Asking Bersa Thunder 380 owners
- Thread starter eyz
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38snapcaps
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I've had my first one for about a year and a half. Just about 1500 rounds thru it, never a malfunction but at 1200 it would occasionaly not fully go into battery when dirty. It needed a slight nudge on the back of the slide. Hmmm, sounds like recoil spring. I order a couple of them from Eagle Imports for $8 each, replaced it and now the pistol functions like brand new.
So I intend to replace the spring every thousand rounds. I've asked myself that same question, eyz, let's hope someone responds with a high mileage testimony.
So I intend to replace the spring every thousand rounds. I've asked myself that same question, eyz, let's hope someone responds with a high mileage testimony.
Lobotomy Boy
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- Feb 16, 2004
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I've put about 500 rounds through mine in the four weeks I've owned it. At that rate I should have a pretty good idea about its durability fairly soon.
So far I've had one FTE with a cheapo A-Merc round and that's it. I've been cleaning it every 150 rounds, but right now it is dirty because I'm going to see how it handles 300 rounds without a cleaning.
So far I've had one FTE with a cheapo A-Merc round and that's it. I've been cleaning it every 150 rounds, but right now it is dirty because I'm going to see how it handles 300 rounds without a cleaning.
horge
Member
Some earlier discussions on this:
Bersa Thunder Problem/Question
Bersa .380 longevity, how long?
Here's a rental Thunder 380 with maybe 4,000 to 5,000 rounds through it, based on the recollection of the RO and sales clerk. I alone account for some 500 rounds through it:
The manual safety lever's broken because some wannabe smith working at the range tried to muscle it out. The correct procedure for manual safety disassembly can be found here Further Disassembly
Here's the chief area of wear, the underlip of the slide, worn by the 'disconnector nub' of the trigger bar running back and forth along its length:
Don't mind the green arrow --it's just pointing to the large grit that the range's reloads tend to leave in the gun. The orange arrows point to the key points of wear along the shallow gouge. Gouge or no, the piece runs pretty good for several mags. It starts malf'ing after 120-plus rounds or so --the grit and gunk of the reload cartridges has to be cleaned out, and then it runs smooth again.
Closeup:
The wear isn't really that different from what I've seen at the 800 round mark, so I believe the wearing settles down after awhile. The slide catch 'notch' can have its corners round off over extended use (over 1000 rounds, maybe), and the range rental's notch had clearly been filed back into effective, catch-retaining shape.
I agree the recoil spring may need replacing, probably every 1500 to 2500 rounds. Who knows? It's good to measure the brand new spring length (or keep a brand new spare around), so you can monitor any gradual set in it. Thanks for the report re spring longevity, 38snapcaps
hth.
horge
Bersa Thunder Problem/Question
Bersa .380 longevity, how long?
Here's a rental Thunder 380 with maybe 4,000 to 5,000 rounds through it, based on the recollection of the RO and sales clerk. I alone account for some 500 rounds through it:
The manual safety lever's broken because some wannabe smith working at the range tried to muscle it out. The correct procedure for manual safety disassembly can be found here Further Disassembly
Here's the chief area of wear, the underlip of the slide, worn by the 'disconnector nub' of the trigger bar running back and forth along its length:
Don't mind the green arrow --it's just pointing to the large grit that the range's reloads tend to leave in the gun. The orange arrows point to the key points of wear along the shallow gouge. Gouge or no, the piece runs pretty good for several mags. It starts malf'ing after 120-plus rounds or so --the grit and gunk of the reload cartridges has to be cleaned out, and then it runs smooth again.
Closeup:
The wear isn't really that different from what I've seen at the 800 round mark, so I believe the wearing settles down after awhile. The slide catch 'notch' can have its corners round off over extended use (over 1000 rounds, maybe), and the range rental's notch had clearly been filed back into effective, catch-retaining shape.
