Assault Weapon Recommendations: NJ

[RavenVT100]

Given the numerous conflicting reports I've heard on magazines in this state, I am inclined to remain using my 10 rounders. I just do not wish to assume any risk.

I still don't think you should be using the term "assault weapon" anywhere near the sentence "what should I buy?" Remember, when the AWB lapsed, the rifles in question ceased to be called such due to the fact that it was a legal definition and not a technical one. If it's legally defined as an assault weapon in your state, it's illegal. So you're not going to be buying any of those, but you will be able to buy rifles that use the Armalite platform, which is probably what you wanted in the first place.

I really do think we need to take the high road and exercise discretion in the terminology we use. The term "assault weapon" is a politically charged, inflammatory piece of terminology that does not belong anywhere near rifles that are going to be used for recreational purposes and only used otherwise in the most dire of emergencies. If you like calling them assault weapons, that is your perogative. But they're not assault weapons, and you could potentially put yourself at risk by calling them that.

 

[Highland Ranger]

term "assault weapon" is a politically charged, inflammatory piece of terminology that does not belong anywhere near rifles that are going to be used for recreational purposes

Was kind of kidding above - didn't mean to pull your chain.

I understand where you are coming from but the fact of the matter is that if we as pro-2a people don't like a term, then we need to coin one that carries the same meaning and is easily identifiable for everyone we want to communicate with; Assault Weapon means something and I am getting the kind of advice I asked for (thanks for all the responses) . . . maybe I should have said self defense rifle? Not sure if that would have illicitied the same responses.

Like it or not though, "Assault Weapon" is part of our dictionary at this point.

As to the various recommendations above - thanks and I am happy to hear there are options here in PRNJ; I may wind up with a 44 lever just the same but I think I'll start by going to Meltzers and seeing what they have on the shelf.

Having said that, do we have a caliber consensus? Is it 223? 30-06?

 

[El Rojo]

Hey, the State of Maryland came up with the word "assault weapon". If you don't like when a Marylander uses the term given to certain weapons in that state, go to Maryland and vote those anti-gunners out of office and help them repeal it. Otherwise, let it go and just help the guy out. He has enough to worry about in a leftist state than some anal retentive in free America having a hernia over the term "assault weapon".

I really do think we need to take the high road and exercise discretion in the terminology we use. The term "assault weapon" is a politically charged, inflammatory piece of terminology that does not belong anywhere near rifles that are going to be used for recreational purposes and only used otherwise in the most dire of emergencies. If you like calling them assault weapons, that is your perogative. But they're not assault weapons, and you could potentially put yourself at risk by calling them that.

Put himself at risk by calling them assault weapons? Think that one over again Mr. Inflamatory-Scare Tactics. Seriously, take your soap box over to Legal and Political and just give him some recommendations here for what rifle he ought to buy. I think part of the High Road also includes not going off the deep end when someone says "assault weapons".

Caliber consensus? Again, I think you should get the lever gun in .44 mag or .357, a Garand, and an AR-15. Yes all three. You need to start somewhere, you might as well start big!

 

[Ghost_Point]

Get the VEPR Clone and screw the whole wall thing. Most bullets are going to go through regular walls. I shot a .32 handgun through my wall. Just remember where you are pointing the Firearms and use a big enough round to keep the enemy from shooting back. You can try to aim low so the round goes to the ground after passing through the enemy but a light bullet will change trajectory more. .223s go through walls and so do .30carbines. plus those little bullets don't always stop attackers. For the home use a handgun or short shotgun because it will manuever better in close quarters. For my home I use 9mm handgun and my parents use a 20 gauge.

 

[Rack Grade]

Rauchman!!!!

I was super-interested to see your list of guns seen in NJ stores. I have been trying to find out if I can buy a PTR-91, VEPR and AR180B.

I called the state police number for such things, but the guy was not knowledgeable enough to answer the question.

Based on the list you provided and the logic, all these are legal right? (subject to mag capacity restrictions of course).

Can you tell me where in NJ you saw the stuff you listed?

 

[rauchman]

PM sent

 

[115grfmj]

NJ law regarding assualt weapons is very hazy....

