Another Recommendation for MAG20 / MAG40

[Craig_AR]

I just completed MAG40 in Memphis. OUTSTANDING use of training time and money. There are plenty of other reviews and recommendations online in forums and web sites (like here) to take Massad Ayoob's classes, so i don't need to go into details here. The two days of classroom on legal issues and handling incidents really went deep, with a lawyer in the class to earn Continuing Legal Education (CLE) credit. Then the two days of firearms training took me from basically a cr@ppy shot on day 1, to passing the qualification course with a score of 298 out of 300 at the end of day 2!

The group of 10 students in the full MAG40 was a fun mix, including a family of four: mom, dad and two early-20s sons. To help us be ready to disabuse the unwashed in their assumption that gun-folk are poor, uneducated people, Mas brought to the front of the classroom the four students with doctoral degrees: one J.D. (lawyer), one DVM (veterinarian), one DDS (dentist), and one DSc (scientist). 40% of the class have doctorates.

On the range with 15 students, we had three students shoot perfect 300, matching Mas's score, and one of them beat Mas by having a tighter group. That top shooter was the 22 year old, a member of his college's pistol team and biochemistry major; his dad came in next with a 299. Cool family.

Do whatever you can to take either both MAG20 classes (classroom and livefire) in separate chanks, or the full MAG40 when you can spare the 4 days. You will not be disappointed.

 

[Kleanbore]

Thanks, Craig.

One thing about training: one dies not know what one does not know. Would you like to take a stab at listing your personal impressions of, say, the most important seven to ten things that you believe that most handgun shooters who have not involved themselves in such training are likely to not know about defensive skills, tactics, and strategy?

 

[Craig_AR]

the most important seven to ten things that you believe that most handgun shooters ... are likely to not know about defensive skills, tactics, and strategy?

Ah, yes.. we don't know what we don't know. That is why we seek knowledge from qualified experts. We expect them to tell us about what we know we do not know, but the real benefit is the topics they know we need that we were not aware of.

So much could be covered here.

First, almost no untrained realize there are five key aspects essential to have a legally justified claim of self defense: innocence, imminence, avoidance, proportionality, and reasonableness. To understand these, follow Andrew Branca at Law of Self Defense and on his YouTube channel. Get and READ his book, currently free for S&H from his site.

Next, consider what it takes to STOP an attacker. This means understanding the physiology of the body and the difference between disabling the attacker and stopping the actions. Mas covers this in detail in his MAG classes, but until you can get to class, read about them in his book Deadly Force.

Third major category is how to deal with the aftermath. What should you tell the responding police? What should you not do? Are you ready not only for possible criminal charges, but also civil suit from the perpetrator or his family? Do you know the roughly ten things NOT to do that are common myths about self defense? A second recommendation to read Deadly Force for these items.

The night after my class I had dinner with a cousin, a highly trained senior naval officer and regular shooter. Over fajitas and enchiladas he quoted two of the myths as his knowledge. He did not know what he did not know.

 

[Kleanbore]

Great!

 

[Kleanbore]

Recalling a couple of other things....

From Ayoob:

• Witnesses may see and honestly recall seeing the defender's actions only after he has fired, and not what precipitated the use of force
• Don't overlook the tail gunner (accomplice)
• Do not forget the legal risks, the physical risks, and the futility of trying to detain a suspect
• Handgun bullets are not death rays, and an attacker may be able to shoot or stab even after receiving solid hits
• Be the first to call it in

From LoSD (training and Andrew'a blog post discussions)

• OIn a use of force incident, the conditions that may justify the use of deadly force can exist very briefly and then cease to exist in an instant, and perhaps reoccur again
• Use due caution when handling an inherently dangerous item, and consider what may be downrange
• Remember that even if the defender does everything right, there is a real possibility that he will be convicted anyway--maybe ten percent, due to the "noise" in the process
• The politicization of the criminal justice system is becoming a serious issue
• There are differences among stand your ground laws
• "Caste doctrine" eliminates the duty to retreat in the covered places; other laws, which vary among jurisdictions, may address the use of force

Others?