orienteeer
Member
i currently shoot 22lr exclusively, but was wondering about getting a 30-06, 30-30 or similar lever action. they are so pretty.but then i looked at the cost of AMMO???!!!
is it worth it? i shoot targets only, i don't hunt. advice?
are 30-06's worth the co$t of AMMO?
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i currently shoot 22lr exclusively, but was wondering about getting a 30-06, 30-30 or similar lever action. they are so pretty.but then i looked at the cost of AMMO???!!!
is it worth it? i shoot targets only, i don't hunt. advice?
walking arsenal
Member
Maybe a lever gun in .357 or .38 would suit your needs better?
paintballdude902
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use surplus m2 ball
greek .30'06 is pretty reasonable less than 30 cents per round
u can hand load for probably 15-20 idk since i dont handload
greek .30'06 is pretty reasonable less than 30 cents per round
u can hand load for probably 15-20 idk since i dont handload
orienteeer
Member
sorry, the newbie wants to know: whut's CMP?
Shawnee
member
No.
It all depends on the level of performance you need
If you need something in the .30-06 performance class, you have to accept the expense.
You can get yourself around with a moped, but when you need a pickuptruck, you have to pony up the money for it, and the expense to run it. Nothing else will do.
If you are only interested in shooting paper at short (100 yards and under) ranges, a .22 is fine. .22 rimfire is the cheapest ammo that exists. If you want something more (more bullet weight, more speed, more energy, more range), the cost goes up dramatically.
Take a good look at that .30-06 round, and figure out how many .22RF rounds could have been made out of the same amount of material. 10? 12? 15? Think about it. The bullet is more than 300% heavier, and moving about 250% faster.
More performance means more cost, in everything. And it is not linear. Sometimes you pay a little more for much improved performance, and sometimes you pay a lot for slightly improved performance. It all depends on exactly what kind of item you are talking about. A 10" TV will cost you under $100, but that 50" big screen will cost you a few thousand. Economy cars are cheaper than sports cars or big SUVs. Everything has a cost, and nowdays, that cost has gone (and is still going) up.
If all you want to do is punch paper, and you want more than a .22LR, but want to keep the ammo costs down, the next common step up is the .223/5.56mm round. If you learn handloading, you can cut the cost of ammo even more, once you get past the cost of the tools.
If you need something in the .30-06 performance class, you have to accept the expense.
You can get yourself around with a moped, but when you need a pickuptruck, you have to pony up the money for it, and the expense to run it. Nothing else will do.
If you are only interested in shooting paper at short (100 yards and under) ranges, a .22 is fine. .22 rimfire is the cheapest ammo that exists. If you want something more (more bullet weight, more speed, more energy, more range), the cost goes up dramatically.
Take a good look at that .30-06 round, and figure out how many .22RF rounds could have been made out of the same amount of material. 10? 12? 15? Think about it. The bullet is more than 300% heavier, and moving about 250% faster.
More performance means more cost, in everything. And it is not linear. Sometimes you pay a little more for much improved performance, and sometimes you pay a lot for slightly improved performance. It all depends on exactly what kind of item you are talking about. A 10" TV will cost you under $100, but that 50" big screen will cost you a few thousand. Economy cars are cheaper than sports cars or big SUVs. Everything has a cost, and nowdays, that cost has gone (and is still going) up.
If all you want to do is punch paper, and you want more than a .22LR, but want to keep the ammo costs down, the next common step up is the .223/5.56mm round. If you learn handloading, you can cut the cost of ammo even more, once you get past the cost of the tools.
CMP= Civilian Marksmanship Program.... an ancient gubmint program to foster rifle marksmanship of the citizenry........ demonstrate (in a bona fide CMP match) a decent level of skill, and they will sell you a cheap surplus service rifle and boolets to feed it......
paintballdude902
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cmp is the civialian marksmanship program
its a civy run part of the us army (i believe) to sell off m1 garands and some other surplus rifles and ammo
they host alot shooting matches for rotc and other people
i think they may also be incharge of distributing parade rifles to the vfw and similar
its a civy run part of the us army (i believe) to sell off m1 garands and some other surplus rifles and ammo
they host alot shooting matches for rotc and other people
i think they may also be incharge of distributing parade rifles to the vfw and similar
Sunray
Member
Go here, but if you're thinking competitive large bore shooting, you'll look into reloading. http://www.odcmp.com/
orienteeer
Member
thanks all, keep the info coming.
If you want something with a little more punch than a .22, get yourself a Nagant. The rifle itself is a lot cheaper than any '06 that I've seen. I bought a 91/30 model for $85, and the M44 carbine for $88. Using surplus military ammo, you can shoot for about $0.18 - $0.20 a round. Spending $200 for a rifle and enough ammo for several trips to the range....what could be better?
Check out the Mosin Nagant thread for more information, including pictures. Be warned...they are habit forming.