I agree the recoil spring may need replacing, probably every 1500 to 2500 rounds. Who knows? It's good to measure the brand new spring length (or keep a brand new spare around), so you can monitor any gradual set in it. Thanks for the report re spring longevity, 38snapcaps
hth.
horge
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I won't worry then and buy new recoil springs every 2K. The wear issue is no issue since they're reliable out of the box. Some pistols require wear to even function properly (kahr) and cost three times as much. Why can't other manufactures be as consistent on design, parts, and assembly quality.
They love magtech (made in brazil) ammo. I use the +P HP for carry at 1082 fps.
They love magtech (made in brazil) ammo. I use the +P HP for carry at 1082 fps.
EYZ said: "They love magtech (made in brazil) ammo. I use the +P HP for carry at 1082 fps.
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I was interested in the Magtech +P JHP ammo too, but have heard that it has unreliable expansion!
Hoge has some ballistics for it on his website, but nothing reguarding expansion.
At the goldenloki.com website, there are ballistics for it in 32acp round
where it did have very poor expansion!
If someone has more ballistic info on the +P Magtech JHP I would sure like to see it.
In the mean time I will continue to carry the Speer Gold Dot that seems to have about the best performance in the 380 round.
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I was interested in the Magtech +P JHP ammo too, but have heard that it has unreliable expansion!
Hoge has some ballistics for it on his website, but nothing reguarding expansion.
At the goldenloki.com website, there are ballistics for it in 32acp round
where it did have very poor expansion!
If someone has more ballistic info on the +P Magtech JHP I would sure like to see it.
In the mean time I will continue to carry the Speer Gold Dot that seems to have about the best performance in the 380 round.
otomik
Member
i think you should get the .22lr version also and fire that as much as you want. after it's initial break-in period only shoot about a box of 50 from the .380 every time you go to the range (fire the .380 first because this is the carry pistol you'll be shooting without warm-up time).
horge
Member
Jerry,
Yeah, I've been looking around for reliable expansion data on the MagTechs, and coming up zip. There's some uncalibrated gel, wet pulp, water bags and even grapefruit testing, but... based on even those, and especially Stephen Camp's damning water test (no expansion!) of the MagTech Guardian Gold .380, I'm quite underwhelmed by the cartridges.
I agree the Speer Gold Dot 90gr JHP looks really good
--------------------
eyz,
SAAMI doesn't spec a +P or +P+ for .380 ACP.
Any such would clearly exceed pressure safety standards.
Even if we count on a robust factor of safety built into the standard ceilings, everyone and his dog has represented to me that the so-called +P pressures allegedly involved in MagTechs will drastically shorten the aluminium alloy frame's usable lifespan.
Just offering what I've heard and read
Ultimately, the cartridge choice won't matter as much as your stress-proficiency with the pistol.
Yeah, I've been looking around for reliable expansion data on the MagTechs, and coming up zip. There's some uncalibrated gel, wet pulp, water bags and even grapefruit testing, but... based on even those, and especially Stephen Camp's damning water test (no expansion!) of the MagTech Guardian Gold .380, I'm quite underwhelmed by the cartridges.
I agree the Speer Gold Dot 90gr JHP looks really good
--------------------
eyz,
SAAMI doesn't spec a +P or +P+ for .380 ACP.
Any such would clearly exceed pressure safety standards.
Even if we count on a robust factor of safety built into the standard ceilings, everyone and his dog has represented to me that the so-called +P pressures allegedly involved in MagTechs will drastically shorten the aluminium alloy frame's usable lifespan.
Just offering what I've heard and read
Ultimately, the cartridge choice won't matter as much as your stress-proficiency with the pistol.
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clubsoda22
member
I have some Winchester Ranger "T" .380 for my bersa. From what i've heared it's a solid performer.
I got my bersa to jam once after about 250 rounds of dirty magtech and UMC without cleaning. The front of the gun (nickle finish) was black from the powder residue, the inside was scarry, but it came right off with some hoppe's and a toothbrush.
