Alliant 2400 for 41 magnum

[Keeperfaith]

Hello all,

I recently bought the Lee Powder Measure kit in hopes of reloading my 41 magnum ammo with ease using their scoops...

However, their chart doesn't have any data for Alliant 2400 powder.

I know I can just measure each load with a scoop, scale and so on.

And I want to get the best accurate load of grains possible. How should I go about doing this?

Do a min/max load and see whats best or start at min and work my way up by 1/2 grain at a time?

Or

Start at max load and work my way down by 1/2 grain at a time?

Any help would be great. thanks

PS: my brass is brand new Starline brass, using Winchester large pistol primers and 210 grain Hornady Jacketed HP bullet, Poweder is Alliant 2400 and using Lyman's 48th reloading handbook. Hope this helps.

thanks

Steve

 

[zxcvbob]

With 296 and H-110 powder, it makes sense to start at the max and work your way down. I don't know of any other powders where you do that though; with 2400 you start low and work up.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I don't know if I would exactly go right to the max load with any powder, not even W296/H110. Even though it's not recommended to download W296, going directly to the max is a bad idea too. With that powder do what Hodgdon recommends, reduce the max charge by 3% and work up. I would never load right to the max charge straight off. There are too many variables for that to be a safe practice.

 

[TwoEyedJack]

I use to reload with the scoops. Then I got an electronic scale and found that the table Lee provides is not terribly accurate. I would be very hesitant to use max loads measuring with the scoops. Also, I think you will find that the granularity of the scoops really limits what loads you can put together. One size scoop will be too little, and the next one up will be too much.

If I were starting from scratch and looking for an accurate and cheap measuring system I would probably get a Lee Perfect Powder Measure (online for around $30 delivered) and an electronic scale. Hornady has one for around $30. That way you can pick whatever charge you want and know you are not going to blow something up.

 

[powell&hyde]

Here is load data from my Hornady 3rd edition for the 41mag 210 JHP. Always start with the start load first then work your way up.

 

[Keeperfaith]

Great stuff, I appreciate the help and the Hornady page too.

I've noticed different manuals have different grain amounts for same powder/bullet combo.

Makes things a bit confusing but I'll use my electronic scale and invest in a powder trickler.

Also, new question...

With my new brass for 41 magnum, do I need to "open" the mouth of the case before I seat projectile or can I just prime, powder and start seating?

Thanks

Steve

 

[rcmodel]

You may need to flair slightly, or at least use a chamfering tool to break the sharp inside edge.

Only way to find out for sure is to try it.


BTW: Buy a powder measure.

Trickling on a scale pan is going to get real old, real fast.
And you don't need that degree of precision on handgun ammo anyway.

+/- 0.1 - 0.2 grain will make no measurable difference in velocity or accuracy.

rc

 

[powell&hyde]

One thing I forgot to mention in my above post is that the chart you get with the Lee dipper kit does not include Alliant 2400 powder as the original company was Hercules and was bought out by Alliant. You can still find it on your chart that comes with the dipper kit under "Herc 2400".

 

[BYJO4]

I suggest you get a good powder measure and do away with scoops. Much more reliable as well as more accurate.

 

[4895]

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=210&shellid=31&bulletid=44

 

[Steve C]

Look at the Lee Powder Dipper Chart for Herc 2400 entry just below Green Dot. This stands for Hercules 2400 which is now Alliant 2400. With jacketed bullets in the 200 to 210gr or lead 215gr LSWC you can use a 1.3cc dipper for 17.5gr load. This will be a full magnum load. I've got 1,400 + fps from 17.5grs ow 2400 behind a Hornady XTP in Win factory primed virgin brass chrono'd from a S&W with 6" barrel. Lee dippers generally throw ligher than they claim.

 

[Keeperfaith]

Thanks Steve C. that sounds like it'll help alot. However, I have to ask is Herc 2400 actually the same as Alliant 2400?