Check out the Mosin Nagant thread for more information, including pictures. Be warned...they are habit forming.
orienteeer
Member
thx brue.....
sarduy
Member
if you want more "BANG" get a mosin nagant and the ammo is about the same as a .308 and cheaper than 30-06
mejeepnut
member
You said you don't hunt and just like shooting targets!It sounds like informal target shooting so don't go for a centerfire!Stick with the 22's,cheap ammo = fun!The cheapest store bought ammo for my 30-06 is about $14.00 for 20,you can get over 500 rounds of 22lr for that!If you feel the need to buy another gun for fun shooting then get a realy nice 22!If you feel the need to just have larger caliber then Mosins are cheap but before you buy one check out a Swiss K-31.
Mauserguy
Member
If you just want a large bore rifle, then a Mosin is for you.
If you want a general purpose hunting rifle, then the 30-06 is the way to go. It can be used to hunt big and small game animals, so this versatile round may be cheaper than buying several rifles in more specialized calibers.
If small game hunting and home defense is your aim, then go for the 357 lever rifle.
If punching paper at short range is your passion, then just stick with the 22.
Mauserguy
If you want a general purpose hunting rifle, then the 30-06 is the way to go. It can be used to hunt big and small game animals, so this versatile round may be cheaper than buying several rifles in more specialized calibers.
If small game hunting and home defense is your aim, then go for the 357 lever rifle.
If punching paper at short range is your passion, then just stick with the 22.
Mauserguy
TimboKhan
Member
Exactly what I was going to suggest!
It's not that I don't like the .30-06, in fact quite the opposite. But, if you don't hunt and if your only looking for a centerfire rifle to shoot for fun, the 30-06 is probably not worth the expense. A Mosin Nagant rifle will run you somewhere in the neighborhood of $100.00, and you can still find ammo for pennies per round. 7.62x54 performance is pretty darn close to the .30-06, so your not cheating yourself of the fun of shooting a center-fire .30 caliber.
On the other hand, if you think that someday you might want to hunt, or that you might start reloading, I don't know that I could recommend a .30-06 more. Oodles of information can be found on reloading the round, there are a ton of rifles chambered for the .30-06, and it is suitable for hunting anything that walks in North America.
It really is a good round, and as mentioned, you can find old Greek surplus pretty cheap these days, but to repeat my main point, if your just looking to poke holes in paper and plink, there are more economical options.
The 30-06 is one of the best hunting rounds ever developed but not needed just for paper punching. As long as you are content to shoot at ranges out to around 100 yards or less a good .22 LR is fine.
If you get the urge to shoot at longer ranges .223 is still one of the most economical centerfire rounds out there. With any centerfire if you shop around on the internet and buy in bulk (500-1000 rounds) you can save a lot of money.
If you get the urge to shoot at longer ranges .223 is still one of the most economical centerfire rounds out there. With any centerfire if you shop around on the internet and buy in bulk (500-1000 rounds) you can save a lot of money.
Shawnee
member
If you're just going to shoot paper - stay with, and learn, the .22 long rifle rimfires - they will make you a top flight marksman in the bargain. The money you save will buy you a lifetime's ammo and a couple really good .22 rifles.
If you would like the fun of more "bang" when shooting paper but without getting insanely more expensive - get a Marlin lever-action in .357/.38 Special. They are grand fun.
If you think you may hunt animals up to and including deer, wild hogs, or black bear - get a Marlin lever-acxtion 30/30.
The cheap military rifles and ammo are just that - cheap, and my advice is to not spend money on them when that could be money much better spent.
Some people believe the old military cartridge (30/06) is a great hunting cartridge - some people (myself included) believe it is one of the worst choices an American hunter can make. Unfortunately, antique military "intelligence" dies hard and lots of poor would-be hunters get told to buy 30/06's.
If you would like the fun of more "bang" when shooting paper but without getting insanely more expensive - get a Marlin lever-action in .357/.38 Special. They are grand fun.
If you think you may hunt animals up to and including deer, wild hogs, or black bear - get a Marlin lever-acxtion 30/30.
The cheap military rifles and ammo are just that - cheap, and my advice is to not spend money on them when that could be money much better spent.
Some people believe the old military cartridge (30/06) is a great hunting cartridge - some people (myself included) believe it is one of the worst choices an American hunter can make. Unfortunately, antique military "intelligence" dies hard and lots of poor would-be hunters get told to buy 30/06's.
.22 lr guns are fun to shoot and economical to shoot.
Shooting a big bore rifle is also a lot of fun. Buy whatever rifle looks like fun to you. You can still shoot your .22 a lot and on occasion you can splurge and send some ridiculously expensive ammo down range.
I have a Marlin 1895 in .45-70. It costs me $1.60 per shot. I don't shoot it a lot but it is a fun time. Mostly I shoot at things like 2 litre bottles full of water and other things that fly apart (and I clean up my mess).