I got my bersa to jam once after about 250 rounds of dirty magtech and UMC without cleaning. The front of the gun (nickle finish) was black from the powder residue, the inside was scarry, but it came right off with some hoppe's and a toothbrush.
birddog
Member
I've got about 900 rounds through mine. Nothing unusual to report, and it's my everyday carry gun. I've had perhaps 5 or 6 failures to eject both with Wolf and Winchester Whitebox. I don't worry too much about those failures as they're rare and happened after firing several mags through the gun.
The Bersa is a good little gun should last somewhere in the range of 6000-10000 rounds with normal loads, I personally would not use wolf ammo
long term in a bersa. I see the Bersa as a carry gun not a range shooter.
Most owners will not fire 6000 rounds through a gun.
long term in a bersa. I see the Bersa as a carry gun not a range shooter.
Most owners will not fire 6000 rounds through a gun.
M2 Carbine
member
This is .380 MegTech Guardian Gold and Cor Bon, shot from a Kel Tec P-3AT.
After much expermintation, in years past, I settled on using a 1 gallon water jug and a box of rags to trap the bullet, as a standard to test HP ammo.
The theory being, if the bullet will expand in one water jug and still penetrate several inches into the rags it's probably worth further expermintation.
A HP bullet that won't show, at least some decent expansion, I disreguard completely.
Some of the name brand ammo gives suprising results.
For instance, the only brand (of 4 tested) I found that will expand from the Kel Tec 32 is the Cor Bon.
Anyhow, I've only shot about 30 or 40 MegTech GG, but several hundred FMJ MagTech, so take it for what it's worth.
I carry them and Cor Bon in my KT 380.
I have a lot of 380 ammo and I've been thinking about getting a Bersa for plinking. Mostly I've heard good things about them.
After much expermintation, in years past, I settled on using a 1 gallon water jug and a box of rags to trap the bullet, as a standard to test HP ammo.
The theory being, if the bullet will expand in one water jug and still penetrate several inches into the rags it's probably worth further expermintation.
A HP bullet that won't show, at least some decent expansion, I disreguard completely.
Some of the name brand ammo gives suprising results.
For instance, the only brand (of 4 tested) I found that will expand from the Kel Tec 32 is the Cor Bon.
Anyhow, I've only shot about 30 or 40 MegTech GG, but several hundred FMJ MagTech, so take it for what it's worth.
I carry them and Cor Bon in my KT 380.
I have a lot of 380 ammo and I've been thinking about getting a Bersa for plinking. Mostly I've heard good things about them.
Good Post!
Bersa has a longer barrell than the KT so logically it should do a little better. Magtech has a very wide deep opening, looks like it would expand very well.
My thoughts on ammo (not scientific), firearms seem to digest ammo from the region they were designed or manufactured better. ie..I had a russian makarov that loved steel case russian military type ammo. That ammo would have torn up ejectors on a domestic firearm. Shot point of aim and ran like an old sewing machine. Bersa's (argentina) feed almost everything but almost seem to prefer the (brazil) magtech ammo. Not scientific but if anyone would like to test it please do so. I betcha rugers eat WWB like oreo cookies.
Bersa has a longer barrell than the KT so logically it should do a little better. Magtech has a very wide deep opening, looks like it would expand very well.
My thoughts on ammo (not scientific), firearms seem to digest ammo from the region they were designed or manufactured better. ie..I had a russian makarov that loved steel case russian military type ammo. That ammo would have torn up ejectors on a domestic firearm. Shot point of aim and ran like an old sewing machine. Bersa's (argentina) feed almost everything but almost seem to prefer the (brazil) magtech ammo. Not scientific but if anyone would like to test it please do so. I betcha rugers eat WWB like oreo cookies.
clubsoda22
member
Cream filling first?
M2 carbine, looking at your picks reminds me of why i stopped using corbon: jacket seperation. 90 grains is a light bullet, loosing the jacket doesn't help with penetration. I seriously with corbon would go to a bonded bullet (they used to use gold dots).
When the weather clears up i'll try to get som expansion pics of the rangers.
nvrquit
Member
Nickle Finish & Hoppes....
