Anybody else have problems with .38 in .357 lever action?

[Kurt S.]

I have begun having problems with .38 spl in my Winchester 94 AE. When I first got it, I shot a few rounds of .38 without a problem. Now, since .357 is a little hard to find, I am shooting .38s in it and am having jam problems.

I have kind of a light, slow, stroke- is that the problem?

Note: I can't reload .357 since my bench has been dismantled and stored on orders of the boss. Never quite got the hang of reloading anyway; need more practice, I guess.

 

[ArmedBear]

My Marlin works pretty well with .38s, and they're really accurate.

For best feeding, I like bullets without a shoulder (not LSWCs). I handload .38s with FP Oregon Trail bullets and they feed well and shoot better in the 1894C.

Bullets like these work pretty well:


These are a bit touchier:

 

[TimboKhan]

I have kind of a light, slow, stroke- is that the problem?

This is just my opinion, but I say yes. Or, better put, "Maybe". Those levers aren't meant to be flipped about Hollywood-style, but they also aren't meant to be treated like fine china. A firm, decisive stroke would be my first diagnostic, and then move on from there...

 

[Kurt S.]

Bear, I've got a small supply of hard lead 'cowboy' loads with a bullet profile like in the RH side of your top picture; round-nose flat point. I notice the problem is most pronounced with 130 gr. FMJ- might be the problem "doc, it hurts when I do this" "then don't do that".

As I said, I can't set up the reloading bench right now so handloads aren't an option.

Timbo, I use the same type of cocking stroke with my 39A and my Marlin 95 (much as I love watching old cowboy movies, just not my style), no problem, but I was thinking that the shorter .38 vs .357 might be a part of the equation.

 

[msiley]

I've fed my 92 clone SJHP and Soft Points in .357 and SJHP in .38s and
so far not a problem. Do you think because the 94 was orig.
designed for a longer cartridge (30-30) that could be a problem? (just guessing).

 

[flipajig]

I have a m94 in 44mag and 30-30 with no feeding problems. except wiht Wadcutters jhp feed great.

 

[P. Plainsman]

Yes, my Marlin 1894C had a lot of problems feeding .38 Specials. Which is a shame, because they were a ball to shoot and very accurate.

Then it also started to choke on .357s. Then I sold it.

Wonderfully enjoyable little carbines ...... when they work.

Will try again with another Marlin .357 levergun someday.

 

[Meeteetse]

My Browning 92 is very length sensitive and often chokes on short bullet .38's even if I slow stroke it. Often a good gun smith can eliminate the problem. It is usually caused by the lifter. If you buy ammo look for .357 cowboy loads if you want a mild load for general shooting and save the .357 mags for hunting, etc. Most .357 cowboy loads are loaded to .38 velocities.

 

[kanook]

how is it not feeding? is it going in partial and then sticking? maybe polish it up a little or set up the bench for a day and crank out some 357. My boss shoots, so she helps me reload. which is good, but I have to reload twice as much.

 

[outerlimit]

I have begun having problems with .38 spl in my Winchester 94 AE. When I first got it, I shot a few rounds of .38 without a problem. Now, since .357 is a little hard to find, I am shooting .38s in it and am having jam problems.

That's not an uncommon problem from what I hear. I would stick to .357's.

Just keep looking, they'll turn up. I'm sure it's one of the calibers at the top of the ammo manufactures list, since it was one of the first to become hard to find.

 

[Dark Skies]

I shoot the Winchester AE.357 at my local club. I was shooting cowboy action loads last time. They were a bit loud for the permitted level in our indoor range. When I suggested I ought to go for some softer .38 specials next session pretty much all the lever action guys thought this would be "a bad idea" and that I'd have problems feeding and possible breakage of the cartridge carrier / lifter. I don't think the AE has .38 / .357 marked on it - just .357 - that's probably for a reason.

I also had the Marlin 1894 CS - that had zero problems feeding either - and I seem to recall that these calibres are marked on the rifle.

 

[Kurt S.]

Thanks for the replies, y'all

I have gotten the sense that what outerlimit and Dark Skies are saying is probably nailing it down. How about that, a Texan showed up by a Brit on a gun question, Dark Skies, looks like you got some bragging rights at club this week!

I'm just going to break down and dip into my emergency supply of .357s and hope to replenish later. But-If I can't find any .357 soon I reckon I'm going to have to make a visit to the jewelry store or quilt shop, soften up the boss to let me move my bench back in the house.

 

[woof]

The issue with .38 spcl is overall cartridge length. I don't recall the length you should try to stay over, but if you compare different ammo and try something with longer than average overall length, I would bet your problem disappears.

 

[ArmedBear]

Note also that the Winchester 94 is designed for the .30-30, though it was offered in pistol calibers.

The similar rifle that was actually designed for cartridges the length of the .38, .357 and .44 was the 1892.

Marlin makes 4 different actions for different cartridge sizes. The Marlin 1894 is made specifically for these pistol calibers, and their longer 336 is made for the .30-30 and similar. So the behavior of a Winchester 94 might be a bit different from a Marlin 1894.

 

[mainmech48]

I'd agree that a goodly portion is likely due to the action length. I have two Rossi M92 clones and an IMI Timberwolf pump. All of them cycle and function perfectly well with .38 Spl. loads, with the notable exception of full WCs. FWIW, a firm, positive lever stroke produces the best results on both my M92s.

Kurt, PLEASE stop using any FMJ ammo in a tube magazine!! Even RN! There are specific warnings regarding this in both the Rossi and IMI manuals, and for the same reason that the manufacturers warn against using pointed or "spitzer"-type bullets in a carbine or rifle with a tube mag.

Under recoil or even a sudden jolt from rough handling, it's distinctly possible for the inertia of the loaded rounds in the tube to cause a primer to detonate from impact with the nose of the round behind it. The results can be disasterous, so please don't chance it.

 

[TimboKhan]

I just bought a 1894 in .357, and I take back what I said about the stroke being the issue. I cycled a variety of rounds through mine last night, and while the .38's fed pretty good, for some reason CCI Blazer .357 rounds would not feed reliably. I withdraw my opinion with the caveat that I wasn't sure that was the only problem to begin with, but just a starting point to diagnose...

 

[Kurt S.]

Final decision: reach into my emergency supply of .357 factory loads and hope this ammo hoarding hysteria or US Government plot to deprive us of ammunition or whatever it is ends soon. Or maybe just not fire the little rifle until after it ends, or I can get the boss to let me bring the loading bench back in the house. Call me a sissy, but I just can't see myself loading rounds in a closed garage in the middle of a Houston summer.

Kurt, PLEASE stop using any FMJ ammo in a tube magazine!! Even RN! There are specific warnings regarding this in both the Rossi and IMI manuals, and for the same reason that the manufacturers warn against using pointed or "spitzer"-type bullets in a carbine or rifle with a tube mag

mainmech48, words of wisdom. However, I was using Remington UMC 130 FMJ with a rounded profile, goodsized meplat, nice and flat. If get pre-ignition with that bullet profile and the mag spring in the 94, which puts me in mind of a front coil spring from a '67 Chrysler, then I'll just have to put up with whatever fate has in store. That said, I've never used a full roundnose in this or any other lever and never will, as I did have in mind consequences like you mentioned.

 

[texas chase]

no problems

I have an 1894 Marlin and shoot .38's w/o problem. I just shot in a match this weekend and not a single hiccup.