Arthritis & recoil - heavier gun solution?

[pfgrone]

Today I went to the range to work out my two primary carry weapons: a S&W 642 and a Kahr PM9. The arthritis has gotton worse over the last year so my hands hurt enough that I caught myself dreading to shoot because of the recoil. In the past, I have regretted the aches after shooting but this was the first time I let the anticipated recoil affect my shooting.

So, I"m wondering if heavier steel handguns would reduce recoil pain. The Taurus 850 .38 weighs 8 oz. more than my S&W 642. The Kahr MK9 weighs 8 oz. more than my PM9. What do you think? Any actual experience out there?

Also, has anybody tried a pair of the gel filled cycling gloves? The shooter's gloves I've looked at don't have enough padding to help.

Any suggestions appreciated. Paul

p.s. I tried a search but didn't find an answer. If anyone knows of a thread already addressing the question on using a heavier handgun, let me know. Thanks

 

[timothy75]

Those guns hurt most peoples hands without arthritis. If your looking for a range number how about a 22 or full size 357 loaded with 38's. Practicing with your carry guns is a good thing but dont damage your hands doing it excessively. If looking for a low recoil carry piece I'd suggest a Glock19 loaded with federal 9bp, or a Ruger SP101 loaded with corbon 110gr dpx. You might also consider the ported barrel route. Generally you'd be best with a heavier gun loaded with a good bullet design rather than a +P load. Good luck

 

[Cosmoline]

Sorry to hear about the arthritis. Those airweights hurt my hands, too. Try some of the older, heavier handguns. I found the Walther PP (not PPK) in .32 ACP to be extremely mild and very nice to pack. A Ruger SP101 in .38 Special would absorb a lot more recoil, esp with Hogue combat grips. Go with steel, not alloy

 

[Lonestar49]

...

Yep, have to agree with Cosmoline, as today was the last time I'm gonna fire my lightweight Colt 3" Defender, as it's taking its toll, as opposed to my Sig P220, pure joy to shoot, so I'm gonna sell or trade it asap for a SA 4" all stainless steel 45.. Weight is a good thing when it comes to recoil and arthritis, or both, as is with me.

Ls

 

[harmonic]

as opposed to my Sig P220

That's ironic because my 220 ST would frequently inflame my tendonitis in my wrist. The Sig's barrel-to-grip angle is different from my 1911s and was a problem.

That said, to the OP, it sometimes helps me to take ibuprofin an hour or so before I head to the range.

 

[P97]

I have arthritis in my hands and have a SW Airweight 642 and a Ruger P90. I shoot the SW when I have to, and the P90 for fun. Its that much difference.

 

[spwenger]

Yes, A Heavier Gun May Help

If there is anywhere you can rent or borrow one, you may wish to try a Ruger SP101, particularly with the three-inch barrel.

(Current SP101's don't necessarily come with the easiest trigger strokes for people with arthritis. If you choose to swap in a lighter main spring, leave the trigger-return spring alone.)

 

[jfh]

An alternative to buying a different / heavier gun (like an SP101) would be to try reloading.

For example--a lead bullet recipe that replicates the Speer 38+P 135-gr. Short Barrel Cartridge has been sorted out. The basic recipe is for about 6.6 gr. of AA#5 under a 140-gr. LTC bullet; is costs about 10 cents a round to build.

You can simply "back up" the charge weight for comfort--say, drop it 'way down to 5.0 gr.--and have a real softball load as well.

I have my share of aches and pains, too--but so far, the actual joint / arthritic pain is limited to my back, not in my fingers--so I'm figuring I will go with lighter reloads as it occurs.

Jim H.

 

[Lonestar49]

Quote: as opposed to my Sig P220
---------------------

Quote: That's ironic because my 220 ST would frequently inflame my tendonitis in my wrist. The Sig's barrel-to-grip angle is different from my 1911s and was a problem.

That said, to the OP, it sometimes helps me to take ibuprofen an hour or so before I head to the range.
--------------
...

Weight, recoil, grip, is a fine balance, like shoes, and I figure that your ST 220 is a far bit heavier than my Aluminium framed one..

I did have to recently remove the P220 Hogue textured wood grips and put on a Hogue full fingered rubber grip, and that made it even better, in the long run, not so much in looks, but performance at this end.. Slightly slimmer on the sides, and far less grip needed vs the wood, in applied grip strength..

I do know that while waiting for Beretta to step up to the plate about the trigger sting issue that I, and many others, are getting from our Px4 40 cals so I bought a Sig P229 40cal, Aluminum frame, and is heavier than the Px4 and I have to say that I thought the Px4 was a soft 40cal shooter, but the Sig, being heavier, is far better for faster follow-up shots.. being heavier.

Weight has its benefits for these older hands, fingers, and grip pressures with recoil being balanced out more by the gun, and less by grip strength and arms.

It's about staying comfy and yet remaining on-target and finding the solution as Advil works "great" for many, but it just eats at my stomach, with food..

Life changes, sometimes old school guns vs lighter weight ones, have their calling and benefits vs lightweight, high caliber, guns.

One day, year, at a time.. lol


Ls

 

[Sato Ord]

Not a gun solution, but have you tried acupuncture for that arthritis?

