ACR or standard M4 for starters??

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ewan1018

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Hi, I'm new to rifles and I'm not sure if I should get spiced up from fancy toys like ACR or just start with a standard M4 to begin with...
If I go for a standard AR what brand should fit for newbies like me?
BTW i'm new and i like the atmosphere here!! Thanks :D
 
I really doesn't matter if you are just looking for a plinking device. Just buy the best quality you can afford. Personally I'd go for an AR as it can become a bunch of different things if your tastes change. There are so many good manufacturers that it would be had to pick a bad one. It really is, you get what you pay, for though for the most part. Everyone is partial to their own brand so it will be hard to get an objective opinion.
 
While I like the ACR the price tag is a fairly big downer for me. As far as ARs go you can not really go wrong as long as you stick to a known manufacturer. RRA, Spikes, Del Ton, BCM, Colt... the list goes on. The first question is what is your budget? No sense in talking about a LaRue or JP if you only have the budget for a BCM or RRA.
 
I can spare some budget for my new rifle.. Now what I want to know is does ACR worth it's price tag??
 
Training for yourself is SO much more important than the rifle. As Jeff Cooper used to say, owning a piano doesn't make you a concert pianist. I would go with an AR clone just because it leaves you a healthy budget for ammo and training. If you are just buying it for fun, then go with whatever you like.
 
You can get AR+mags+suppressor+ammo or an ACR. I havent heard anything bad about the ACR, its just not worth the extra money (to me).
 
I used to hate AR-15's (bad experience with a Del-ton). So I wanted one of the newer/cooler piston guns. I ended up getting a RA xcr (most affordable). Loved the design for it, but couldn't shoot it as well as an AR. Then the owner of the company started being a, how should I say this without cussing....RUDE and hateful individual to his customers who had credible complaints. Threats of not fixing guns sent and not shipping out orders if he knew you were bad mouthing his company. Then I started thinking: what if this company or design goes south? I have no way of getting spare parts or anything else for said rifle.

Now I seriously doubt remmington's CS is anywhere as bad as RA's, but you should think about parts availability for proprietary designs. There is one source of parts and they can charge and do as they want.

AR's are a standard design (mostly) with parts EVERYWHERE and at affordable prices.

They are also highly reliable when made by a reputable company.

You can get a bcm upper of w/e barrel size you want, a lower with w/e stock, an eotech or aimpoint, lots of ammo, mags, etc etc etc for the same price as the ACR.

Its nice owning something unique, good for conversation, but it sucks blowing your money on what turns out to be something not so grand after the newness wears off and is very basic in configuration. No optics, no extra ammo, no light, etc.
 
Ewan, I'd get get one of the S&Ws and a RDS. As Mr. Roberts mentioned, get training. It is amazing what you don't know. My first training class was after I had retired from the military and been shooting for 30+ years. Learned bunches and now schedule a class a year or as I can afford it.
 
Mot45acp said:
You can get AR+mags+suppressor+ammo or an ACR. I havent heard anything bad about the ACR, its just not worth the extra money (to me).
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This is convincing enough:D
I should get ar + ammo + suppressor + red dot and some training instead of one fancy toy. Thanks for the input.
 
I don't see the ACR as a big improvement over the AR especially for the price, my AR and optics cost is about the same as a ACR without optics.

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So you can have a AR with an ACOG or an ACR with iron sights(that are really made of plastic) its up to you, but I think the ACR is going to drop in price in the next few years any way. Even most of those I've talked to who want one aren't willing to pay more than $1500 for one.
 
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What do you want the rifle for?

If you want something to show off, go with the ACR. If you want to know how to shoot go with the AR. To me it is more important to know how to effectively use the most common type of rifle, however other people just want everyone at the range to go oooooh ahhhh when they open up their gun bag.

Keep in mind that if you want to keep your gun running, you are going to have to become a slightly competent half-a$$ gunsmith. This will be 10x easier with an AR which every gun store proprietor and range officer knows how to use, and will be able to help you fix.

+1 on Robinson. A buddy of mine has an M96, they don't support that system anymore and treat him dirt if he calls for parts. So he generally shoots his sp-1.
 
Sebastian the Ibis said:
What do you want the rifle for?

If you want something to show off, go with the ACR. If you want to know how to shoot go with the AR. To me it is more important to know how to effectively use the most common type of rifle, however other people just want everyone at the range to go oooooh ahhhh when they open up their gun bag.

Keep in mind that if you want to keep your gun running, you are going to have to become a slightly competent half-a$$ gunsmith. This will be 10x easier with an AR which every gun store proprietor and range officer knows how to use, and will be able to help you fix.

+1 on Robinson. A buddy of mine has an M96, they don't support that system anymore and treat him dirt if he calls for parts. So he generally shoots his sp-1.
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Good point :D
The question is, is ACR more of a show off "Tacticool" gun rather than practical to it's price?? Most people seems to feel this way towards it.

Also does ACR, SCAR and other kind of "advanced" AR's part non compatible with standard AR?
 
I've never handled an ACR, but it has a completely different gas system, no buffer tube etc. I can't imagine that much is compatible. If you want something different without a DI system look at a Sig 556 or even a SCAR, both are significantly cheaper than an ACR.

