Any Feedback On .38 Spcl Fired Cases?

[otisrush]

I finally was able to get to the range and fire the first rounds of .38 Spcl that I loaded up.

The pic below shows six fired cases from 3 different loads: 3.1gr, 3.2gr and 3.3gr of HP-38 - under 158gr LSWC bullet.

Does soot on the case represent any sort of issue (or anything) - such as unburned powder? In general they seem pretty dirty. I don't know if that's typical for HP-38 or not.

In general I'm just wondering if there is any feedback folks have re: cases that look like this. The 3.3gr shot a lot better (accuracy) than the lower charged ones. So now I'll load up a good chunk of 3.3gr, and also some hotter ones to test out.

Thanks.

OR

 

[ReloaderFred]

Soot on the cases is caused by low pressure loads, since the case doesn't expand enough to completely seal the chamber.

Even your 3.3 gr. loads are below the start load in my Lyman Manual, so you've got room to go higher with your charge.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[bluetopper]

Where did you get your data from. Minimum published load is 3.8gr..

Your load doesn't have enough pressure to expand the brass to the cylinder walls to seal the gas off.

 

[moxie]

As noted above, the loads you are using are too light.

However, regarding the brass, the cases are fine. Use them again. A little soot doesn't hurt the brass and may be present even when you shoot good published loads.

 

[njl]

Hodgdon's published data for that combination is 3.1gr to 3.8gr. Their data is sometimes overly conservative though.

 

[otisrush]

Hodgdon's published data for that combination is 3.1gr to 3.8gr. Their data is sometimes overly conservative though.

This is why I started with 3.1gr.

I figured the cases themselves were fine. I knew I was starting lite - and as a result made doubly sure the bullet made it out of the barrel.

Onward and upward as they say.

Thanks.

OR

 

[Reefinmike]

Ive never really gotten a full proper brass to chamber seal using a 158gr bullet and hp38 min to max. Once i dropped the alox bullet lube and started powder coating my bullets, the cases were much much cleaner after firing. Most of your soot is bullet lube.

 

[W.E.G.]

Harmless.

Tumble and reload.

 

[Steve C]

If you look up other data for HP38 from Speer and other bullet makers you will see that the Hodgdon data is quite light. Hodgdon's lead bullet data was listed by them as "Cowboy Action" loads and now comes up without the Cowboy label which is all the data they ever provided for lead bullets. Look to other sources for HP38 data using lead bullets if you want loads with more than mild low power CAS loadings.

When SAAMI pressure standards used CUP the maximum standard pressure was 18,900 CUP and +P was 22,400 CUP, not to be confused with PSI as currently used. Hodgdon lists their pressures as shown below in CUP much lower than standard pressure level thus using their data at less than max you get a poor case seal and lower performance than typical factory standard pressure loads that should run 800 fps + from a 4" revolver. If you want to match factory standard pressure loading with lead bullet you should use 3.8 to 4.1gr.

Notice the pressure of the Hodgdon loads is much lower than max for standard pressure.

 

[moxie]

This is why I started with 3.1gr.

I figured the cases themselves were fine. I knew I was starting lite - and as a result made doubly sure the bullet made it out of the barrel.

Onward and upward as they say.

Thanks.

OR

How do you determine that Hodgdon's data is "overly conservative?"

 

[GooseGestapo]

I won a bunch of PPC service gun matches and shot numerous 480's(480 possible), and a couple of national records with 3.2 gr under a 158gr lswc. From a 4" bbl, it's only ~675fps, and 750fps from 6". Soot is bullet lube residue.
It indeed is very light. Precision Delta used to load 3.6gr in their match loads which is usually most accurate with swaged lead bullets. I preferred larger cast.
4.0gr typically duplicates factory standard, and 4.4 is +P.
My favorite wadcutter load is 3.2 with DEWC seated near flush. Very, very accurate.

 

[Rule3]

Originally Posted by otisrush View Post
This is why I started with 3.1gr.

I figured the cases themselves were fine. I knew I was starting lite - and as a result made doubly sure the bullet made it out of the barrel.

Onward and upward as they say.

Thanks.

OR

How do you determine that Hodgdon's data is "overly conservative?"

You quoted the wrong person or response??

Hodgdon data compared to others is usually on the light side compared to say Layman.

Heck, Speer lists for their soft 158 gr bullets 3.6 to 4.1 for HP38 and they have 3.8 to 4.3 for w231 (not that that makes any sense)

HP38 at the low end leaves a lot of soot.

 

[Average Joe]

I use the same powder and bullet, loaded with 3.5 grains, and I get the same sooty casings, just ignore it, its nothing.