I know that many people think this is nuts, but my wife is an acupuncturist and has had a great deal of success treating arthritis. You have to find an acupuncturist who is fully trained, not some AMA doctor who took a fifty hour course and hung shingle to collect some of the money being spent on alternative health care. Most acupuncturists spend as much time in acupuncture school as AMA docs spend getting their degrees.

It works, despite what the AMA docs might tell you. Something like this wouldn't have stayed around for four thousand or more years if there wasn't something to it. Even with modern western medicine acupuncture is still out there and millions and millions of people are getting relief for conditions just like yours every day.

Don't give up on your guns, get the arthritis under control.

 

[pfgrone]

Hadn't even thought about acupuncture. I know a few people who have had good results from acupuncture for various conditions. Do you have to keep it up forever? I assume you would since arthritis is a progressive degenerative disease. I'll keep it in mind. Thanks. Paul

 

[pfgrone]

There are suggestions above to try a 45 (ACP I presume). Never having fired a .45 of any make, are you saying one of those iron monsters would have less recoil than a 9mm pocket pistol? If you say yes, I'll rent one at the range and try it. Paul

 

[Sato Ord]

As far as keeping it up goes, that depends on your body. My wife was diagnosed with lupus nearly twenty years ago. They told us then that the average life expectancy of a lupus patient at the time was fifteen to twenty years before the damage body-wide from the disease would cause death. She got progressively worse and they gave her progressively more harsh medicine until the side effects of things like plaquinil(sp) nearly did kill her.

The best thing that ever happened to her was loosing her health insurance. She was forced to look at alternative treatments. Today we have an eleven year old son (they told her that having children wouldn't work for her because of the disease) and she is still doing fine. She has occasional flair ups (usually caused by not watching her diet) but she is pretty much pain free, asymptomatic, and she hasn't seen her own acupuncturist in a while.

She was so impressed with acupuncture that she bit the bullet and went to school for it. She did so well at the school that they made her academic dean. She quit that job after two years because all of the paperwork interfered with her practice. She has been practicing for ten years now and the interesting thing is that she is so good that she often gets calls and e-mails from acupuncturists from across the globe who have been treating for twenty or more years who want her advice, or want her to teach a seminar.

You can always e-mail her at [email protected]

While she obviously can't diagnose or recommend treatment over the internet, she would be happy to answer any questions you might have, and assist you in locating an acupuncturist in your area who would be willing to talk with you and discuss your specific case in person.

She can even give you some general ideas about dietary changes you might try that will help regardless of what treatment method(s) you choose.

My wife is a great lady who has this insane idea that everyone deserves the best medical treatment, be it western, eastern, or some combination of both, they can get regardless of their location or ability to pay. She's just funny that way.

 

[Robert Hairless]

Paul, yes, .45 ACP in a gun that's comfortable for you to hold should be much easier on your hand than the .38 Special in an S&W 642. Do give it a try.

 

[owlhoot]

Paul, there is a world of difference in perceived recoil between the Kahr PM9 and the MK9. I have several full size 9's as well as the MK9 and nothing beats the MK9 for comfortable shooting.

The 642 is a monster to shoot for more than a few rounds. When I practice with mine I use handloads no stronger than factory wadcutter loads. You might consider trading it in for a Model 60 with three inch barrel. In a holster you'll never notice the difference although the M60 as well as the MK9 are too heavy for front pocket carry. You might want to consider a .32 or .380 for that function.

If carry isn't an issue, you'd certainly enjoy shooting .38's in any K or L frame gun.
My favorites are the m15, m19, and m66.

 

[mbr]

I tore the ligaments in the thumb of my shooting hand several years back, and even shooting my sp101 with +P's can make my hand hurt for several days afterwards. I have always preferred smaller guns, mostly revolvers, but recently decided to go the full-size 9mm route with a CZ75 in large part due to this issue. I've only shot it a couple of times, but the combination of the action of the slide, the extra weight, and the broader grip really helped. I shot 200 rounds the other day, pain-free. I would think the same would be true of a full-size beretta, hi-power, etc.

 

[pfgrone]

Thanks to everyone for the helpful comments!! Today I bought a pair of cycling gloves with gel padding that will prpbably help at the range. Right now, I inclined to sell or just keep in the safe the S&W 642 (my favorite gun) and get a heavier Kahr MK9. We'll see.
The full size semiautos are out for me since I was raised to wear my shirt tucked in and I live in Texas where a cover garment such as a jacket is rarely needed. I'm pretty much married to either pocket carry or my SmartCarry and I prefer pocket carry.

 

[Standing Wolf]

I always take aspirin before I leave for the range.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

pfgrone,
I shoot a M638 which is the same weight as your M642 but I find the M640, which is Stainless instead of alloy, is much more comfortable to shoot since it weighs 25oz instead of 15oz. I'm only mentioning the M640 because it's the same revolver as the M642 except for the materials it's made of. (and the weight of course) When firing .38 Special +P rounds through both the heavier revolver is noticeably more comfortable to shoot because the added weight does absorb more of the felt recoil.

 

[Robert Hairless]

ArchangelCD's suggestion is good. The S&W 640 is the stainless steel version of your 642. Its increased weight can make a suprising difference.

 

[zipper]

I have a pair of gel cycling gloves and they make a big difference when shooting my 642 or my wilson adp or a pf9 I had. Without them my hands get numb and tingle after 50 rounds. With them ,100 rounds+ and no problem.