Anyone here use Rhodesian Jungle for home defense?

[Fred Fuller]

Ayoob recommends #1 Buckshot for defense in 12 Gauge Shotguns.

The instructor in my hunter safety class back in the mid-1970s suggested it too. I've been patterning #1 buck in different shotguns since then, and have yet to find one that will pattern it worth a hoot. I still have a stash of it, and I'm still trying it. If Federal would make a full velocity load of #1 in their FliteControl wad, that might actually do it = they make a reduced recoil load but I don't shoot reduced recoil anything in a working gun.

So I'm still shooting 9 pellet 2.75" loads of 00. Federal LE127-00.

In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is... and in theory, #1 buck is superior. In practice, for me, it isn't. As with all else, do your own due diligence...

 

[Nom de Forum]

Didn't we just do this in the "Bolo Round" thread. Exotic loads for shotguns are sucker bait to make money from catering to fantasy. Hasn't history offered enough proof that there is really no advantage to be gained by using anything other than OO Buck and 1 ounce Slugs for interpersonal problems?

Like Fred said, #1 Buck may look good enough on magazine and book paper but that does not mean it will on your patterning paper. Maybe that doesn't matter up close but it does as shouting distance.

 

[mac66]

I used to play around with different kind of buck shot hand loads. One of them was adding bird shot to buckshot. If you think about it, filling up the cavity between the buck shot adds additional weight and projectiles to the mix. Each one of those BBs has the potential of hitting an artery or something else thus increasing the odds. In my thinking more is better.

Does it add penetration or make much difference? Probably not, but more lead down range IS better so why not?

 

[ugaarguy]

Does it add penetration or make much difference? Probably not, but more lead down range IS better so why not?

Why not? Because for a given powder charge it adds weight, thereby reducing the velocity of the buckshot pellets, which are the pellets that actually have the mass to penetrate. Further, it's been shown that soft buffering between hardened or plated buckshot pellets produces the best patterns in the most guns.

I'd rather have a load that patterns well, and that gives the buckshot the most velocity without unnecessarily increasing pressure and recoil.

 

[bflee]

What do you guys think about #4 buck with 41 pellets? You think that would do well in a home defense situation. I have had it loaded in a stevens pump shotgun with a 20 " barrel for several years. I shoot one every so often and replace it just to check things out. I thought it would be pretty effective when I boight it so I got a big box.

 

[multigauge]

#4 Buckshot has the FBI recommended optimum penetration of 15" at 10 yards provided that it is full sized (.24 and not .235) and it is loaded to a muzzle velocity of 1455 fps. Such a load is very rare, which is why the IWBA claimed that its use for self defense is marginal.

 

[Fred Fuller]

In my thinking more is better.

Then why not shoot birdshot?

What do you guys think about #4 buck with 41 pellets

If you want to use it it's fine by me. I prefer 00 to every other buckshot load available - so far. Doesn't mean I'm not open to change, but so far experience dictates sticking to 00, for me.

BTW, you should probably shoot up ALL the ammo that's been in that magazine for years, and replace it with fresh. Or at least make sure each and every round will chamber with no hesitation. Sometimes the pressure of the magazine spring will cause shells to swell - and I've even seen one split open at the wad column.

 

[Shotgun Sergeon]

I'm new here, but I'll add my 2 cents. In my house the MAX distance to take a shot is about 15yd. And that's in the unfinished part of my basement. An HD type shot would likely be taken at a maximum of 8-10yds. If you've ever shot even a round of birdshot at that distance, you know that the pattern at that distance isn't much bigger than your spread hand. Put something like that in a bad guy's chest, and he's not getting up. IMHO any round with lead will shred someone at that distance. My choice HD load is a 3" #4 buck load.

 

[Fred Fuller]

you've ever shot even a round of birdshot at that distance, you know that the pattern at that distance isn't much bigger than your spread hand.

I have, and it isn't. But there's more to it than just pattern - there has to be penetration as well. And birdshot is unpredictable where penetration is concerned.

Put something like that in a bad guy's chest, and he's not getting up.

Not necessarily so. I used to link to a coroner's report of a shotgun suicide where the unfortunate shot himself three times with a 12 ga. 870 and #2 shot before he got the job done. Unfortunately it's behind a paywall now. https://www.mja.com.au/journal/2000/173/11/shotgun-suicide-difference

But there's this -

One particular case has been documented from Australia. In February 1995, a man committed suicide on parkland in Canberra, Australia. He took a pump action shotgun and shot himself in the chest. The load passed through the chest without hitting a rib, and went out the other side. He then walked fifteen meters, reloaded, leaned the shotgun against his throat, and shot his throat and part of his jaw. He then reloaded, walked 136 meters to a hill slope, lay down on the slope, held the gun against his chest with his hands and operated the trigger with his toes. This shot entered the thoracic cavity and demolished the heart, killing him.[4] - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiple_gunshot_suicide

No matter what you shoot in a shotgun results are not entirely predictable and you ALWAYS need to be prepared to shoot again if a stop is not achieved. Louis Awerbuck told us of an instance where a 12 ga. slug glanced off the bill of a baseball cap on a 3D humanoid target and failed to penetrate.

Take nothing for granted where shotguns are concerned...

 

[bflee]

I am pretty sure after that first shot passed through his chest it would have been pretty easy to subdue him. I dont think he jumped right up and was ready to roll or anything.