Boonie Guns

[amprecon]

These SHTF scenario post have been taken to the extreme. I offer a different type of scenario.

Okay, for whatever reason, you will be in a vast wilderness hundreds of miles from any civilization, either by choice or by circumstance.

You may take whatever you like, but you must carry it and all it's ammo with you. There is no support or spare parts, what you take is what you can carry including bedding, utensils, extra clothes, anything you can stuff in a backpack. You will be on your own for an indefinite amount of time.

There may be large and dangerous animals and even two-legged predators, but these are not your primary concern, food is.
What do you take?

I'm thinking of either two Marlin 60's or two 10/22's with several thousand rounds. I'd take two, in case I needed parts to make a good one, along with a small cleaning kit. I might even be wiser to choose a bolt .22 for the added durability/reliability.

 

[Andrew Wyatt]

enfield number4 mk 1

 

[cratz2]

If no spare parts are available and I'd be out there for, say, a year I'd probably either go for an accurized single shot 22lr with iron sights and a scope with quick detach rings. Or a proven battle rifle, my preference of which is a No 4 Mk 1. If I were in an area where defense from large animals might be a consideration, I'd go for the Lee. If the only thing I was worried about was food gathering, I'd go for the 22.

 

[John G]

The Cooper Scout Rifle seems ideal for this task.

Since I don't have one yet, I'll go with my Enfield #5. I wouldn't carry a complete spare rifle, but a good parts kit would be nice. Trigger group, firing pin, firing pin extractor tool, spare bolt head, and an extra set of sights, front and rear.

Add a good cleaning kit and around 1600 rounds of .303 should do the trick, for a year's worth of hunting and practice.

 

[roscoe]

Wow - carrying 1600 rounds of .303 does not sound like fun to me! I do agree about the bolt action being the action of choice, but I would think that something lighter, like .223 would be the way to go. You can take a deer (at least some do, I hear) and anything smaller. I have no idea how many rounds I could carry, but I be it wouldn't be more than 400, with everything else needed to survive that far from civilization. I would also hope that 400 rounds would be more than enough for a year's hunting.

 

[DAL]

I'd have to agree with cratz2, at least as far as the simplicity aspect. You can't get much more simple than a single-shot rifle. One of those NEF rifles, or a TC Contender/Enforcer in .308 (I'd say .223 but for the stipulation that dangerous game might be encountered) would do the trick. The .22 is a great round, but against dangerous game...no way. (Yes, I've heard the stories of Alaskan Indians taking everything with .22 rifles, but count me out on that.)
DAL

 

[John G]

"Wow - carrying 1600 rounds of .303 does not sound like fun to me!"

Well, if this is for a year's time, who says you have to carry it on you the whole time? I'd set up camp for a few days, drop the ruck, then hunt and gather. Then, move on when I need to. Sort of like a patrol base.

If you plan to stay on the move for 365 days, with all your gear strapped on your back the whole time, more power to ya. Also, just because I'm in the woods, doesn't mean I don't want to still go plinking! I'm a shooter, dangit! I needs me some bullets

 

[roscoe]

I'd set up camp for a few days, drop the ruck, then hunt and gather.

Yeah, if I wasn't on the move the whole time, I'd do the same. But, if you do have to keep moving and weight is truly an issue, what about a lightweight lever action in something like .223? I think Browning makes one. At least with the lever gun you can have some capacity to fire quickly should you need defensive firepower.

 

[John G]

If I ever get a lever gun, you can bet it'll be a Browning. The action is smooth as glass, and well, it's a Browning!
I find bolt actions easier when shooting in the prone, but maybe that's just a personal thing. Plus, I'm familiar enough with the Enfield to operate it in most conditions, and perform any basic repairs.

 

[bbrins]

Just curious, why no spare parts? I mean if you know that you are going to be in the woods for a whole year and you are prepared enough to have other survival gear, a few extra parts don't weigh much.

Anyway, I would use something that I already have in the safe, my FR-8 (7.62x51) with about 200 rounds for the larger stuff and my KELTEC SUB 2000 (9mm) folded up somewhere inside my pack with a few hundered rounds for the smaller stuff. The second gun is nice for if the first one goes belly up, because Mr. Murphy is lurking behind every corner. And at least one good sharp knife in addition to all of the bedding and clothing, etc.

 

[Kaylee]

well, having just spent an afternoon looking at possible home sites in the Idaho backwoods, nearabouts losing my truck in the mud, eventually abandoning it, and stepping over moose and bear sign on my way hiking to the parcel... .. this strikes a chord today.

So... I'd say a bolt action repeater in a medium-large game caliber with a quick-detatch scope. Bolt action is simple and rugged enough to trust, I'm not as likely to break it (butterfingers me), and it's light enough to carry regularly. Backed up with a .22 pistol for treerats and such.. should be fine for a while.

