AR Jamming/ bolt not closing With Reloads

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Demos

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Hi,
I build an AR with a Lothar Walther 20" 223 Wylde chamber and matching bolt. I have about 1000 rounds through it and just started running into a problem. On occasion the bolt stays about bcg can't go the last 1/16-1/32" forward, the forward assist does nothing and I have to pull VERY firmly on the charging handle to get the round out. Upon inspection of the round all looks well, there aren't any rifling marks on the bullets, the neck of the case looks square so I don't think it's too long, ect. The rounds are once fired (not from my rifle) full length resized, trimmed, deburred, loaded to mag length so well off the lands.

The only thing I can think is that I might need a small base die since the problem only started when I switched from brass that had only been used in my rifle to once fired. Any other ideas before I have to spend money?

Thanks,
Demos
 
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The rounds are once fired (not from my rifle) full length resized, trimmed, deburred, loaded to mag length so well off the lands.
Click to expand...

Improper adjustment on the seating die. I guarantee a micrometer will reveal an out of spec shoulder.

Either that, or your chamber shrunk...............:p
 
The only thing I can think is that I might need a small base die since the problem only started when I switched from brass that had only been used in my rifle to once fired. Any other ideas before I have to spend money?
Click to expand...

Since the rifle is otherwise functional I've moved this to Handloading And Reloading because this is where you'll get the best advice on the subject. I've also added "With Reloads" to the thread title for clarity.
 
You could always color the round up with a sharpie, load it up and then eject it. Where the marker is no longer there/rubbed off is where things are getting caught up. Could just be a sizing die adjustment too, or the seating die as was already suggested by MachIV.
 
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Try a piece of that problem brass that has been sized only for fit in the chamber. Then if it goes in OK reload it. Then try it again. If now it does not fit I am thinking that you are squashing the shoulder when loading the bullet whether by not reaming the inside of the neck or pushing the neck down when crimping/seating. coloring the case will show you where your trouble is. The small base die is to size more of the lower part of the casing of a brass that is fired in a loose chamber---usually in a "machine gun". Turning the die down some and sizing a second time might be good enough if your brass is over sized.
 
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Demos said:
Hi,
The rounds are once fired (not from my rifle) full length resized, trimmed, deburred, loaded to mag length so well off the lands.
Click to expand...

Try a small base sizing dies with cases not fired in your rifle.

Not all AR-15 chambers are created equal.

If I take cases fired in my Colt 5.56 NATO chamber and use a standard full length sizing die, they will not chamber in my rifles with Wylde chambers. They fall just a bit short of chamber and sometimes can be a bitch to extract.

Case gauges from Wilson and Dillon will not show this as they are cut generously in the body dimension.
 
Hi,
I will compare some rounds that got stuck to some that didn't/ do the marker test. Should I measure COAL, length from the base to the shoulder, and diameter? If I can't find a difference doing this I'll buy a box of factory and try that.
I am using a RCBS x die set so the press barely cams over, and the bullets are 55gr Varmagedon hp.

Thanks,
Demos
 
All these guys saying you are doing something wrong, they might be right. And they might be wrong.

I have had plenty of 223 pickups that do not size all the way. I dunno what kind of out of spec rifle or machine gun they were shot out of. But once they have been stretched a certain amount, you cannot put the genie back in the bottle.

The only way I could get these cases to fit a case gauge is to anneal the shoulders and then size again. I may have overdone it, but about all of these cases I "fixed" separated on the first or second firing.

If you bought a mixed bag of OF or picked up brass from a range where fully automatic rifles are used, this might be your problem.

Lesson learned, if it don't fit, I toss it. I gauge my newly acquired pickups BEFORE I size. If they are grossly too long, they aren't going to work. Almost all of my own cases (fired out of an autoloader) and pickups EASILY fit a case gauge even before sizing . At worst, some of my pickups might be right at the upper limit. Then you may come across some that are obviously way past the upper limit, and you know those cases are bad.

If you're going to load and shoot pickup 223 brass out of an autoloader, you might want to get a case gauge. There's some really messed up 223 brass out there.
 
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If you plan to load much 223 a good set of case gauges will come in handy

However, as a quick check you should have some vernier calipers. Take a look at this SAAMI drawing of the 223 case and chamber. The case is the top drawing. The drawing represents MAXIMUM CARTRIDGE / MINIMUM CHAMBER dimensions. Note the maximum case diameter just about .2008" up from the case head is .3759". Most factory ammunition I have laying around, including some Lake City stuff measure around .370" or easily .005" below the maximum diameter. See what you have.

The problem with once fired brass is we seldom know what it was once fired in. If the brass is NATO stuff it could have been run through a machine gun with a large chamber to the brass generally needs full length resizing using small base dies.

