Jim Watson
Member
Post number is at the lower right corner with Like Quote Reply.
This is #76.
This is #76.
Lol, well look at that! When I flip my phone to landscape mode it magically appears! Thanks!The post number is near the right side of the message field, across from your signature/time of posting.
This is exactly what I'm talking about. Hysterical responses that take any comment that does not 100% agree out of context and altering the intended meaning.Oh BTW IMHO...
Post #67 for the win! Thnx for clear ideas, suggestions, and NOT saying I ''have no need'' to buy a kit for regular reasons, as a hobby, collecting, investment, etc. , or the absolute worst and most egregious,some here are FLAT OUT AGREEING with the opposition.
That's because the proposed legislation is not the subject of this thread.So far, nobody here has discussed these consequences of the proposed regulations:
So let's play devil's advocate, since we already have laws against crime - why not simply abolish the NICS system and have Handguns on sale like any commodity in the supermarket, next to the organic vegetables. Or in the convenience stores in the central city? Most buyers will be law abiding but a small percent won't be. That is the situation also with the kits.
Folks are not thinking this through. There is a meta principle here above and beyond the 80% kits. Would you buy a kit if you have to go through an FFL?
If you don't want any checks on anyone buying a gun, say so. The kits are a minor nuance.
Why don't folks see that? Who buys the kits for a simple hobby or to have one to make a gun that hasn't gone through NICS for a potential trace?
Should anyone who builds their own firearm need to be licensed as a manufacturer, and serialize their construction and file it with the ATF?
It already does. If you intend to sell a firearm made from an 80% receiver, it must have a serial number, excise tax paid, etc.. Which means you have to be a licensed manufacturer. Which many gunsmiths are. Not something the individual can accomplish.If they intend to sell it, then the gun should be subject to the same constraints has any gun manufacturer.
I don’t believe this is accurate for a hobbiest, someone who builds a gun and then later decides to sell it. ATF suggests you add a serial number but it’s not currently required by statute IIRC.If you intend to sell a firearm made from an 80% receiver, it must have a serial number, excise tax paid, etc.. Which means you have to be a licensed manufacturer. Which many gunsmiths are. Not something the individual can accomplish.
That's because the proposed legislation is not the subject of this thread.
Although we do not undertake an exhaustive historical analysis today of the full scope of the Second Amendment, nothing in our opinion should be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms.
I’m the OP. This isn’t about proposed legislation, it’s about a proposed administrative rule change. Legislation requires Congress and the President. Administrative rule changes just need bureaucrats and the absence of sufficient public resistance.I suggest you re-read the OP.
Define "80%", and define "kit". These are not currently defined in any legislation, and therefore can mean a block of aluminum or two parts bought together.If they intend to sell it, then the gun should be subject to the same constraints has any gun manufacturer. Folks are still avoiding the question of whether they support NICS or Glocks should be on sale at the supermarket to anyone of age. That's really the argument. The kits are to avoid NICS and not hobbyists for the most part. So if the P80 kits don't go through an FFL, should any NICS like checks exist? Lorcins For You - in the convenience store?
All the nitpicking of 80% or what part, avoids the issue of guns being produced and sold, perhaps to prohibited persons without the current NICS or similar system.
My above post was not in response to you.Craig, you avoid the issue with trivia and if you don't like to argue, you don't have to log on. The issue again and again is whether the kits are being bought to produce guns for prohibited persons and perhaps being bought by prohibited persons to begin with. Thus, to be specific should the P80 Glock kits, for example, have to go through an FFL. Yes or No? If not, then should there be any NICS checks or similar procedures?
Last, you don't decided what is constitutional. Has Scotus said background checks are unconstitutional in principle?
Here's Heller for you:
If the P80 kits can be sold and advertised as quickly assembling a gun, then they seem to be able to be regulated as a standard, complete handgun.
The people don't decide what is constitutional???
AR-15-type
My understanding is that if you build a firearm from scratch, you can never sell it. Because it has no serial number and since the GCA of 1968, it is illegal to manufacture a firearm without one.I don’t believe this is accurate for a hobbiest, someone who builds a gun and then later decides to sell it. ATF suggests you add a serial number but it’s not currently required by statute IIRC.
A block of aluminum is not a firearm receiver. Which is completely off topic anyway. The subject is 80% receivers. Not scratch-building guns from raw material.So that means if I am a skilled machinist with a CNC machine and a block of aluminum I can “readily” build any weapon I want. So I guess my block of aluminum needs to be serialized.
My above post was not in response to you.
The people don't decide what is constitutional???
We were posting at the same time, I should've gone back and added the quote.Sorry if I thought you were talking to me. Oops.
Pretty sure a block of aluminum does not constitute 80%.Define "80%", and define "kit". These are not currently defined in any legislation, and therefore can mean a block of aluminum or two parts bought together.
The subject is 80% receivers.
Oxycontin is legal, how's that going?