Ammo bought from shady lgs

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Sentryau2

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OK so I bought some ammo from a really shady LGS. One that in the past has been under investigation by the atf. Not something I would normally do but I needed ammo asap so I grabbed a box. Ive shot a few rounds off and it seemed ok not great but OK.
Today I was goofing around testing out my new knife and cut out the barcode "proof of purchase" as I did I noticed there were TWO stickers on the box (laid over the top of each other) this is federal powershok ammo. The stick on top was .223 64gr the sticker below (underneath the one I peeled off) says .222rem 50gr. The headstamps say .223 rem the primer is sealed with blue lacquer? But the primer pockets look odd.
So what's going on here, factory mix up? LGS being shady again and selling reloaded rounds as new? Or am I just being over the top paranoid?
 
Most likely Federal ran out of .223 boxes and stole some off the .222 line. The blue lacquer leads me to believe that's genuine ammo, unless the LGS really really wanted to put a lot of extra effort into it.
 
Thanks I considered something like that. Sometimes my imagination gets the best of me. I was just concerned because I loaned 10rds to a buddy without bothering to check headstamps or compare a few rounds
 
So pull a bullet and weigh it? It should weigh either 50 grains or 64 grains.

Do a Google of each and see what the boxes look like? Compare what you have to what you see online for box images.

Overlaying bar code labels on packaging is not all that unusual. Yeah, personally I think you are being too paranoid but whatever trips your trigger. Also, it's unwise to refer to a gun shop as "shady" unless you plan to substantiate that statement.

Just My Take....
Ron
 
Sounds to me like there was an error made during production/printing of the ammo boxes. IE: a bunch of 223 boxes were made with 222 bar codes. If all the other labeling was correct for 223 why throw away the boxes? Print the correct bar code on rolls of white stickers and send the whole mess over to a sheltered workshop type place to have the stickers applied.
 
What does the front of the box say? All the ammo I've ever bought has caliber and bullet weight printed on the box.
 
I apologize, the relevant info is about halfway through the article.

The prosecutor said Marsh's repeated thefts from Riverview led to a federal investigation of the store, which resulted in convictions of the owner, David Laguercia and a former salesman, Krystopher DiBella on federal misdemeanor record-keeping charges. DiBella was placed on federal probation while Laguercia surrendered his license to sell guns and is awaiting sentencing.
Click to expand...
 
So, what are the specific charges against the store - not some other? The ATF investigates dealers from time to time, and they do play it up to appear like they are doing their job.

Purchasing relabeled boxes from the ammo maker who's trying to cut expenses isn't it. I work retail and see it happening all the time. Very few retailers have bar code printers or bother - if anything the distributors who are changing buy the stock, send out relabels with their bar codes, the store updates it's scanner logs, and the new product comes in a clean box. But that is done in large corporate chains who have the logistics to expend with major suppliers.

ATF looking over the books outside a normal inspection would be an investigation - but is that dealer a specific entity of interest, or are they following a chain of custody? Since it was brought up, what other evidence makes the store shady? Inquiring minds want to know.

I've found in a lot of cases it's really a matter of cultural and socio-economic bias.
 
Take pics and email them to Federal customer service. I am sure they can clear it up.

Also x 2 for pulling and weighing the projectile.
 
Devonai said:
I apologize, the relevant info is about halfway through the article.
Click to expand...
I believe that qualifies. :)

I am not saying that shady or less than above board shops do not exist. I am saying if you are going to call someone business and livelihood shady you should be able to back it up and substantiate the claim.

Thanks
Ron
 
So ... you intentionally bought something from a shop you consider "shady," knowing it has been under investigation in the past, and now you're questioning the validity of the product?

The gun shop is not the problem in this story.
 
Not really a fan of the hostility in my thread. Yes the gun shop is shady. No formal charges were brought but this is small town america so that's not uncommon. This man sold a gun illegally to an ex relative of mine when I was a child. Letting known convicted felons hangout over the gun counters.
I bought ammo from a pawnshop I dislike because I didn't have the time to drive an hour away to get 20rds for a hunt. If you have a problem with my thread you're more than capable of scrolling past it. Thanks.
Edit: I'm not generally this paranoid but my buddy just lost a rifle due to reloaded ammunition he bought from someone else.
 
The link is interesting but how exactly does that make the gun shop "shady"? Now a link to a gun shop of selling guns "off the books" and being convicted of such would suffice as shady.

Ron
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Ron,
That's criminal in my book. I think of "shady" as being on the fringes of legality without actually stepping across the line. I believe Bill Clinton is shady as he seems to be constantly pushing the envelope of legality in most things he does.

I do not fault the OP for being cautious.
 