All that said, I just had the .30-30 that always rides in my truck. Thankfully, I didn't meet anyone who thought I was tresspassin'. (the &#*@ realtor's directions sent me to the wrong &#*@ cabin!!)

Truth be told though, I REALLY don't like the "live out of your pack indefinately" idea... it's challenging enough out there with support and a real live shelter to work from. All romantic thoughts of "returning to nature" or "fighting the good fight" aside... an indefinate time solo in the backwoods with no support sounds, well..... Not a Fun Time. What's Really Cool on a camping trip is decidedly less so when you realize "this is a place where I'm not going home when I'm through having fun"

 

[Preacherman]

what you take is what you can carry including bedding, utensils, extra clothes, anything you can stuff in a backpack.

Well, that's a great limiting factor! If it's on your back, you want minima, not maxima!

Under the circumstances, I'd carry two rifles and a handgun. One rifle would be a Henry survival .22 semi-auto, broken down and stored in the stock, along with two or three hundred rounds of decent ammo. The other rifle would be either a .30-30 lever-action with 150 rounds, or a .45-70 lever-action with 100 rounds (ammo. quantity based on weight). The larger caliber would be needed if I were in an area where heavier game might be encountered (e.g. bear, moose, etc.); for elk and smaller game, the .30-30 would be more than enough. For a handgun, I'd have a shorter-barreled .44 Magnum revolver, with 50 to 100 rounds, being a mixture of defence loads (30 Cor-Bon 165gr. JHP .44 Specials), general-purpose loads (30 240gr. to 250gr. JHP's for hunting) and, if the game in the area warranted it, some heavy-duty defence loads (e.g. Garrett Hammerheads).

Putting this lot together, I'd already be talking about some 30 pounds in weight to carry around! That's too much for comfort, so I might have to sacrifice some of the ammo. load... On the other hand, given that everything else I need, like clothing, TP, initial food supplies, shelter, etc. would have to be either packed or pilfered, I've got a feeling that I might just have to take extra ammo. along in order to use it to get more stuff as time went on!

 

[roscoe]

Given that I can only carry 80 or so pounds comfortably for distance, I would actually be pretty interested to see someone's breakdown of their load. 60 pounds would be a lot nicer, now that I think of it.

I think that weather might be a major factor determining weight - down here in southern Arizona you can pack light on everything but water. But I still figure that too much weight in guns and ammo any you aren't going to be moving too much. I don't know how much ammo weighs, but you can have a perfectly effective rifle for around 7 pounds.

Maybe a 30-30 lever gun with some saboted loads for small game?

 

[John G]

Yeah, 80lbs is about right for my starting limit. Don't forget, a lot of the weight would be in lead, and that would disappear as time went on.

 

[Art Eatman]

As far as a gun, a lightweight .22 rifle would keep me going until I could make a bow and some arrows. (BTDT) A knife is a more important tool than any gun. Snares, deadfalls, and a knowledge of "growies" would keep me fed. About the heaviest thing I'd want in my pack would be a roll of mechanic's wire and a small pair of pliers.

If I'm s'posed to worry about grizzlies and suchlike, I'll emulate the earlier folks of the area: Discretion is the better part of valor. People? First, they gotta find me.

Art

 

[RCL]

I'm thinking something along the lines of a synthetic stock mountain rifle in .308 with peep sights, and a big bore Ruger Bisley revolver, probably in .44 Mag. I think I would try to find room for a Single Six .22 revolver also.

 

[ShaiVong]

A rem model 70 in .308, Glock 22 in 40 S&W.

Planning for a year, 5rds a week in .308 X 52 weeks=260 rounds.
Throw in 200rds of 40S&W for giggles.

A good knife, snare and fishing line. A pot. TP. lots of matches, and finally a 7-11.

 

[Soap]

Kimber .22 Hunter. And at least 3 TOP notch knives.

 

[DMK]

I'd probably take a polymer stocked, bolt action 22 magnum or .17 rimfire. It would be scoped, but backup iron sights would be a must. If you were shooting your own food, you probably would go for any large game because you couldn't eat that much before it went bad.

For self defense, I'd keep an N frame 357 or 44 magnum on the hip along with more than a couple speedloaders on the belt and a few extra boxes in the pack. Avoidance would certainly be the SOP.

 

[Iggy]

Ruger No3 in 223.

S&W Model 66 4" bbl.

 

[Dr.Rob]

Probably a shotgun, though SG ammo wieghs a great deal, it can handle all sorts of game. A good shotgunner's vest makes carrying easier.

When I venture out into the woods I'm usually carrying 24 rounds of pistol ammo and a dozen rounds of rifle ammo. Given this scenario, I'd leave the pistol ammo the same and up the rifle ammo to 100 rounds. I'd also want iron sights on my long gun (my current hunting rifle doesn't have those) in case my scope failed. As far as spare parts, if its by design you bet I'd have a spare firing pin and spring, as these usually go in my hunting pack anyway.