Anyway, I would look at the SAMMI specification sheet and using your calipers take the measurements you best can with what you heve to work with.

Ron
 
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Mic the rim. Should be .378, I have found some as high as .385. Would not fit a Wilson gauge. I run everything through a .380 bulge buster and anything that is over sized I chuck it in a drill and run a points file over the rim, guess what, they all fit after that
 
I bet the problem is in the shoulder of the case. Are you crimping the bullets?
If you are the crimp should be done separately and mildly.
The small base dies aren't a problem and recommended for semi-autos.
Get a case gauge to drop the shells into. It is well worth the few bucks.
 
Mic the rim. Should be .378, I have found some as high as .385. Would not fit a Wilson gauge.
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Depending on your rifle, this may not even be a problem. Some folks ream out the rim of their Wilson 223 case gauge so that these cases don't give false positives. My rifle will shoot these cases just fine. I want to say that most rifles will. Wilson 223 gauge is kinda known for being unnecessarily tight at the rim for practical purposes.
 
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1. Pull the bullets from the FTF cartridges.

2. Full length resize (turning the die 1/8 turn past ram contact to insure cam-over)

3. Using the resized but empty cases, see it they will now chamber....


- If they won't chamber, get a small base die (you only need to use it once. After that, cases from your rifle can use normal sizing)

- If they will chamber, you need to cease & desist crimping when seating the bullets. (You are likley collapsing the shoulder)
 
Sounds like the seating die was set too far down crushing the shoulder very slightly. I had the exact same thing happen to me except I crushed the shoulder with my lee disc powder drop, I had it down just a tad too far. If you rub your fingers on the outside of the shoulder you will barely feel it. It doesn't take much to keep it from feeding properly. Let us know what you find out.
 
Guys, this is getting a little off track. The OP said his reloads were perfectly fine when they were made with brass shot only in his barrel. The problem started with once fired brass he bought. It's clear there is something going on with the brass he bought because he was successfully loading ammo before this.

The brass he bought is the problem and if it were me I wouldn't go buy a whole bunch of tools because of a bad batch of brass. I would replace the brass... (think M249)
 
Had the same problem a while back with my reloads. Brass was mixed range pickup. Had 2 jam at the range in my Rock River, so I packed up all my ammo to chase the problem down when I got back home.

Problem turned out to be base to shoulder was too long, comfirmed with a Lyman case gage. Pulled around 100 rounds and resized the brass. Turns out I didn't have my die set right, pure operator error! Now every round I make goes into the case gage before it gets put away.

Haven't had the problem again since I started paying closer attention to what I was doing. I highly recommend getting a case gage, for me it was money well spent.
 
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Case gage... case gage... case gage.

If you are not measuring the base-to-shoulder dimension on your resized brass, you are just playing guesswork, and these sorts of problems will haunt you until you buy the tool.

If you are trying to use mixed sources of brass, you may never solve the problem, as different lots of brass have different elasticity, and will resize to differing dimensions when run through a die set to a fixed position. Segregate your brass to minimize this problem.
 
There are those who claim small base dies are un necessary, but I would try them as your brass is obviously too big for the chamber.

As, as GLOOB notes, that might not even work. We don't have industrial, hydralic, sizing equipment, small base dies may not be able to size the brass down enough to restore them to factory dimensions.
 
Many case gauges are cut to measure the base to datum of a casing as well as trim length. However they are cut to a diameter too wide to really check the overall integrity of the piece of brass.

In my view the JP Rifles gauge is a much better option, it not only checks trim length and sizing, but since it's cut to the .223 Wylde dimensions it can also check the overall integrity of a case or finished round. It will catch errors at the base, neck and shoulders, so if a round passes the JP gauge, it will function in your rifle.

http://www.jprifles.com/buy.php?item=JPCG-223
 
Guys, this is getting a little off track. The OP said his reloads were perfectly fine when they were made with brass shot only in his barrel. The problem started with once fired brass he bought. It's clear there is something going on with the brass he bought because he was successfully loading ammo before this.

The brass he bought is the problem and if it were me I wouldn't go buy a whole bunch of tools because of a bad batch of brass. I would replace the brass... (think M249)
__________________
Click to expand...
I'll bet if he resizes correctly, gauges the cases and crimps properly the problem goes away.
 
SlamFire1 said:
There are those who claim small base dies are un necessary, but I would try them as your brass is obviously too big for the chamber.

As, as GLOOB notes, that might not even work. We don't have industrial, hydralic, sizing equipment, small base dies may not be able to size the brass down enough to restore them to factory dimensions.
Click to expand...

As long as the OP has not over crimped the once fired cases not fired in his rifle, my money is on the small base dies fixing the problem.
 
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