I highly recommend Evan Nappens book on NJ gun law. Oh and by the way
just because you might be able to get it at gun store does'nt mean its
legal here, either through ignorance or interpretation, I've heard of
dealers stocking firearms on the banned list. So buyer beware. In addition
even if you get something thats legal but "looks bad" you could be forced to
hire an attorney to prove its kosher. That happened to a Lincroft man
last year, when the police seized his Marlin Camp Carbine, he spent a
lot of money with his attorney proving what he had was legal.
Not a very gun friendly state here.

 

[Lobotomy Boy]

Watching an episode of "The Sopranos," it occured to me that New Jersey's strict gun control laws help the mobsters. If normal civilians were allowed to conceal carry, the criminals wouldn't be able to get away with much of their violent crime. It would be in their best interest to lobby for strict gun-control laws.

Example: The Christopher character pulls a gun on a guy at a construction site. Other workers come to help the guy but a bunch of gangsters beat the crap out of him. Had the non-criminal workers been armed, the gangsters would not have been able to get away with their assault. Without a monopoly on the use of violent force, the mobsters would be washed up in New Jersey, forcing them to move to New York or California.

 

[Wolfy]

Blocked magazines are not legal.

A few months ago this topic was discussed on AR15.com. The AG ruled that blocked mags are illegal and each one can get you 6 months in jail!!!!!!!! I can't find the link but it was discussed. The AG changed the rules the end of August just in time for the AWB to expire. It was preemptive to prevent a large number of mags being converted.

For what it worth Phil at Brick Armory in Brick NJ started converting 10 round mags to 15 he removes the bottom cuts down the floorplate and puts the mag back together. This is the best solution because you can't be tried for converting the mag by removing the a block.

Also if you are looking for an EBR Phil is the man to talk to he carries all brands and has the largest selection I have seen. If he doesn't have it he can get it. I haven't been to Sarco so I can't compare.

I picked up my firsta Bushmaster AR15 model A2 on Saturday. He had a customer bring one in for cash. He knew I was stopping down so he put it aside for me he told me it was going on the rack for $650 but I could have it for $500. I looked it over and it was never fired not once!!! Came with the case paperwork and the sling still in the plastic bag. He gave me the rifle for $500 because I am a very good customer and Phill takes care of his customers.

But you can own an AR in this state just get one soon because with the AWB expiring the manufacturers are going to start making most of them with features that are banned in theis state. Remember NJ is a small percentage of there sales so they will build what will appeal to the masses(this is only my opinion).

 

[MAUSER88]

My guy in Freehold only charges $20.00 for transfer of any long gun. Hard to find better that!! Hunting World of Guns. Vinny Pugliese.

 

[rauchman]

A few months ago this topic was discussed on AR15.com. The AG ruled that blocked mags are illegal and each one can get you 6 months in jail!!!!!!!! I can't find the link but it was discussed. The AG changed the rules the end of August just in time for the AWB to expire. It was preemptive to prevent a large number of mags being converted.

Hey Wolfe,

Thanks for the info. Didn't realize they had changed the rules.

 

[MAUSER88]

OH Really??? Got a link?? Nothing on the AG's web page about this?? Did Phil tell you this?? My buddy works for SARCO and he knows nothing about this "change".

 

[9mmMike]

Blocked magazines are not legal.

I do believe that is only true if they can be unblocked. If they are permanently altered to hold 15 or less (at least this is true for pistols) you're OK.
And while we're at it, LE-marked mags are also OK.

Mike

 

[rauchman]

First off, sorry for hijacking this thread but I have a couple of questions regarding the hicap mag limit for NJ. I would love to get a Glock 17, but I really can't see getting one and not being able to use high cap mags. Does anyone know if there are 15 round mags available for the G17 or how would you block them to bring them down to 15 rounds?

 

[geekWithA.45]

Here we go again with the temporary blocked mag thing in NJ.

For starters, the AG goesn't have the authority to issue regulatory change without following due process, and if he had, Evan Nappen would have been all over it.

The State Police tried to slip in a regulatory change on this topic a few years back, and failed.

Background:

The law states that "blocked magazines" are lawful, but never specified whether the blockage needed to be permanent or not.

