midland man
Member
this is my first year to use a traditions Kentucky rifle in 45c flintlock! I built it in the spring from a kit has 1-66 twist for roundball use only, and deer muzzleloader starts the 22nd of this month so will it perform well?? 
anyone use 45c flintlock for deer hunting
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WestKentucky
Member
Not using a flinter but I am rocking and rolling with my 45 percussion TC Hawken. I love that rifle. It's one of a few "junk" guns I have got that just flat out work and I won't turn loose of.
Another is my other percussion buggy gun. It's a 50 but it sure is fun.
Another is my other percussion buggy gun. It's a 50 but it sure is fun.
OP
OP
midland man
Member
yes rodwha my gun loves 50gr 3f real black powder with 18ths patch not prelubed only lubed when time to load! but sure shoots good...
Unless it's an energetic powder such as Swiss or Olde Eynsford (and possibly another European powder) you're likely getting about 1700 fps. A .440" ball weighs 128 grns and has a BC of 0.062.
Energy figures themselves don't mean all that much but I view them as the flip side figures of velocity and mass, which determine penetration. The lighter the ball the faster it needs to go to make it to the other side. Judging by the experiences of others I've come to figure about 300 ft/lbs is the minimum needed for a broadside shot, and that would be between 75 and 100 yds with your ball traveling at that speed. Unless you have tiny deer like we do in much of Texas.
I took a screen shot of the ballistics app figures but tinypics isn't working for some reason. I'll try again later.
Energy figures themselves don't mean all that much but I view them as the flip side figures of velocity and mass, which determine penetration. The lighter the ball the faster it needs to go to make it to the other side. Judging by the experiences of others I've come to figure about 300 ft/lbs is the minimum needed for a broadside shot, and that would be between 75 and 100 yds with your ball traveling at that speed. Unless you have tiny deer like we do in much of Texas.
I took a screen shot of the ballistics app figures but tinypics isn't working for some reason. I'll try again later.
Noz
Member
You are aware that the 45 cal rifle was considered a heavy caliber rifle until the westward expansion and hunters began encountering Moose, Elk and Grizzlys.
You do your part and it will work fine on whitetails.
You do your part and it will work fine on whitetails.
I used one years ago. It was a copy of the John Rupp gun from the "Golden Age" book and I used a Russ Hamm lock and Douglass premium 45 1 in 66 barrel. Even though "wrong", it shot the 220 grain TC maxi ball white well. 100 gr. of FFg was good to 100 yards. One shot, one deer, found the nicely expanded bullet under the hide on the off side. About 60 yards.
Patocazador
Member
What's with your table? You asked a question and now you're arguing ??
I have used a .45 with a PRB and 70 gr. of 3F. It works if you don't hit large bones.
Throw away your chart.
I have used a .45 with a PRB and 70 gr. of 3F. It works if you don't hit large bones.
Throw away your chart.
Malachi Leviticus Blue
Member
rodwha discussed the data shown on the "chart" in post #5
If there is any arguing going on in this thread it is to subtle and veiled for me to even get a hint of unless we are talking about the latest reference to throwing away the chart???
If there is any arguing going on in this thread it is to subtle and veiled for me to even get a hint of unless we are talking about the latest reference to throwing away the chart???
Malachi Leviticus Blue
Member
There is little doubt that penetration and expansion are critical in a humane hunt.
energy, and projectile design are key variables in establishing penetration and expansion
Since the OP's example utilizes a 45 lead roundball, the projectile is no longer a variable, therefore velocity is the most important variable we can control (outside of shot placement). However we will quickly maximize velocity for practical purposes when utilizing Black Powder as the propellant. This effectively defines maximum velocity, so maximum performance can be reasonably represented in a chart.
energy, and projectile design are key variables in establishing penetration and expansion
Since the OP's example utilizes a 45 lead roundball, the projectile is no longer a variable, therefore velocity is the most important variable we can control (outside of shot placement). However we will quickly maximize velocity for practical purposes when utilizing Black Powder as the propellant. This effectively defines maximum velocity, so maximum performance can be reasonably represented in a chart.
"What's with your table? You asked a question and now you're arguing ??
I have used a .45 with a PRB and 70 gr. of 3F. It works if you don't hit large bones.
Throw away your chart."
What??? I didn't ask any questions. Nor did I argue about anything...
Charts are quite helpful. They give you an idea of what to expect. Here it shows what a 10 mph crosswind will do. It also shows his trajectory. And from the plethora of experience by others it shows roughly where his load will become questionable. I'd prefer to keep a chart as it's meaningful...
*EDIT*
I forgot to mention the 10 mph crosswind and 900' elevation.
I have used a .45 with a PRB and 70 gr. of 3F. It works if you don't hit large bones.
Throw away your chart."
What??? I didn't ask any questions. Nor did I argue about anything...
Charts are quite helpful. They give you an idea of what to expect. Here it shows what a 10 mph crosswind will do. It also shows his trajectory. And from the plethora of experience by others it shows roughly where his load will become questionable. I'd prefer to keep a chart as it's meaningful...
*EDIT*
I forgot to mention the 10 mph crosswind and 900' elevation.
Dog Soldier
member
The Eastern rifles and smooth bores were large caiibers. They did not use the smaller calibers in the East such as .45 etc. until the Elk and Woodland Bison were wiped out.
loose noose
Member
I have a Pedersoli .45 flintlock, with 1/66 rifling, (kit) that I took a 150# N/E Wisconsin forkhorn whitetail with about 10-15 years ago. The shot was right at 50 yards nearly broadside, the round ball took the right lung, coming off a rib bone, pierced the heart, and was recovered just inside the hide on the far left side. Incidentally it was a nice clean kill. That is the only deer I took with that rifle, and although I had it sighted in out to 75 yards, that is about the furthest distance I would expect a .45 round ball to perform, flintlock, or percussion. I do prefer the .50 caliber using the mini ball to be far superior for humane kills on deer sized game animals. BTW I used a patched ball as prescribed by Harold V. Schoultz, using the 8-1 formula.
WestKentucky
Member
I like that chart. Confirms what I figured out the hard way. I knew that after 100 it started fading fast and on paper I had to start elevation rapidly to get a hit. Nice to see numbers on energy too, my personal cutoff is irrelevant but putting energy, drift magnitude, and the nosediving projectile all into the equation you can really get a handle on what your max shot should be. I would really hate to take a 45 prb beyond 100 as it's just too iffy on all three parts of the equation. At 75 it's fair on all 3 parts. 50 and in its golden.
OP
OP
midland man
Member
yep my max is about 50-70 yards infact most of the time under 50 so I figured that would be plenty good!
243winxb
Member
.440 ball-127 gr-90gr Goex -2F-1760 fps average from my TC 45 flintlock. Accuracy 3 to 5" @100 yds. 5 shot groups. Yours should do as well. Dont patch so tignt that the ball gets deformed on seating/loading. Have fun.
david58
Member
.45 is more than enough for the largest deer. I used to use a .40 flinter, it was far more than enough to do the job. You can get some very nice velocities from a roundball in .45, with the side benefit being you don't get beat up at the range like I can with my .62. If you are able to put the ball where it belongs, you will have no problem (unless, like my recent elk hunt, you cannot find the critters...).
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