Beginner's Question:

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Nixon

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So, after viewing Grice's new catalog (http://issuu.com/digitalwires/docs/shooters-sale_2012?viewMode=magazine&mode=embedhttp://issuu.com/digitalwires/docs/shooters-sale_2012?viewMode=magazine&mode=embed), I've decided to take the plunge into the world of reloading.

I'm completely new to the art of handloading, and have absolutely no prior experience. However, after reading quite a bit online about the hobby, it seems like a good fir for me, due to what I demand out of my rifles and handguns.

The calibers that I will be primarily focused on are:
.38 Special
9mm
.308
8mm
.22-250
.223
30-30
7.62x54r (not sure if you can reload this one)
.357 Magnum
.44 Magnum
.32 H&R Magnum
300 Weatherby Magnum
.338 Lapua Magnum

So, it has come down between two presses. The RCBS and the Hornady that Grice is offering on sale (pages 9 & 10)

I'm looking for as much advice as anyone can give me as to which package is more complete/a better buy/better for the calibers that I listed/better quality/etc.

Thanks in advance guys!

-Nixon
 
Beginner

Nixon,

Go with the RCBS setup. No one in the business has better customer service and support. Dillon and Lee are almost as good. Buy Lee dies, they are the best value on the market . If you choose to go " progressive"' Dillon is the way to go.


Have fun.


Matt
 
I have been using the same RCBS Rockchucker since 1970.
And it is going to still be going strong long after I am.

Also, not knocking Hornady.
But RCBS has the best customer service in the world, on the off chance you ever do need it.

rc
 
Well, I would stay with the single stage, if for no other reason for precision on those cal's you listed and the progressive is not something you can accomplish reload after reload. and shell holders are less than shell plates on the auto progressives not to mention all the extra bushings you would need for each die setup.
 
Thanks so far guys.

A-FIXER: I intended to stay with a single stage for the time being, especially for the rifles. I expect sub-MOA out of my guns, and have just not been getting it with affordable ammo.

rcmodel: Is there any advantage/disadvantage to the Hornady LnL system? If so/not, would you recommend changing the RCBS over to LnL bushings?

River Dog: I intend to one day go to an AP press as I add calibers/take the Mrs. up on her offer to start competing in 3-gun. I'm sure I'll have another thread concerning this up by then.

-Nixon
 
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If so/not, would you recommend changing the RCBS over to LnL bushings?
Click to expand...
Personally, I think the LnL is An Ingenious Solution to a Non-existent Problem.

Once you adjust a new set of dies the first time, and lock the lock-ring set-screw, it never has to be changed again unless you change the amount of crimp.

It takes all of a 20 seconds to screw one die out of the press and screw the other one in.
And you only need to do it once when loading bottle neck rifle, and twice when loading pistol.
No matter if you load 1 round, or in 1,000 round batches.

So what is saving less then half a minute in die change time in a full reloading session worth to you?

Would you spend $4.00 each for a L&L bushing for every die you own?

In your case with all those calibers?
You would be looking at 30+ LnL bushings = $125+, plus the $10 conversion kit.

Sure would not be worth it to me!

rc
 
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Single stage all the way. IMO it's the best way to learn the intricacies of reloading without confusing the heck out of you......I have no experience with Hornady presses but I'm sure they are a fine press. That being said I've owned RCBS for years and they make a great, very sturdy product. Cabelas has a great deal going on right now......take a look at the master reloading kit. Almost everything that you need http://www.cabelas.com/product/Shoo...=SBC;MMcat104792580;cat104761080;cat104516280 It looks like the sale ends on the 22nd so if you're on the fence you might want to take the plunge soon.
 
One of the largest questions I've had so far is if the case trimmer tool that comes with the RCBS kit is a necessary accessory to have at first. All of my brass is once-fired, and other than the .223 (thanks Armalite for marring the crap out of my cases) is decently straight (from visable inspection).