This went undefined until 2002, when the SP tried to clarify it as needing a permanent blockage. This attempt failed, and as a result, brought into judicial notice the fact that temporary blocks had been deemed acceptable.

http://www.evannappen.com/lawupdate1gunbook/

That's the most recent, well documented status I'm aware of, and will continue to be my opinion on the matter until I see something more definitive from the AG's office, the SP regulations, or a notice from an NJ gun lawyer.


Now, as for what the state cops and leos might be running around telling the FFL's, that's an entirely different matter. The various agencies of NJ are renowned for asserting the illegality of things that aren't, and that's pretty much business as usual in the garden of poop state.

 

[MAUSER88]

geekWithA.45 , you are 100% correct. He's getting his information from the State Police who have their own agenda!

 

[rauchman]

Errrr, ok, is it ok to have greater than 15 round mags that are nonpermantly blocked?

 

[MAUSER88]

For now YES. In the future, who knows?

 

[Wolfy]

Mauser if you read my post I stated that AR15 was my source.

Please when you blame people blame the right person/source.

 

[MAUSER88]

Wolfy, I really don't care who your source was. Fact is YOUR WRONG. If your going to post something as important as being legal or illegal, check your information before posting. Don't we have enough problems as gun owners in this state without causing more problems that stem from false information?

 

[JimC]

which isn't THAT much of a problem since no one can get a CCW in NJ anyway.

I've had one since '97.

NJSP is no longer accepting any previous method of blocking magazines of any type to 15 rounds unless it is a permanent block (???). Take your chances if you will.

 

[cookekdjr]

OK, back to recommendations. I like:

1.
Saiga in 7.62 x39, 16" version. I have no idea if this is legal in NJ but if it is I recommend it highly. AK simplicity and reliablity, great caliber, and cheap ammo that will allow you to practice enough to be really good with this gun. I wish finances had not forced me to sell mine. Also, more accurate than you would think and dirt cheap to boot.
2.
Winchester 1894 trapper in .44 mag. When you carry a .44 mag as a sidearm, this allows you to have the same caliber in your rifle. The 16" barrel adds another 300 fps in velocity (!), and, like the Saiga, its size makes this a great truck/backseat gun (Again, no idea if carrying a gun in your car is legal in NJ, but sometimes its better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6 ). Also consider this combo in .357.

 

[MAUSER88]

Saiga's are legal in NJ. Good choice.

 

[RAY WOODROW 3RD]

Evan's Associate - Rich Gilbert on the subject

I found this on njcsd.org.

http://www.njcsd.org/board/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?;act=ST;f=21;t=2144

Unless you feel like fighting the "I will use all of the state's money to prosecute and jail you OR make you broke" State of New Jeresy I would permanently block them guys. Phil is a good guy and is only looking out for us gun owners.

RW3



Nov. 09 2004,11:03

Yesterday I finally received a reply from Evan Nappans Law firm in which I asked about the legality of "blocked" large capacity magazines in NJ. Below is his reply,

From: "Jennifer K." <[email protected]> [Add to Address Book] [View Source]
To: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: NEW LAW TODAY ABOUT MAGS IN NJ
Date: Mon, 8 Nov 2004 18:48:53 +0000


Dear Tom:



I'm Rich Gilbert, Evan's Associate. The way the statute and administrative code are written, any magazine for a semi-automatic firearm holding over 15 rounds is illegal. No exceptions are made in the law itself. The blocking provision has always been an informal situation, and there are many State officials out there who do not believe that blocking a magazine of large capacity should be allowed at all. Therefore, I would simply not recommend that anyone possess a magazine for a semi-automatic firearm which can hold over 15 rounds, even if it is blocked. You simply do not want to have to defend yourself against charges which, if the State wins at trial, could make you a convicted felon and prohibit you from possessing firearm in the future.



Thank you,

Rich Gilbert, Esquire
For the Firm

"Rool the dice and you take your chances............"

 

[MAUSER88]

Yep, that's my letter offering THEIR opinion. Not the law as stated by the AG's office as the State Police cannot change the current ruling. My mags are all permanently blocked as I'm not willing to "roll the dice" one way or the other. As far as Phil being a "good" guy, Opinions are like a**holes, everybody has one.