No formal charges filed.

A 15 year old complaint never acted on.

"known felons hang around the counter."

Well, no doubt the local LEO's know it and keep an eye out. No big deal, MOST FELONS DON'T BUY GUNS FROM FFL'S! There's this thing called NICS that prevents a lot of that.

There is also the concept that being a felon may not necessarily mean you were convicted of a violent gun crime. And the idea that they shouldn't have guns as an entire class of citizen might be a bit overboard. No argument some rightfully lost the privilege, but a treasurer of a company who embezzles $100,000 isn't a violent criminal. Serve time, GET REHABILITATED, get out and move on.

Frankly, you don't "know" if you associate with known felons on a daily basis. It might have happened a long time ago for something non aggressive and they simply got caught. Lots of illegal things happen every day and people don't. In the big picture of ultimate "goodness" I think I would rather hang out with some felons who know they did wrong rather than "innocent" citizens who think they never can.

If we could map not only the sex offenders but also the drug offenders, thieves, burglars, etc you be amazed at how many felons are right next door.

Point being if you have a "shady" business in town it goes to your town being kinda "shady," and you are just part of it. Ever think of moving to some place where all the shady characters don't live? You work and live around them right now.

Somebody has an overdeveloped sense of righteousness. Get over it, none of us is as pure as the driven snow. We compromise our ethics, rub shoulders with the great unwashed, do business with people we'd otherwise shun - and laugh and joke with them in the process.

Like I said, just bias. "Those people are shady." And you bought ammo there. A 20 mile drive vs. local convenience basically set the price on your ethical value. "Shady" was easy peasy to accept.

Don't dress it up, most of us do it too.
 
scallop said:
Take pics and email them to Federal customer service. I am sure they can clear it up.
Click to expand...


^^^This. They will let you know one way or the other and if there is something "shady", they will pursue it I bet.
 
Could be a mix up at the factory that was later sold at a deep discount.They may have these boxes as they were cheaper to get a hold of and sell at factory retail.
 
why are you guys hounding him for using the word "shady" to describe an unnamed gun shop?!?!?

....yes he did eventually post a link that identified the store, but his OP never mentioned any specifics and I don't understand why some of you guys are tearing into him for a rather small piece of information that was only partially relevant to the discussion. he only mentioned that detail because he wanted people to understand why he would have any doubts about his ammo in the first place.

the general consensus on applying the term "shady" to a business is irrelevant...if the man feels a store is "shady" that is his own opinion and he is free to share those feelings even if he specifically named the LGS in question.

Somebody has an overdeveloped sense of righteousness. Get over it, none of us is as pure as the driven snow. We compromise our ethics, rub shoulders with the great unwashed, do business with people we'd otherwise shun - and laugh and joke with them in the process.

Like I said, just bias. "Those people are shady." And you bought ammo there. A 20 mile drive vs. local convenience basically set the price on your ethical value. "Shady" was easy peasy to accept.

Don't dress it up, most of us do it too.
Click to expand...

completely uncalled for. this thread was NOT about the LGS(at all) until you went all pitbull on the word "shady". his level of confidence in a particular LGS was not up for debate and making such rude inferences about his character/morals is not only silly, but unnecessary.
 
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....yes he did eventually post a link that identified the store
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Where did this happen? I saw a link to a story about an unrelated shop by someone else, but never anything about the shop in question.


this thread was NOT about the LGS(at all) until you went all pitbull on the word "shady".
Click to expand...

The title of the thread:

Ammo bought from shady lgs
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First sentence of the thread:

OK so I bought some ammo from a really shady LGS.
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The actual questions asked in the original post:

So what's going on here, factory mix up? LGS being shady again and selling reloaded rounds as new? Or am I just being over the top paranoid?
Click to expand...

I think it's fair to say the OP is the one who invited the LGS issue to the party.
 
I'm sorry your right, the OP *never* even revealed the LGS in question....which makes my points even more true.

So what's going on here, factory mix up? LGS being shady again and selling reloaded rounds as new? Or am I just being over the top paranoid?
Click to expand...

yeah sure. let's just pick and choose what part of his post to highlight....maybe you guys didn't read the entire thread before commenting? maybe you would have seen his first reply after receiving good, helpful information from a fellow poster:

Sometimes my imagination gets the best of me. I was just concerned because I loaned 10rds to a buddy without bothering to check headstamps or compare a few rounds
Click to expand...

anyways I have no horse in this race, just happened to read this thread(entirely. top to bottom) and was a little taken back by the rude, "hostile" nature of some of the replies...uncalled for especially given the OPs own self-awareness displayed in the portions I've highlighted.
 
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