Clubsoda22,
From what I've gathered on several boards, reading the posts of others experiences, it might be good to be cautious when using Hoppes solvent on any nickle finish. Seems the Hoppes will eventually attack the nickle plating.
Just an FYI....
As for the post topic, the only round that I tested that gave my Bersas any feeding problems was the Win Silvertip, but that was in my model 85. Seemed to consistently hang on the feedramp, regardless of condition, even after the ramp had beeb mirror polished(no change to the ramp angle though). My Thunder380 Deluxe has shown no such dislike.
Otomike,
Does your Thunder22 have the same dislike of standard/sub-sonic ammo as my Thunder22 has? I ask as my Thunder22 seems to not cycle anything that isn't truly high vel. or hyper vel. ammo, as all standard or sub-sonic ammo will fail in some manner to proprely cycle, feed or extract when uesd in my Thunder22.
Horge,
Great info and links. I envy your access to the wide body Bersa .380's that we just don't have available currently. Perhaps once the sunset happens(alright everyone, write the letters, make the calls and VOTE!!!).
Clubsoda22,
From what I've gathered on several boards, reading the posts of others experiences, it might be good to be cautious when using Hoppes solvent on any nickle finish. Seems the Hoppes will eventually attack the nickle plating.
Just an FYI....
As for the post topic, the only round that I tested that gave my Bersas any feeding problems was the Win Silvertip, but that was in my model 85. Seemed to consistently hang on the feedramp, regardless of condition, even after the ramp had beeb mirror polished(no change to the ramp angle though). My Thunder380 Deluxe has shown no such dislike.
Otomike,
Does your Thunder22 have the same dislike of standard/sub-sonic ammo as my Thunder22 has? I ask as my Thunder22 seems to not cycle anything that isn't truly high vel. or hyper vel. ammo, as all standard or sub-sonic ammo will fail in some manner to proprely cycle, feed or extract when uesd in my Thunder22.
Horge,
Great info and links. I envy your access to the wide body Bersa .380's that we just don't have available currently. Perhaps once the sunset happens(alright everyone, write the letters, make the calls and VOTE!!!).
clubsoda22
member
when this bottle if finally used up i'm forcing my dad to modernize and getting a bottle of breakfree.
otomik
Member
oh hell yeah, sometimes i think they must have the same recoil spring for the .380 and .22lr models. i think it's a good thing for the most part because it's not like it's a ruger mark II, it's a plinker designed after a defense gun so i do want to shoot the hottest stuff (and velociters almost make it sound like the .380), but sometimes i wish they shipped it with a regular as well as an extra-spicy spring.
here's my notes
Remington Yellow Jacket, 33gr. Hyper Velocity Truncated Cone Hollow Point
50 rounds fired, no malfunctions
Remington Thunderbolt, 40gr. High-Velocity LRN
50 rounds fired, no malfunctions
Remington Golden Bullet, 36gr. Brass-Plated Hollow Point
100 rounds fired, 1 failure to cycle
Winchester Wildcat, 40gr. High Velocity LRN
150 rounds fired, 1 failure to cycle
Wolf Match Target, 40gr. Standard Velocity, Lubed LRN
10 rounds fired, will not cycle
Federal American Eagle, 38gr. “High-Velocityâ€, Copper-washed Hollow Point
10 rounds fired, 8 failed to cycle
Federal Lightning, 40gr. “High-Velocityâ€, LRN
10 rounds fired, 10 failed to cycle
CCI Stinger, 32gr. Hyper-Velocity, copper-washed Hollow Point
50 rounds fired, OAL of cartridge causes FTF and more difficult to load magazines
CCI Velociter, 40gr. Hyper-Velocity, copper-washed Hollow Point
150 rounds fired, no malfunctions
CCI Mini-Mag, 40gr. High-Velocity, copper washed Round Nose
150 Rounds fired, no malfunction
P95Carry
Moderator Emeritus
Useful thread .... made even better by Horge's as ever ... very fine input.
