Arsenal inc/Converted Saiga (especialy k-var) AK-47

[sprice]

Anyone own an arsenal inc or saiga conversion ak-47? If you do will you give me some information about it? Pictures anyone? I want to know how accurate it is (even know I know it's not gonna be pretty) what stocks you have on it, what you like/dislike about it, anything really. Does anyone have an ACE stock (on any ak)? Thanks

 

[rizbunk77]

Ace stock on a Vepr 308, My converted Saiga, Arsenal SGL-31 5.45 rifle.
I really like the Ace unit. I can't fault it at all for my purposes. The jury is still out on the 5.45 I have not checked real accuracy on it yet. Fit and finish is pretty good for a stamped rifle. I think the front sight post is canted a little (something seems a little off) but the action is strong, and slick, the two stage trigger is good.

 

[Kymasabe]

Of all the AK's I've owned, my Saiga conversions were/are my favorites. The only exception was the Armory USA SSR-85C2 that I owned with the Bulgarian 1.6mm thick receiver. Fit and finish on that gun was GREAT. But, I'd take a bone stock Saiga and convert it myself over an Arsenal gun anyday.

 

[tkopp]

One thing to keep in mind is that the finish on the k-var arsenals is paint. One of the guys at the shop that did the transfer for me also bought an AK and subsequently gave it a good cleaning with gunscrubber, which he said pulled the finish right off the rifle.

Just bear in mind when you're buying an AK, no matter if it's an Arsenal-refinished Saiga or a wasr-10, that it's an AK. The mag is going to wobble, there will be a lot of empty space in the stamped receiver with big open holes for crap to get inside, the trigger isn't going to be great, it's not built for optics, and frankly it's minute of man accurate at 100y. At $500 the rifle is a very good deal for what it is.

A good AR15 can be had for just a couple hundred more. When you're talking a $350 wasr or a $500 arsenal, a couple hundred dollars is significantly more. But if you throw $1500 worth of rails, optics, lights, grips, and the like, the difference melts away. If you're like me and you're always tempted to buy every accessory under the sun for your weapons, think about something else. These are sloppy, reliable rifles.

 

[feudalson]

why is it when someone get on here and ask a simple question about a certain gun or gun type there is always someone whos like yeah but for alittle more you could get what i like.. not that junk that u only think u like.... its crazy... i had a saiga that i meant to convert but was too lazy... accuracy was just fine... trigger wasnt bad... and from what ive seen the saiga have the best fit and finish of any ak ive been around...

 

[rizbunk77]

I gotta call bull**** on the above post about minute of man and sloppy etc...
My Vepr and Saiga have tight mag lockup.
Here's a 200 yard group from my Vepr. Does this look like minute of man at 100 yds to you?
my Vepr is an enamel that pretty nice and tough.

 

[tkopp]

You must have a better one than I do I got one of the k-var Saigas and put holes all over an 18"x18" target with it. I'd fault my eyesight, but I do quite a bit better with my mosin at the same distance.

 

[rizbunk77]

tkopp,
I have been really bad lately at remembering my manners, I didn't mean your post was BS, but I just wanted to point out that some of these are 1.75 moa or thereabouts. Point taken that the AR is more accurate usually.

 

[chris in va]

My friend has two Arsenals, a milled and stamped. Both cost him roughly $900 each.

In contrast I purchased my Saiga for $300 and installed another $150 in parts. Frankly I like my Saiga 'unconversion' better. His stamped Arsenal had severely canted sights, of which a recall was issued. You'd think that would be caught at the factory after paying nearly a grand for the thing.



Yes, I like the Saiga handguard. The shorter traditional AK handguard heats up too much for my tastes and gives you less handhold options.

 

[rangerruck]

Except for a few well made country mfgr'd ak's, i would say the Saiga is your most accurate ak out there. I have 2 right now, and used to have a shortie 308. I once hit a either 3 or 5 inch shoot n see, at 100 yds, open sites, with 96 out of 100 rounds, in 2 minutes; all done with mags loaded up with different and varying rounds of manufacture, in all the mags. Had 2 dudes sitting on the benches behind me, laughing the whole time I was firing, because of something I said, when the ranger officer called, " two minutes", who could not believe it, until they went downrange with me, and looked at the paper.
My 223 saiga is even better than that...

