Anyone have accurate information regarding carrying in national parks and poaching?

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Foofles

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I'm sure some of us here have some links on hand that are accurate when it comes to this, I would like to get the nit and gritty on if carrying in national parks correlates to more poaching.

Many thanks in advance! :cool:
 
Link to the text of the amendment:

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/amendment.xpd?session=111&amdt=s1067


Text of the Amendment:
SA 1067. Mr. COBURN proposed an amendment to amendment SA 1058 proposed by Mr. Dodd (for himself and Mr. Shelby) to the bill H.R. 627, to amend the Truth in Lending Act to establish fair and transparent practices relating to the extension of credit under an open end consumer credit plan, and for other purposes; as follows:


At the appropriate place, insert the following:

SEC. __. PROTECTING AMERICANS FROM VIOLENT CRIME.

(a) Congressional Findings.--Congress finds the following:

(1) The Second Amendment to the Constitution provides that ``the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed''.

(2) Section 2.4(a)(1) of title 36, Code of Federal Regulations, provides that ``except as otherwise provided in this section and parts 7 (special regulations) and 13 (Alaska regulations), the following are prohibited: (i) Possessing a weapon, trap or net (ii) Carrying a weapon, trap or net (iii) Using a weapon, trap or net''.

(3) Section 27.42 of title 50, Code of Federal Regulations, provides that, except in special circumstances, citizens of the United States may not ``possess, use, or transport firearms on national wildlife refuges'' of the United States Fish and Wildlife Service.

(4) The regulations described in paragraphs (2) and (3) prevent individuals complying with Federal and State laws from exercising the second amendment rights of the individuals while at units of--

(A) the National Park System; and

(B) the National Wildlife Refuge System.

(5) The existence of different laws relating to the transportation and possession of firearms at different units of the National Park System and the National Wildlife Refuge System entrapped law-abiding gun owners while at units of the National Park System and the National Wildlife Refuge System.

(6) Although the Bush administration issued new regulations relating to the Second Amendment rights of law-abiding citizens in units of the National Park System and National Wildlife Refuge System that went into effect on January 9, 2009--

(A) on March 19, 2009, the United States District Court for the District of Columbia granted a preliminary injunction with respect to the implementation and enforcement of the new regulations; and

(B) the new regulations--

(i) are under review by the administration; and

(ii) may be altered.

(7) Congress needs to weigh in on the new regulations to ensure that unelected bureaucrats and judges cannot again override the Second Amendment rights of law-abiding citizens on 83,600,000 acres of National Park System land and 90,790,000 acres of land under the jurisdiction of the United States Fish and Wildlife Service.

(8) The Federal laws should make it clear that the second amendment rights of an individual at a unit of the National Park System or the National Wildlife Refuge System should not be infringed.

(b) Protecting the Right of Individuals to Bear arms in Units of the National Park System and the National Wildlife Refuge System.--The Secretary of the Interior shall not promulgate or enforce any regulation that prohibits an individual from possessing a firearm including an assembled or functional firearm in any unit of the National Park System or the National Wildlife Refuge System if--

(1) the individual is not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing the firearm; and

(2) the possession of the firearm is in compliance with the law of the State in which the unit of the National Park System or the National Wildlife Refuge System is located.



(As printed in the Congressional Record for the Senate on May 12, 2009.)
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I'm sure some of us here have some links on hand that are accurate when it comes to this, I would like to get the nit and gritty on if carrying in national parks correlates to more poaching.
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How would anyone have any data on this as carrying in National Parks was only legal for a couple of months and there probably weren't any studies on how many people actually carried, let alone to try correlate that carrying with poaching?
 
How would anyone have any data on this as carrying in National Parks was only legal for a couple of months and there probably weren't any studies on how many people actually carried, let alone to try correlate that carrying with poaching?
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That's pretty much what I figured. I've heard some people go on about how there was a major poaching problem and that's why the ruling was reversed, I just wondered if there were any numbers and what they actually showed.

Thanks for the responses!
 
I don't get it..Why would an illegal activity increase because of this?
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It would not. The only thing that increases is fear of what "Could or might" happen. Many people have an irrational fear of inanimate objects and more than a healthy distrust for everyone they meet.
 
Consider these things, when thinking about poaching in National Parks (a hefty crime AFAIK). I don't think defensive carry will lead to any more poaching.

Any shots fired would still be investigated.

If plinking and hunting are not allowed, then any shot fired would be assumed to be in self-defense, a distress signal from a lost hiker, or illegal poaching. For any of these situations, Park Rangers would be dispatched at once anyway.

Someone seen carrying a hunting rifle through a National Park would still arouse suspicion.

Someone poaching without being seen doesn't worry about this rule. Such poaching, if any, would already be happening.

Wildlife refuges are generally open to hunting with firearms; only defensive weapons are banned.

It's hard to see how or why poaching would be impacted by this law, except perhaps that poachers could be less likely to wander around where hikers might be armed.

Finally, I think it's a pretty safe bet that any poaching in National Parks is being done around the perimeter, with entry from, and rapid exit to, non-park lands. Given that parks have entrance fees, and backpackers need trip permits, someone caught hiking around in the park without the proper ticket and permit, with a firearm and any other hunting equipment, would not just be considered "okay to go" once this law is in place.
 
One more thing...

AFAIK this rule has only been in place for about 25 years, far less time than there have been National Parks. I don't think there's any evidence that poaching, whatever the amount might be, has changed as a result. If there were, the opponents of the rule change would have put that on the table.

My guess is that almost all poaching in National Parks is from legitimate hunters "pushing the boundaries." They might know that they're a few hundred yards inside the park, or they might not know. (With cheap topo-map GPS readily available, there's certainly less of an "I didn't know" alibi than there was 50 years ago.)

This is legally "poaching" but it's very different from what we think of when we hear the word "poacher."

I tend to think of illegal fishermen in the Salton Sea, selling Tilapia to restaurants in California, or poachers in Tanzania, killing elephants or rhinos at night, to sell their tusks and horns on the black market.

I sincerely doubt that there are too many people who make elaborate plans so they can sneak way into Yosemite to bag themselves a deer.
 
Wouldn't a crossbow be a better choice of weapon for a poacher in a NP? No report to give them away.

Ranger #1 "Is that Griz scat?"

Ranger #2 "Sure looks like it"

Ranger #1 "What's that in it?"

Ranger #2 "Looks like a pulley, some string, and a piece of camo cloth."
 
I've seen a mounted record Kodiak shot at 17 yards with a bow, and talked with the hunter.

The man who shot it was a really nice guy, quiet, unassuming. He isn't a poacher. There's MUCH better money in doing shows for ESPN, which is what he does, even though when you meet him you wouldn't know it. That's what people with that level of skill and ability do.:)
 
I've seen a mounted record Kodiak shot at 17 yards with a bow, and talked with the hunter.

The man who shot it was a really nice guy, quiet, unassuming. He isn't a poacher. There's MUCH better money in doing shows for ESPN, which is what he does, even though when you meet him you wouldn't know it. That's what people with that level of skill and ability do.
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No disrespect intended to that fellow,[some are phenomenal shots] but I have noticed a common accessory to most brown bear archers is a guide at their hip,with a .375.
 
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