My Thunder is still a youngster ... doubt had more than 200 - 250 rounds thru ..... but all is well thus far. I doubt it will be heavily used ....... it is an occasional range attendee but now proven, will be one of several carry possibles at times.
Still looks all but NIB!
My Thunder is still a youngster ... doubt had more than 200 - 250 rounds thru ..... but all is well thus far. I doubt it will be heavily used ....... it is an occasional range attendee but now proven, will be one of several carry possibles at times.
Still looks all but NIB!
cidirkona
Member
I had my first jam with my FireStorm last night, at about 800 rounds in, using cheap-ass bear-on-the-box hollowpoints where one was pretty badly sharp-edged and the previous 70 rounds had dirtied it up really, really well and it stuck to the feed ramp...
I didn't even wanna use that junk, it's got that red stripe of hard-to-clean-crap between the bullet and the case.
-Colin
I didn't even wanna use that junk, it's got that red stripe of hard-to-clean-crap between the bullet and the case.
-Colin
horge
Member
M2 Carbine
Thanks so much for the photos.
I just want to make sure I'm reading them right. There are three recovered MagTech bullets in your photo, yes? One of them shows jacket separation and another shows failure to expand, yes?
There are at least three other informal, private tests that produced unexpanded Magtech Guardian Gold .380 JHP's, aside from the one I already mentioned earlier...
(I apologize to Stephen if posting this is out of line. Please let me know if it is)
Taken from Stephen Camp's 'HiPowers and Handguns' website, which describes the result photographed:
Representative cartridges with the recovered bullets fired into water.
The Remington Golden Saber 102gr JHP and the Hornady XTP 90gr JHP both expanded.
The MagTech Guardian Gold 85gr JHP (at bottom of image) did not.
Just observing.
FWIW, YMMV, etc...
horge
Thanks so much for the photos.
I just want to make sure I'm reading them right. There are three recovered MagTech bullets in your photo, yes? One of them shows jacket separation and another shows failure to expand, yes?
There are at least three other informal, private tests that produced unexpanded Magtech Guardian Gold .380 JHP's, aside from the one I already mentioned earlier...
(I apologize to Stephen if posting this is out of line. Please let me know if it is)
Taken from Stephen Camp's 'HiPowers and Handguns' website, which describes the result photographed:
Representative cartridges with the recovered bullets fired into water.
The Remington Golden Saber 102gr JHP and the Hornady XTP 90gr JHP both expanded.
The MagTech Guardian Gold 85gr JHP (at bottom of image) did not.
Just observing.
FWIW, YMMV, etc...
horge
M2 Carbine
member
horge
That picture was done some time in the past right after I got my Kel Tec P3AT.
The full story is, that unexpanded bullet was the first MagTech I fired and it was a squib load.
I'm not sure it even worked the slide.
Of course this made me distrust MagTech, but over the years I've had that happen a few times with factory ammo.
After shooting a few boxes of the MT Guardian Gold with Cor Bon like results I came to trust it enough to carry it in the Kel Tec.
The MT will also lose it's jacket like the Cor Bon.
If I get a chance tomorrow I'll see if I've got some other 380 HP's and run everything through the water jugs again.
I also have a few new boxes of MTGG that I'll try a sample from. Maybe MagTech's quality control leaves something to be desired.
It's nice to be retired, I have such a loose schedule.
That picture was done some time in the past right after I got my Kel Tec P3AT.
The full story is, that unexpanded bullet was the first MagTech I fired and it was a squib load.
I'm not sure it even worked the slide.
Of course this made me distrust MagTech, but over the years I've had that happen a few times with factory ammo.
After shooting a few boxes of the MT Guardian Gold with Cor Bon like results I came to trust it enough to carry it in the Kel Tec.
The MT will also lose it's jacket like the Cor Bon.
If I get a chance tomorrow I'll see if I've got some other 380 HP's and run everything through the water jugs again.
I also have a few new boxes of MTGG that I'll try a sample from. Maybe MagTech's quality control leaves something to be desired.