I seriously thought I read somewhere else that one of powders created more pressure so a different grain amount will be needed that what the Herc 2400 said.

I'm not trying to doubt you, I just dont want to blow up my hand or face.

But I'll use my scale to double check the grains when I use the 1.3 scoop.

Would you recommend going lower on the grains considering this is my first time re-loading? The max grains in the Lymans shows 17.8 for 2400.

Thanks for help, I greatly appreciate it and keep the info coming.

Thanks
Steve

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Thanks Steve C. that sounds like it'll help alot. However, I have to ask is Herc 2400 actually the same as Alliant 2400?
Thanks
Steve

Yes, both 2400 powders are the same. If there were any changes other than the normal lot to lot variations they would have to change the powder name for safety. There is so much data around, especially for a powder as old as 2400 that changing it even a little would cause major problems and probably a bunch of lawsuits. I'm 100% sure they are the same formulation. Except for the slightly cleaner version Alliant went to 2 years ago which didn't change the performance by any large means, 2400 is 2400.

 

[rehorne]

41 magnum and 2400, a match made in Heaven!! Get a decent powder measure and scale and have a BLAST

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I suggest you get a good powder measure and do away with scoops. Much more reliable as well as more accurate.

Good is a subjective term. There are expensive and inexpensive powder measures.

For handgun calibers I like the Lee Pro Auto-Disk. For and inexpensive rifle powder measure i like the Lee Perfect Powder Measure. While it's not perfect by any means and it feels like junk it does measure powder accurately every time.

If you have more money to spend the RCBS Uniflow and the Lyman #55 powder measures are both very good tools.

 

[41 Mag]

To be honest I run all my new cases through the sizer, then the expander, then prime, powder and seat the bullet, just as if they were once fired.

I have gone the load and shoot route and found that the case tension on the bullet varied and threw my groups all over the place.

ANother thing I also do is to pick the shortest case out of 25 or so and set up my trimmer and trim the batch I am loading to match. While a ton of folks NEVER trim revolver or pistol cases I have seen the differences in groups myself enough to convince me it is worth the little added effort. You usually only have to do so about every 5 or 6 loadings depending on the loads.

I can also throw out that the Remington 200gr SJHP is a VERY good bullet for the 41mag. Don't let the buy in bulk fool you they shoot and they shoot good. Loaded over 20.5grs of W-296 or H-110 and lit with Win-WLP primers, they will take anything your capable of putting them in the right spot on. Also don't get overly crazy with your crimps no matter which bullet your using. You only need enough to keep the bullets in place during recoil, which with the above load isn't much more than simply the lip rolled into the groove.

If your looking for a good measure do a search on ebay. I have picked up several RCBS Uniflow's for less than $40 delivered and in great shape. Just do some searches and don't get in any rush. Some days there are only a few some days there are 12-15 listed. The more you find the better off your are at getting a good price. Try and find one with both the large and small drum. If your only going to load for the handguns then concentrate on the small drum.

 

[Keeperfaith]

Ok, here's my first time reloading a complete round. 41 Rem. MAGNUM.


I used Hornady XTP 210 grain bullet with 17.5 grains of ALLIANT 2400 In brand new Star line brass.

The final product looks good. I used a Lee hand press w/ Lee Carbine dies and a Lee Factory Crimping Die.


LMK what you think?

Steve

 

[Keeperfaith]

Heres the pics

 

[ArchAngelCD]

It looks like you are seating those primers a bit too hard, especially the top one in the picture. The primers are dented and there's no reason to dent the primers. In the picture the top primer also looks like it's very deep in the pocket so it might be slightly crushed.

Some of the crimps look a bit excessive too but that might be the picture because the ones in the back look fine but the front line 4 look very heavy.

The charge weight of 17.5gr sounds just right for a starting load. Alliant lists 19.0gr as the max and if you reduce that charge by 10% you get 17.1gr so 17.5gr is just about right, IMO of course.

Please don't forget the range report when you shoot them...