From what I can tell, the Hornady kit does not come with this tool, but I could be wrong...
 
Yes, you will need a case trimmer, sooner or later.
Probably sooner, even with once fired brass, if you want to start out with them all the same length.

You also need a dial or digital caliper to measure case length, or to adjust the trimmer.
I didn't read all the details of either kit, but if there isn't a caliper included, get one.

rc
 
Any of the "O" frame presses out there - Lee included - will more than handle the calibers you have listed. RCBS, Hornady and Lee are very good brands making gear that will last a lifetime and are all capable of producing safe, reliable and accurate ammo.

You will want some calipers - I am happy with my $10 Harbor Freight digitals, a good scale - the 505 is a top rated beam scale, etc.

For the record, I was totally satisfied with my Lee Anniv single stage kit ($82 at Factory Sales) https://fsreloading.com/html/xcart/catalog/anivers.html - though I did swap out their finicky beam scale for a $30 digital. Since I reload only pistol right now I have upgraded my production rate with their very nice auto-advancing Classic turret.
 
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RCBS was my first press almost 40 yrs ago. Still going strong. Hornady is what my AP is for mainly pistol ammo, large volume. I would not be concern about either one of these. As for the Bushings, you do not need to use them. Just screw then dies in to the set that comes with the press and go. I like Hornady dies better than RCBS. There are 2 reasons. One is the drop down bullet guide in the bullet seater die. The other is the split locking ring used to lock the die. Just easier to do finer adj once tightened.
 
You cannot go wrong with the RCBS Rockchucker press. I also have the Hornady LNL AP press for my pistol reloading. The Hornady bushing is nice on the AP press since your multiple dies mounted and don't have as much hand room to unscrew the die in the conventional manner. However, on a single stage, I see no real advantage.
 
I own gear that is made by Lee, RCBS, Hornaday, Lyman, Bair, Herters, Dillon, Pacific, Ohaus, Frankfort Arsenal, Hollywood, MEC, IDEAL, and others that escape me just now. The stuff is all good, some is over 70 years old and still going strong. I think that if you get quality equipment from any of the major players you can't go wrong. Just decide what you want for features and what price versus those features is best for you and go for it.:D FWIW the Lee products are the biggest value for the money in almost all instances. The dies especially so if you do not want bench rest accuracy from them.
 
I've been reloading metallic cartridges for more than 40 years. 'Back in the day' when I was just starting out, many reloaders (especially the ones that I learned from) turned out much better, higher quality reloads than 90% of what I see around today. (I suppose this is what we get for everybody moving to progressive presses.)

My RCBS equipment is over 35 years old, has been rebuilt once, and remains in very good to excellent condition. No way would I be quick to give it up! When I walk into a store like Gander Mountain, today, I am absolutely shocked to see how flimsy and lightweight the New RCBS reloading equipment has become.

Yes, RCBS Technical Support is, and long has been, very very good; however, so is the Technical Support at Dillon Precision - In my opinion Dillon is every bit as good as RCBS!

If I were to start out reloading all over again today, I'd either go with a Hornady, 'Lock 'n Load' press, or else I'd go with a Dillon Precision #550B press - Which CAN, also, be used as a single stage press.

A single stage press is fine, especially for rifle ammunition; and single stage is THE right way to learn metallic cartridge reloading; but (You knew there'd be a, 'but' - Right!) it's very easy to quickly outgrow a single stage press. If you do a lot of pistol shooting that single stage is going to get old (read, 'boring') real fast.

This is, 'Why' I, personally, wouldn't want to dick around with anything that wouldn't accept die station changes quickly while still being able to be used as a single stage when desired.
 
RCBS Rock Chucker press is as solid as they come. You will have no problem loading your large rifle cases with one. I am not fond of the 'kits' because I have found that all the different makers of tools have something to offer. That being said, I think you will be getting more than one press because pistol reloading tends to be more about quantity than precision. My last batch of .45 auto (500 rounds) took about 8 hours on a single stage press. I load the same on a progressive in about 2 hours with a lot less toil and wear on the fingers. I wouldn't be opposed to a Dillon 550 for all of your reloading needs. It does cost more (shell plates) per caliber, but offers the option of volume reloading (pistol), and will handle all of those rifle calibers. If you continue your search, you will find more than one correct answer.

