Are fixed sights harder to use than adjustable?

[zougou]

Hello. I recently bought a used S&W model 36. The rear sight is a grove machined into the frame. I have had pretty good luck shooting at 25 yards with my used Model 19. It has adjustable sights. It seems with the 36 I have to bend my wrist down to get the proper alignment. I did poorly at 25 yards. (Now, before anyone asks me why I am not trying at say 7 yards, let me just state that my pistol range lets me shoot at any distance I want as long as it's either 25 or 50 yards.) Is this just the nature of the fixed sights or the difference in the distance of front and rear sights between the two models?

I also just got a used Ruger Service Six (38 spl) with the same sort of fixed sights as the S&W 36. Same issue for me. With the adjustable sights it seems I can hold the pistol parallel to the ground whereas the fixed seems to force me to point toward the ground.

Any suggestions (other than find another range to practice?)

TIA!

 

[Ala Dan]

Fixed Sight's vs. Adjustable Sight's

The fixed sight's aren't harder to use if you can adjust
to "Kentucky windage"! That is take your finger and
wipe a little spit on the front sight to see which way
the wind is blow'in.

Seriously, I've heard of people filing their front sight
one way or the other to improve accuracy. I make all
necessary adjustments with my eyes; as I ain't about
to put a file on any of my firearm's exterior finish!

And adjustable sights speak for themselves; just
micro-click opposite the direction you want the groups
too go. Caution, don't click too fast. Move one click at
a time; then shoot to see where the bullet impacts,
then repeat the process if necessary.

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

 

[Grump]

No difference in shootability for me. All the fixed-sight S&Ws and the single Detective Special I've fired were within 2 inches of POA at 25 yards (bullseye style) as long as you used fairly standard-weight bullets. 125 to 158-gr in .357, for example.

IF you truly settle on a standard load, look into having a 'smith regulate the sights for you.

What you describe may actually be a difference in the grips more than the sights...unless you mean you need to truly aim low to get hits with your new wheelgun.

 

[OH25shooter]

FWIW: Many years ago at the PD Academy we had S&W model 10 revolvers with fixed sights. The poor shooters were always told, it's not the sights, it's YOU. Not trying to be a smart a**, but the range instructors were always right. I never had a problem. With the correct sight alignment, the proper stance and squeezing the trigger, I qualified expert. And that was with no prior use or training with a handgun. You mentioned you like to shoot at somewhat long distances with your handgun. You might want to consider firing more rounds at the 7 yard line to start. Then move the target further away. All PD's start in close, then move out to 25 yards. Try it, it'll be fun.

 

[zougou]

Thanks for the replys so far.

I wasn't getting any hits with the 36 using a 6 o'clock hold. I'm not even sure I was hiting anywhere on the wooden target holder. Of course, it was raining, there was no overhead lights, and I was aiming at a black target with a black front sight...

Later, dry-firiing, I seemed I had to twist my wrist down to get the rear sights to line up with the front site. Turning my head to look at how the pistol was pointing, it was clear it was pointing at a slight angle toward the ground.

Just wondering...

 

[444]

Fixed sight guns are no harder to shoot than adjustable sighted guns.
Short barreled guns are harder to shoot than longer barreled guns. Small mistakes in sight picture, sight alignment, and trigger press that would go unnoticed in a longer barreled gun become evident with a short barrel due to the short sight radius. Short barreled guns are not any less accurate, you just have to be more skilled to make them perform.
One thing to keep in mind also is that fixed sights were designed to be used with a certain load. In your case I believe it is a 158 grain bullet. Using a different load will result in a different point of impact.
I have a Model 36 that I have owned for about 15 years. It shoots right on the money with 158 grain bullets. At one time, I shot it a lot. Usually once or twice a week. Today, I really have to bare down to shoot it well. The gun is capable, but I am not as capable as I once was due to lack of practice.

 

[Sarge111]

I actually pferer

fixed sights on a revolver, as long as they are well-regulated, and I have learned most of the tricks necessary to get them that way. It's notably faster for me to index the front sight like a shotgun bead, using fixed sights. If you're having to make a conscious effort to twist the gun down to acquire a good sight picture, my first suggestion would be to find some grips that make the gun sit in your firing grasp, at a more natural angle. Lacking in first-hand experience with the J-frames, I'll leave it to others here to make a suitable suggestion as to which aftermarket grip might work best in this situation.