 

[Keeperfaith]

I agree the primers look too deep, dented however they are not. The pic is not very clear, but they are scratched. I appreciate your feedback and if you recommend not seating them so deep, I'll give it a try. I was trying to go by the manual which says to seat them in the pocket 0.015, i had it at 0.004 so hence I pushed em deeper. I will rectify this.

Well, I did shoot today and here's the brass and primers after.

Please let me know if the brass looks "good" or shows any signs of too much pressure. I think they look fine but these are literally my first rounds reloaded.

On the crimp: the seating die actually crimped them slightly, but i used the factory crimp die afterwards just in case. If it looks like too much crimp, I'll try to tone it down next time.

Thanks Steve

 

[Keeperfaith]

Here's the pics...

 

[Keeperfaith]

The first pic: is four shots at 15 yards, all in the B-Box but not tight.

The second pic: is six shots at 10 yards, again not tight but all in the heart.

The third pic: is a two inch target but at 7 yards. There are six new shots on it and one old hole. Not too shabby IMO for six shots in a two inch target (except for the squib, I totally pulled that one)...

The fourth pic is an overall pic of my target. You may notice two shots up at the top right of the target. My first four shots were from 25 yards at the tiny two inch target (Not too smart) only three hit the paper and only one hit the two inch target (I'll refrain from posting that first close up pic of my first shots at 25 yards).

So overall, I didn't kill myself, I didn't blow up my hand or my gun. I happy.

Any suggestions for getting tighter groups (besides more practice HAHAHA) is welcome. Should I try different powder, more/less grains of Alliant 2400 or keep as is and just practice more?

I will say I did like the Hornady 210 grain XTP jacketed hollow points. They are a great self defense round. Will they be good for hunting?

Here's a breakdown of my components:

Bullet: Hornady 210 grian XTP JHP
Brass: Starline new brass
Primer: Winchester Large pistol
Powder: Alliant 2400 (17.5 grains)

Thanks in advance for the feedback and constructive criticism.
Steve

 

[Keeperfaith]

I just finshed cleaning my S & W 41 magnum revolver and noticed on the inside where the yolk sits flush w/ the inside frame there were some grains of powder. Not alot, maybe 2 or 3 grains scattered inside and on the front of the cylinder.

I dont shoot a lot of revolvers so I dont know if this normal or if my crimp wasn't sufficient on a round or two...

Please advise.

Thanks
Steve

 

[ArchAngelCD]

A little powder left over is just fine especially since you are reporting only a few grains.

As for the brass, those spent primers look just fine, almost textbook for that matter. It looks like you are well on your way to reloading sir. Well done!

 

[41 Mag]

When using 2400, I have never found an instance where I DIDN"T have some pieces left in the barrel or elsewhere. Simple the nature of the powder. THe lower the loads usually the more powder left.

This said it has never been an issue and doesn't mean to jusp straight onup to the top end loads to try and get rid of it. Take it easy on your Smith, it isn't a Ruger and while it might handle a round every once in a while, loaded to Ruger Only spec's there is no need what so ever to go there. Like I mentioned above, I shoot the 200gr Rem. SJHP 98% of the time, at a very docile load. IT has always shot VERY well accuracy wise and dropped everything I have put it squarely on.

THe 210's are great as well I just managed to get a lifetime supply of the Rems while the prices were still low and, well they simply work.

Your groups look great as does your brass. If you get into s situation where your brass doesn't simply slip right out of the cylinders then your pushing the limits for your revolver. It should easily dump right out of fairly clean chambers with nothing more than a little shake or possibly a nudge with your ejector. Again no reason to get into that territory, you will be fine with most any load below that. I have found that the 41 is very much underrated, and I guess it is simply due to it not being popular. I have never felt the NEED to head out with anything bigger, even though I do have plenty that are more powerful.

Good luck with your loads and practice, practice, practice. It won't be long until your shooting like that at 25 and 50yds.