There are so few places left to explore for the average armchair commando, but there are plenty of people who have gone on year long walking tours (trans africa for instance) with no firearms. (not something I'd do)

As far as how much you can carry, I can assure you that for most 3-season north american backpacking 40 pounds is enough gear, 80 is asking for trouble. (unless that other 40 pounds is uncooked rice) Sure you'll end up washing the same clothes over and over, but if the kids on survivor can do it with a day pack for 40 days, you ought to be able to as well. As far as storing large game, making pemmican or biltong isn't that difficult, plan on packing a LOT of black pepper to keep the flies off your kill.

We always weighed our gear in ounces rather than pounds, you find very quickly that ounces add up.

You need some basic stuff, like a rainfly and groundcloth, though if you sleep in a hammock you can dispense with #2. You need a pot to cook in, you need a way to purify water. You need a way to carry water. You need raingear, because being wet for a long time can cause hypothermia. You need several changes of socks, cuz we all know dry socks are your best friend. You need some changes of clothes, and don't forget the ones you are already wearing. You need a sewing kit to repair the clothes you are wearing (nothing like losing the seat of your pants in the grand canyon to press this idea home). You need some spices because everything tastes better with a little pinch of home. You need batteries for things like flashlights and radios (or you could pack bay-gen free play radio with a light). You should use modern technology, because ther are things almost as good as wool and there are things better than cotton. Your sleeping bag should keep you warm even if its soaking wet, and thats why I'll never own a down bag. You need a toothbrush and a comb, because even Grizzly Adams had disdain for poor hygene. You need to learn to "tough it" without TP, and watch your diet... giardia can lead to dysentary in a hurry. And that will make you use all your TP at once. You need some tools, like a hatchet or shovel or cable saw because there are some jobs a knife can't do and digging a hole with your cooking pot is a lot tougher than it sounds. You need bug repellent.. (see giardia). You need some first aid stuff (asprin, gauze, etc) You need spare glasses, even if the prescription is old its better than no spares. You need matches, a lighter, calcium carbide and a metal match because fire is your friend and you need to be able to make it. You need a compass and a map or where you are going. You might need fishing line and wire for snares and , well fishing. You need to know whats edible and what's NOT where you are going (see giardia). You also need a positive attitude. Cuz being in the woods for a long time by yourself can make you a little crazy. You should take a friend if you can, makes hauling that rice easier.

 

[mummac]

I'm often criticized for this answer but I registered here just to say it again. My SHTF gun would be my mini-14 side folder. It's simple and easy to keep clean plus lightweight. .223 seems to me to be a good compromise between weight and power and is a common round so finding more would be more likely (I think). If I were in the the survival scenario and ran into others who make me choose my survival over theirs then i would prefer a semi-auto. I think I would be getting more food with a knife and fishing line than with the rifle. This is probably becasue I don't hunt and if I had to choose only one thing to do for the rest of my life it would be fishing.

amprecon, I have 2 Marlin 60s and wouldn't rely on them in any situation. I would rather have my mini than 20 Marlin 60s when my life or well being was on the line. This isn't to say that I don't love my Marlins.

My second choice would be a lever-action .357. Then I would bring my S&W 686 with me too and only need one type of ammo.

I wouldn't take more than a few hundred rounds either. I mean barring any major gun battles, I can't see needing more than one round per day. Would you be shooting every day? I'm thinking at the most I would be taking two game animals (pig or deer) a week. I live in Florida though so our deer are dog sized. Anyway just my two cents.

 

[MacPelto]

Savage 24 chambered .22 on top, 12ga on bottom, but with a ghost ring sight. .22 for small game, and a mix of buck, slug, and birdshot for everything else. And maybe a ruger speed six in 357, just because I like to have a pistol on me

 

[RustyHammer]

you will be in a vast wilderness hundreds of miles from any civilization

Is there such a place anymore? (Alaska, I suppose.)

I'm thinking something like a Marlin .357 Mag lever gun w/ matching revolver. Packing both .357, .38 and maybe even some of that "bird shot" (never tried it though) along for the trip.

A shot gun with various types of shells (including slugs) might not be a bad choice either.

YMMV

 

[mrming]

SAR-1

marlin in 17hmr.


former provides for most security needs + larger game when required.

latter is lightweight ammo for daily food supply.


Snares, parachute chord, knives etc are probably of more use long term. Also, as bizzare as it may sound I'd have to suggest a pole arm of some sort. A piece of sharp, shiney steel on a 6' rod may sound a little arcane; but it'll save ammo dispatching anything wounded and too dangerious to approach, defense against many predators and will be around long after the firearms become heavy-duty tent stakes.