 

[tkopp]

Originally posted by feudalson

why is it when someone get on here and ask a simple question about a certain gun or gun type there is always someone whos like yeah but for alittle more you could get what i like.. not that junk that u only think u like.... its crazy... i had a saiga that i meant to convert but was too lazy... accuracy was just fine... trigger wasnt bad... and from what ive seen the saiga have the best fit and finish of any ak ive been around...

It's not that I like the AR more than the AK. I bought the AK and didn't buy the AR after all! I like the gas piston, I love the inexpensive ammo, and I enjoy having a rifle I can mistreat and not feel bad about it. I haven't had to do that yet, but I live in an apartment complex where I really don't want my neighbors to know I have firearms laying around to steal. Even though I keep them locked up, the impression would be there if they saw me carting around rifle cases, so having the option of leaving the rifle dirty in the back of the car between range trips is a big plus for me.

My point was; at $350 or even $500 for an AK against $700 to $1000 for an AR, price is a significant factor. If you're an accessory fan and want every tactical option under the sun, $2000 versus $2500 isn't as big a deal. A 25% difference instead of a 100% difference. That's all I meant.

Originally posted by rizbunk77

tkopp,
I have been really bad lately at remembering my manners, I didn't mean your post was BS, but I just wanted to point out that some of these are 1.75 moa or thereabouts. Point taken that the AR is more accurate usually.

I'm working on ways to improve my accuracy. Thought about installing a red dot to see if it's just the short sight radius coupled with the leaf and post that's killing my accuracy. I have a rail up front anyway. Or maybe it's the vertical foregrip making it harder to bag at the range? But my mag does wobble quite a bit, and compared to other rifles I own (a 10/22 and an M1 carbine) the AK is just loosely made. It's possible the $500 arsenals didn't get the same finish as the $1000 arsenals.

 

[RP88]

my converted Saiga can do about 4-5". That at least makes it minute of man out to at least 200-250 yards.

 

[LiquidTension]

Here's a 200 yard group from my Vepr.

So the other 2 rounds were off the paper I take it? If a 3 round group proves accuracy, my old FAL was capable of .3 MOA It's the rest of the group that ruins the magic

 

[ny32182]

The same Arsenal Saiga conversion that was $900 not long ago is now going for a little over $500. That is better than you could do converting it yourself, especially if you are trying to do the front end work too.

I just got one of the Arsenals, and used to have a VEPR. Mag lockup in both was/is tight. Accuracy wise, the sights and Wolf are not helping your case, but I shot the VEPR noticeably better. Of course it has the much thicker barrel and receiver. My only dissappointment with the Arsenal so far (model SGL21) is the accuracy; with a warm rifle and about one round every 3-5 seconds off the bench, I was putting about 85% of the rounds in the black at 100yd. I shot Wolf FMJ and Brown Bear soft point; the Brown Bear did a little better. Like I said, it has been a while, but I did better with the VEPR overall. I sold the VEPR (which I regret) due to the weight and lack of furniture options. The Arsenal is a lot lighter, no question, and has a classic style receiver. I may be a little dissappointed with the accuracy, but overall, my opinion is that it is an AK, it is not likely to be shooting real tight groups anyway, and it does what I bought it for, for a great price, so I definitley don't regret the purchase and will be holding on to this one.

Do a search, the price drop of the SGL21 has caused quite a bit of discussion surrounding them recently. I bought one because of it.

 

[ny32182]

As far as groups, I consider 3 to be totally useless, and 5 not far behind. I want to see 20-30 to get a real idea of how it is consistently performing. One group with cold/very slowfire, and one with a warmed up barrel is good to see as well.

 

[WardenWolf]

My converted Saiga .223 shoots 2" to 2.5" patterns (depending on ammo) at 100 yards. Not a bad rifle, by any means, and I could probably accurize it further with a bit of work. Keep in mind that the effective range of .223, 5.56, and 7.62x39 is only about 600 yards, and that puts it at a 15-inch pattern even at those ranges. In other words, the rifle is chest-accurate out to the maximum effective range of the round. The Saigas are very solid platforms, and regardless of whether you convert it yourself or buy a professional conversion, you're going to like what you get. I did my own conversion, and put a Romanian Dragunov-style stock on it. That gives me a short length of pull and a rifle that I can flip to my shoulder with ease.

 

[Norinco982lover]

My Saiga 7.62x39.

It has an old style Ace stock I found at a gunshow for a good deal.

I made the sling for cheap using instructions found on the ar15 forums. I like it a lot.

It shoots well.

~Norinco

 

[sprice]

anyone else have somethin to say?