 

[Ala Dan]

Grip Angle on S&W J-frame RB model 36

Recently I acquired an oversize set of Pachmayr grips
(Gripper model SJ-6) for my old Smith & Wesson J-
frame model 60. While not a concealment type grip,
these Pachmayr's are really comfortable and allows
for quick target acquistion.

For concealment purposes, I use Hogue's "Bantam"
grips; but for all practical shooting such as on range
day, I switch to the Pachmayr Grippers. Looking at
the back of the package panel, it says that they fit
the following S&W models: 30, 33-rb, 34-rb, 36-rb,
37-rb, 38, 43-rb, 49, 60, 649, and 650. The e-bay
price was the best thing, $5.00 + S/H.

I believe that a set of these will go a long way in
solving your type of problem!

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

 

[BluesBear]

What no one here has addressed as of yet is the difference in the height of the sights. The height above the wrist I mean.

The J-framed Model 36 has a lower bore and sight axis in relation to the hand that the K-Framed Model 19. Therefor even a fixed sight Model 10 would have it's sights on a highter axis that the Model 36. Add to that the slightly higher axis of the adjustable sights on the Model 19 and you have a large enough discrepancy to be quite noticable.

This is why when I am point shooting my Colt semi-auto 45s or my S&W N-frames, the sights (being of similar axis) naturally seem to align themselves, while with my J-frames I am looking way over the sights.

You'll need to hold the Model 36 higher to achieve the same sight picture.
Also the alignment of the sights on the short barreled Model 36 may necessitate a slightly different bend of the wrists.

 

[dwain]

444 stated that that these fixed sight guns are sighted in for a specific load. How do you find out what this load is? Is there a chart somewhere or do you get every load made in your caliber and go to the range for a trial and error session? Thanks, Dwain

 

[444]

Well the first thing you might try is simply shooting your gun and seeing where it hits with various loads. The one that prints at your point of aim is the load designed for those sights.
Over the years, certain loads have pretty much always been standards for the cartridge. For example, in .45 ACP most people would agree that a 230 grain bullet is THE standard load. You can get 165 grain, 185 grain, I have even heard of people loading 255 grain bullets, but odds are, if the gun has fixed sights, it will be designed with 230 grain bullets in mind. Same with the .38/.357. The 158 grain bullet would be the first thing that comes to mind in those cartridges. Yes, you can shoot 110s and even 200s but the 158 is tradionally the standard.
If I was trying to guess what weight bulllet the sights were designed for, I would see if the cartridge was ever in widespread use by the police or military. If it was, I would start off with whatever load they used and I bet you would be right most of the time.

 

[zougou]

Thanks!

I'm pretty sure I was using 158 grain lead 38 special. It was the white box by Winchester.

I'm certain it's the operator and not the pistol.

However, I believe BluesBear has vindicated my suspicions regarding the sights. I will try different grip panels.

Hmmm, I had a few 36's to choose from, the one I got was in the nicest condition. There was one, however, with Crimson Trace Lasergrips, (made in Beaverton -- yay, Beaverton!) but it had a lot of wear and so I passed. I wonder now if I should go with the laser-pointer-in-the-grip-panel thingey.

Just to clarify -- my pistol range only affords 50 and 25 yard spots. It is aimed more at Bullseye shooters and not those practicing self defense.

I should go to a different range -- last time out there was a lot of people, and the guy to my left was practicing with a Ruger 22 -- I got a freshly fired 22 shell down my shirt. Glad it was a small caliber!

 

[BluesBear]

zougou, if you ever make it up Seattle way I'll take you as my guest to my local indoor range.

 

[zougou]

Thanks, BluesBear. I think it has to do with the grips -- I got my rubber grips in the mail, but they forgot to include the screw that holds them together. I tried putting them on to see how it felt -- big improvement!

 

[shu]

try shifting your hand lower down the butt of the gun; a two finger grip around the butt, and the little finger under the butt. this will feel strange and insecure at first, but can be gotten used to.

hold your arm out, hand empty, with the wrist at it's natural angle. then place the (unloaded) gun in yr hand with the barrel horizontal. find the finger position that results with the wrist naturally straight and the barrel horizontal.

after discharge, recoil will rotate the barrel up; with correct firmness of grip, the gun will then spring back to about it;s original position.