I also have a .30-30, .30-06, .223, .22, 12 gauge, .308
As long as you can afford it and you are being safe, do whatever you want. Have fun.
Shooting a big bore rifle is also a lot of fun. Buy whatever rifle looks like fun to you. You can still shoot your .22 a lot and on occasion you can splurge and send some ridiculously expensive ammo down range.
I have a Marlin 1895 in .45-70. It costs me $1.60 per shot. I don't shoot it a lot but it is a fun time. Mostly I shoot at things like 2 litre bottles full of water and other things that fly apart (and I clean up my mess).
I also have a .30-30, .30-06, .223, .22, 12 gauge, .308
As long as you can afford it and you are being safe, do whatever you want. Have fun.
tinygnat219
Member
Are you looking for a hunting cartridge? If so, the 30.06 IMHO cannot be beaten. There are so many different loads available, so many bullet weights, that it's hard to beat needing another cartridge. This round is good for anything in the western hemisphere, and 90% of African game. It's also nice that if you are in Alaska and leave your ammo at home, the chances of you finding 30.06 ammo up there are better than some of the more obscure Uber magnums.
The nice thing about rifles in this cartridge is the non-corrosive surplus M2 ball ammo that's available. It can get you much needed practice time without the expense.
I second the Mosin Nagant. Rifles and ammo are reasonably priced.
The nice thing about rifles in this cartridge is the non-corrosive surplus M2 ball ammo that's available. It can get you much needed practice time without the expense.
I second the Mosin Nagant. Rifles and ammo are reasonably priced.
Legionnaire
Contributing Member
The key question here is, at what range (distance) do you want to be able to shoot targets? I love to target shoot with a .22LR. But I also have done a bit of long-range target shooting (500+ yards). For that you'll need a good centerfire, and the .30-06 is a fine rifle for that application ... although I'd prefer a .308. Good stuff being written about the .260 and other intermediate cartridges for long range shooting as well. But in all cases, the ammo is going to be more spendy than even match-grade .22LR stuff. If you're going to do a LOT of shooting at long range, especially precision shooting, you'll probably want to consider getting into reloading.
feedthehogs
Member
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Ask yourself at what distance your going to shoot targets and what do you expect for accuracy.
Some don't seem to mind 3 to 5 " groups at 100yds.
This will dictate the type of rifle/ammo you buy.
If its just for pulling the trigger and go bang, then price would be the main factor.
If your looking to develop any type of skill then buying a hand grenade rifle(my term for getting a bullet in the general area of your aim) is a waste no matter what the price.
I see so many young shooters at the range just throwing lead and bringing back tagets that have HUGH patterns and are happy about it.
When they see my typical sub moa targets, they are amazed to which I reply anyone can do it.
The response is I can't afford it.
To which I sit them down and explain while they threw 300 rounds down range, I threw 30. And that even buying factory ammo, it was cheaper, let alone reloading.
I then ask, which target would you rather have yours or mine.
They always say mine.
Quality, not quantity. Something many of todays shooters ignore.
If its just for releasing frustration, save your money and buy a teddy bear and beat on it.
Shooting is like learning to race cars. If your learning just to come in 30th, then why bother. Always race to win.
Some don't seem to mind 3 to 5 " groups at 100yds.
This will dictate the type of rifle/ammo you buy.
If its just for pulling the trigger and go bang, then price would be the main factor.
If your looking to develop any type of skill then buying a hand grenade rifle(my term for getting a bullet in the general area of your aim) is a waste no matter what the price.
I see so many young shooters at the range just throwing lead and bringing back tagets that have HUGH patterns and are happy about it.
When they see my typical sub moa targets, they are amazed to which I reply anyone can do it.
The response is I can't afford it.
To which I sit them down and explain while they threw 300 rounds down range, I threw 30. And that even buying factory ammo, it was cheaper, let alone reloading.
I then ask, which target would you rather have yours or mine.
They always say mine.
Quality, not quantity. Something many of todays shooters ignore.
If its just for releasing frustration, save your money and buy a teddy bear and beat on it.
Shooting is like learning to race cars. If your learning just to come in 30th, then why bother. Always race to win.
Marlin 45 carbine
Member
even if you handload your own (reload) loading a .357 round costs as much to load as an '06 unless you use lead slugs at low velocitys. gas checks have really shot up in price lately.
if just for occasional shooting the Mosin and surplus ammo may be the way to go. but who knows you may decide to take up on an offer to hunt sometime. '06 is good for that due to bullet availibilty.
if just for occasional shooting the Mosin and surplus ammo may be the way to go. but who knows you may decide to take up on an offer to hunt sometime. '06 is good for that due to bullet availibilty.
orienteeer
Member
thanks all, for the great advice!
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