It's nice to be retired, I have such a loose schedule.
horge
Member
Thanks for the additional information
Almost all incidents of reported expansion-failure I've seen date from a year or longer ago, and involve water. Live tissue may produce proper expansion, and maybe Companhia Brasileira de Cartuchos has been correcting any weaknesses in its MagTech line of cartridges.
horge
Almost all incidents of reported expansion-failure I've seen date from a year or longer ago, and involve water. Live tissue may produce proper expansion, and maybe Companhia Brasileira de Cartuchos has been correcting any weaknesses in its MagTech line of cartridges.
horge
Stephen A. Camp
Moderator In Memoriam
- Joined
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- Messages
- 2,430
Hello:
horge: No problem at all with your using the picture. The only complaint I've had is when someone's taken my work and posted it as theirs. You are a gentleman and have never done such.
I did not have good luck with the Magtech, but keep in mind that I have only tested it once and with some of the first stuff out. It's possible that I got a bad batch or that some minor changes have been made that are not readily aparrent to the naked eye. I'll do some more as I get time and see.
A short time back, I did some expansion testing with Corbon's 9x18mm Makarov and got one that acted just like the Magtech .380 JHP, no expansion a tall. Usually, that load's been an aggressive expander. I certainly cannot prove it, but now and again I suspect that a "bad" bullet gets through into the loaded cartridges.
Got something under 3K rounds through my Bersa and it has yet to malfunction.
I suspect that this is more .380 shooting than most .380 owners will do, but so far no problems. Should there be any small parts breakage or catastrophic slide/frame failures, I'll sure post it.
The Ranger .380 seems to be really good stuff, but can be hard to get for many. As far as I can tell, the Golden Saber does just about the same, but both penetrate only about 7 to 9" in ballistic gelatin, depending upon whose reports are being read. Both are standard velocity/standard pressure rounds.
If I get the opportunity and remember to wag it along, I'll try and shoot some critters small enough to be humane/large enough to stop the bullets with some .380 loads as I can and will see what the bullets look like. Most look very similar to the wet pack tests, but penetration is very different. (It takes forever to shoot enough to come up with a reliable "conversion" factor to predict penetration IF it can even be done. We'll see.
My Bersa is in the safe right now and unloaded. Here a time back when I was doing an article or two on them, I carried it for a few days legally concealed. It's a peach to carry, but I personally just want a bit more for self-protection. The ammo that was most convenient was Federal 90-gr. "Classic" JHP. I just loaded the Bersa with that, loaded another magazine and thought no more of ammo "effectiveness" as I truly believe that placement will be a primary determinant in making an aggressor stop because he has to rather than just wants to.
So far, I remain fairly certain that these little things remain one of the best deals on the market.
.22 Bersa: I've not owned one for several years and it wasn't called "Thunder" at that time, but was an all-steel, blued pistol very similar. Mine, too, required the use of Hi-Speed or hypervelocity .22's to function properly. With those, it didn't miss a lick, but standard velocity didn't work all that well as it did not have "enough" to operate the slide fully.
Best.
horge: No problem at all with your using the picture. The only complaint I've had is when someone's taken my work and posted it as theirs. You are a gentleman and have never done such.
I did not have good luck with the Magtech, but keep in mind that I have only tested it once and with some of the first stuff out. It's possible that I got a bad batch or that some minor changes have been made that are not readily aparrent to the naked eye. I'll do some more as I get time and see.
A short time back, I did some expansion testing with Corbon's 9x18mm Makarov and got one that acted just like the Magtech .380 JHP, no expansion a tall. Usually, that load's been an aggressive expander. I certainly cannot prove it, but now and again I suspect that a "bad" bullet gets through into the loaded cartridges.
Got something under 3K rounds through my Bersa and it has yet to malfunction.
I suspect that this is more .380 shooting than most .380 owners will do, but so far no problems. Should there be any small parts breakage or catastrophic slide/frame failures, I'll sure post it.
