values.

Sorry if I offended some, but I have seen some of these youths, and I hope some never see their youth having a Rape Kit done on them, re constructive surgery, plastic surgery, and for damn sure signing the paper so organs can be removed and the kid going through a organ harvest.
BTDT too many times...

These Codes we speak of, Society on all levels used to have them and while they still exist, as time passes, those passing forward are dying off and the younger ones are not being passed onto, or simply "don't want it".

Oh some kid gets stupid, some girl gets upset with boyfriend or some boy gets hurt by a girlfriend and sneaks out a parents car, heck maybe has a couple of beers.
Police officer, stops the kid, has a chat, serious chat, and instead of hauling them in and all the hassles.
Takes the kid home reminding them "everybody gets one time, and you just used yours" and that kid straightens up and flies right.


Bikes are hard to see, just by nature.
Even those raised around bikes even drive bikes, have been surprised by a bike being where it was.

It happens, just like it does with 18 wheelers on the road, all those miles and years of experience, and 18 wheeler can miss passenger vehicle or Bike, and when the Semi Rig is driving a Bike or passenger vehicle, messes up with a Semi Rig.

Difference is, back them one could signal to Bike "OOPs, damn, I screwed up" and the Biker did not chase you down to kick your butt.
Nor did a passenger car if a Biker signaled "Whoa Dude, I came up on you a bit hard, my fault, sorry dude".

Common Courtesy and Respect and other Values are not in Society today as they once were.
Here on THR, we read posts and replies, and how blood lust and road rage is shared.
Even here on THR we have hypocrites, same person that got chased down and yelled at in a "road rage" as they made an honest mistake, will post how they will chase someone else down with twin Deagles blasting.


I remember not long ago, a kid, just being a kid, had this metal toy dump truck.
The mom was carrying this kid, and that little boy was at the stage of wagging that toy dumb truck everywhere.

He dropped that dump truck smack dab on the tank of a Bike, and it scratched it.
He did notmean to, the mom was doing the best she could , and life happens.

This mom, gets the truck picked up, sees the scratch and does not scold the kid, just a kid, if anything her fault for being where she was in relation to bike.

Got a young lady, with a little boy and she approaches and sincerely tells them what happens.
This over 50 couple on this Bike.

One can imagine what all this mom must have felt.
She is standing there, with this couple in denim, he with a ponytail, beard and his wife dressed in denim and vest too.

Little boy does not know, he thinks something is wrong, with his mom's tone and body language and this couple he sees...he is not sure, they are strangers.

"Ma'am, you could have left and never come in to tell us, lets go out and look and not do this inside the store" the wife said, her husband nodding and trying to let the little boy know he thought the toy truck was cool.

Biker couple would take the offer for this mom to pay for fixing, said it happens, they were kids once and messed up by accident too.

Little boy figured everything was all right.
Biker couple offered to let the boy sit on the bike, he liked that.
Fired it up, his eyes got real big, and not sure until he was shown the throttle and what it would do.
Oh the bike going "vroom" and "thump-thump" when he did the throttle was was really neat to the boy.

He let his mom hold his truck, and when handed back to her, he did reach for his truck.
"You trying to get my boy to talk me into a Harley already? this mom asked, sorta laughing.

"Well yeah, they can't start too young, get 'em Bike toy " Biker couple said.

Guess what, that little boy got a toy Bike, and they have run into the Biker couple again.

"Listen you two" this mom said in seeing them again "I need to go out and kick your Bike over, this brat had to have this toy bike, everyone in the store knew he wanted it, and you would not believe how embarrassed I was".

Biker couple knew she was teasing and understood how a little boy can be in a store when they see and want something, especially when a bit tired , hungry and fussy.

Younger mom, raised right, with values.
Biker couple, same way.

Just too many folks today would have left and not fessed up, much less offered to pay for damages.

 

[eliphalet]

Heck, even real outlaws on bikes don't mess with another bike that belongs to a law abiding person.

Lotta Hmmmmmm, that depends on a buncha better left unsaids in that statement.
Real outlaws are just that real outlaws. I have in the past become friends and held a high respect with men that the world would call "outlaw bikers" that had their own code perhaps, but IMO were very honorable men, but dishonest deeds don't stop just cause a guy rides. Bad apples are in every basket.

 

[The Tourist]

Real outlaws are just that real outlaws

Yes, and no. In the real sense of the word, I'm an "outlaw." In the older jargon, "outlaw" simply meant someone who had never joined the AMA. However, my MC is considered "non-outlaw" meaning we are not 1%ers.

Now, to an average citizen, a Mongol, a CMA member and myself driving by would all look the same. And while those fine distinctions mean nothing to the average citizen, they mean the world to me.

he didn't wanna take it across the desert so he stayed home

No worries here. Every part, and I mean 100% of every part, nut, bolt and lockwasher is a genuine Harley-Davidson part. If you could find a 2004 engine, transmission and frame--and copied the recent picture of Betty--you could build a duplicate motorcycle right out of the parts catalog.

My reason is simple. I'm an iron-butt. If I mangle something riding through East T-Shirt, Wyoming, I can get up and running with the exact parts that were broken.

Additionally, being a former HD mechanic, (knowing that Harley used to trounce Master Lock every year in metallurgy awards) I'm satisfied that I can find custom parts that won't fold up.

If you're going to buy a new front end, why buy a ******-Matic 305 re-enforced balsa wood model when I can get a CVO model right from the dealership?

Heck, I'll bet even some bikers here didn't know Betty was 100% HD.