That being said, none of the foregoing are more effective than an AR and you will be less effective since your training is based upon an obscure platform. Think of it like buying your first musical instrument. You can get a piano or guitar and find dozens of teachers and tuners and play your buddies at an impromptu jam session, or you can get a sousaphone: struggle to find a teacher, have to mail it across the country for service, and never be able to pick one up at a party and play. You may really like the sound of a sousaphone but given the foregoing you better really really like it before you get one.
 
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The SCAR and ACR are not advanced ARs. They are proprietary designs. I personally don't see the point in the ACR for reasons mentioned above. The ACR is a good design and if you can spare the coin maybe it is for you. Personally I love the AR platform, it's comfortable, natural, and reliable.(When you're shooting a quality rifle and not a del ton, spikes, etc.) I'm waiting for someone to dispute reliability claims.

I own a couple ARs and have recently been building them. It's all a question about usage. If you're going to be using the rifle for some quality classes then spend the money on a quality AR. Colt, BCM, Daniel Defense, Palmetto State Armory (I have built rifles off of their components but I have yet to see a completed rifle from them.) Look for the infamous AR Chart... this will lead you to making a quality decision.

Now if you're getting an tactical rifle just to have one and have no intentions of training properly with it or if you're only goal is to hang 30 different accessories on the rifle before you shoot it for the first time then get whatever.

But if you want serious answers to platform specific questions start reading forums like M4Carbine.net. Also, before you ask "This or that" tell us what you're going to be using it for.
 
If you want something different without a DI system look at a Sig 556 or even a SCAR, both are significantly cheaper than an AR.
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This is just flat wrong. Sig 556 can be had around the same price as a good quality Colt AR($1100). SCARs are running upwards of $2000. The ACR can be had for about $1500.
 
I have an ACR and AR 's. If you're just starting out I'd get the AR. Mine is an LMT and it is high quality with a great trigger. The ACR is cool, actually genius design of changing barrels,etc, but the trigger sucks...
 
Benbru,
I think he meant to put a "C" between the "A" and "R". Initially I had the same reaction you did, but then I re-read and I'm almost certain that's a typo.
 
Personally, I'd go the AR route. If you can afford an ACR with optic, you can afford a top quality AR and an even better optic.

If you want the ACR, though, who is anyone to say it's not worth it for you?
 
The ACR is a cool design, but I wouldn't pay more then $1100 or so for that piece of kit. The other thing thats not mentioned, is for having a polymer frame, its a surprisingly heavy rifle, weighing in a tad over 7 pounds. Most AR-15s are in the same territory with an aluminum frame. My other hesitation is I'm not sure how available other barrels are for ACR including 1x7 twist 5.56 or say 6.8 SPC.

While 1x9 twist rate is good for 80-90% of all 5.56 shooting (good for bullets up to 69gr), if you're going for either long range or tactical applications of your carbine you will want a 1x7 to utilize the newer heavier-weight ammunition such as Hornady 75gr TAP etc. for their better accuracy at long range and potentially better terminal performance.
 
ewan1018 said:
Hi, I'm new to rifles and I'm not sure if I should get spiced up from fancy toys like ACR or just start with a standard M4 to begin with...
If I go for a standard AR what brand should fit for newbies like me?
BTW i'm new and i like the atmosphere here!! Thanks :D
Click to expand...
If you are new to rifles, I would definitely not suggest getting a High-End AR-15 or an ACR to start out with. They're neat, but first I would suggest getting a .22 AR-15, like a Smith and Wesson M&P 15-22, and some ammo, and practicing with it. Find out if you really like the AR system or not. If you do like it, then I would suggest something like a Rock River Arms rifle. They have many different choices and are good quality, and they are going to be less than half the price of an ACR. That leaves you money to get ammunition and a red dot or other type of scope too!
 
I agree partially with what cal-gun fan said, in that you should get a .22, but if it were me and it was a few years ago, I would get a .22 conversion kit and a middle of the road AR like a smith or a colt base model. I would definitely rent one or try a buddies or a relatives before you buy one, because not everyone likes the AR. A cheaper option would also be to get an AR and a basic .22 like a ruger or a marlin.
 
Ro1911 said:
I agree partially with what cal-gun fan said, in that you should get a .22, but if it were me and it was a few years ago, I would get a .22 conversion kit and a middle of the road AR like a smith or a colt base model. I would definitely rent one or try a buddies or a relatives before you buy one, because not everyone likes the AR. A cheaper option would also be to get an AR and a basic .22 like a ruger or a marlin.
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Hadn't thought of the conversion kit, good idea! Smith and Wesson makes good ARs for good prices too, I would suggest one of theirs.

Also-really think about what you want out of the AR. Do you want something just for plinking and having fun blasting cans and other fun targets, or do you want something that can also keep up on paper? If its the former, I would suggest getting a Smith and Wesson and something like an Eotech red dot or a 1-4x illuminated scope like the Leatherwood CMR, which you can get from SWFA.com with a Burris PEPR mount for $350.
If it is the latter, then I would seriously suggest getting some kind of an AR-style .22 or a conversion kit for one and a bull barrel Rock River Arms rifle with a 3-9 or a 4-12x scope.
 
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