The Ranger .380 seems to be really good stuff, but can be hard to get for many. As far as I can tell, the Golden Saber does just about the same, but both penetrate only about 7 to 9" in ballistic gelatin, depending upon whose reports are being read. Both are standard velocity/standard pressure rounds.
If I get the opportunity and remember to wag it along, I'll try and shoot some critters small enough to be humane/large enough to stop the bullets with some .380 loads as I can and will see what the bullets look like. Most look very similar to the wet pack tests, but penetration is very different. (It takes forever to shoot enough to come up with a reliable "conversion" factor to predict penetration IF it can even be done. We'll see.
My Bersa is in the safe right now and unloaded. Here a time back when I was doing an article or two on them, I carried it for a few days legally concealed. It's a peach to carry, but I personally just want a bit more for self-protection. The ammo that was most convenient was Federal 90-gr. "Classic" JHP. I just loaded the Bersa with that, loaded another magazine and thought no more of ammo "effectiveness" as I truly believe that placement will be a primary determinant in making an aggressor stop because he has to rather than just wants to.
So far, I remain fairly certain that these little things remain one of the best deals on the market.
.22 Bersa: I've not owned one for several years and it wasn't called "Thunder" at that time, but was an all-steel, blued pistol very similar. Mine, too, required the use of Hi-Speed or hypervelocity .22's to function properly. With those, it didn't miss a lick, but standard velocity didn't work all that well as it did not have "enough" to operate the slide fully.
Best.
could someone please do a current test on magtech 380 +P 1082fps out of a bersa thunder or walther ppk. using denim and gelatin or water. i can't do this at the range i go to and the neighbors would call the cops if i tested in my backyard.
the barrells seem very different between the p3at and the thunder. i had a p3at and the barrell seemed paper thin and not as close tolerances down the bore.
I would be very gratefull, (but no money).
the barrells seem very different between the p3at and the thunder. i had a p3at and the barrell seemed paper thin and not as close tolerances down the bore.
I would be very gratefull, (but no money).
I would certainly consider using the MagTech as my carry round if it were shown that it will reliably expand and has reasonable penetration.
JMO, but I believe at this time, the gelatin medium is the gold standard for bullet performance testing.
In the gelatin test done by the people over at
http://forums.stoppingpower.net/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=4225&SearchTerms=p-3at
using a Kel-Tec P-3AT, two usually reliable rounds, the Corbon and the Federal Hydro Shock did not expand at all from the KT's short barrel!
The Gold Dot on the other hand did expand and did have what I would consider reasonable penetration.
The stoppingpower.net group shoots 5 rounds of each brand and then average out the performance.
Since the Gold Dot did reliably expand at the lower velocities from the Kel-Tec, I feel reasonably safe that they will also expand at the higher velocities from the Bersa's longer barrel.
The Gold Dot 380 also performed well in the FBI gelatin testing.
Data from the FBI gelatin tests of some 380 rounds can be seen at the link below.
http://www.firearmstactical.com/ammo_data/380acp.htm
Until I see satisfactory performance from the MagTech 380 round in gelatin tests, I will carry the Gold Dot!
JMO, but I believe at this time, the gelatin medium is the gold standard for bullet performance testing.
In the gelatin test done by the people over at
http://forums.stoppingpower.net/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=4225&SearchTerms=p-3at
using a Kel-Tec P-3AT, two usually reliable rounds, the Corbon and the Federal Hydro Shock did not expand at all from the KT's short barrel!
The Gold Dot on the other hand did expand and did have what I would consider reasonable penetration.
The stoppingpower.net group shoots 5 rounds of each brand and then average out the performance.
Since the Gold Dot did reliably expand at the lower velocities from the Kel-Tec, I feel reasonably safe that they will also expand at the higher velocities from the Bersa's longer barrel.
The Gold Dot 380 also performed well in the FBI gelatin testing.
Data from the FBI gelatin tests of some 380 rounds can be seen at the link below.
http://www.firearmstactical.com/ammo_data/380acp.htm
Until I see satisfactory performance from the MagTech 380 round in gelatin tests, I will carry the Gold Dot!
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