Cheap, fast, match-grade. Pick one.
 
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rcmodel said:
I have been using the same RCBS Rockchucker since 1970.
And it is going to still be going strong long after I am.

Also, not knocking Hornady.
But RCBS has the best customer service in the world, on the off chance you ever do need it.

rc
Click to expand...

rc...gee....mines only 41 years old. You win.:) I admit after all these years I'm a bit less patient, so I bought my RCBS Pro 2000. Still, I wouldn't be without my Rock Chucker. Use them both. It costs a bit to add a new caliber to any progressive, so I still load many calibers the tried and true way. I add a new caliber every few months as I gain more experience with the Pro 2000. I absolutely love both machines...totally recommend them...even over the Dillons I tried first.

To the O.P......Rockchucker kits contains tools you won't outgrow...all quality stuff. The best kits out there. I bought my "Kit" from Gander Mountain 41 years ago, and still use ALL of the tools that came with it. The tools you get now are the same or better.

BTW, on progressives....the Dillon 550 is a manual advance 4 station press, the Dillon 650 is an auto-advance 5 station press. The RCBS Pro 2000 is either a manual advance or autoadvance, and you can always upgrade to auto advance for $110. (Either way you get 5 stations) You can't upgrade a Dillon...you buy a new press. No progressive changes calibers as fast as a Pro 2000....something to think about thinking of all those calibers you listed.
 
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Hey Nixon,

I also have an RCBS RockChucker which I think I may have purchased from Grice Gun Shop when I lived in Clearfield, Pennsylvania back in the 1960s. In 1997 I purchased a Hornady L&L AP press. To this day, I still use both presses for different jobs. I wouldn't think of getting rid of my RockChucker just because I now have an L&L AP. Like I said, they both have their uses on a reloading bench.

There are some that say you should start with a single stage press to learn the craft of reloading, and I am in the same camp with those folks. Single stage costs less to start, and you will always have a use for it.

RC mentioned that he did not give much credence to the idea of the L&L die set quick change feature, and I agree with what he said completely. I feel the same way about Dillon's die set quick change feature cosisting of different tool heads. I have no time for either of them, and one of these days I am going to fix my L&L bushings permanently in place in my L&L press. I never could understand why changing dies is such a problem for some folks. Accordingly, if you were to get a single stage press like the RockChucker, I would not recommend changing it to use L&L bushings.

Do not take what I said as meaning I do not think Hornady L&L AP and Dillon 650 presses are not good. They are very good presses, and they certainly are useful for loading ammunition in quantity. I simply recommend that everyone start their reloading with a single stage. I also submit you will continue to have use for that single stage if and when you ever decide a progressive machine is needed.

As a final thought, all the reloading tools in the world would not be much good if you do not have a good reloading manual. My recommendation for the best "first" manual is the Lyman manual. It is filled with valuable information about reloading as a craft as well as all the load data most people will need to start loading.

Best wishes,
Dave Wile
 
Nixon said:
Is there any advantage/disadvantage to the Hornady LnL system? If so/not, would you recommend changing the RCBS over to LnL bushings?
Click to expand...
rcmodel said:
Personally, I think the LnL is An Ingenious Solution to a Non-existent Problem.
Would you spend $4.00 each for a L&L bushing for every die you own?
Click to expand...
I got the L&L conversion kit for my RCBS. I agree with rc completely; however am happy I paid for it. Sure, it's $4 a die but it makes it very easy to swap around dies when reloading. It is solely paying for a convenience, and for me, its worth it.

I recommend you buy the kit and try it out on one set of dies. If you like it, great, if not, switch back to the original bushings.
 
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