kwelz
Member
Army doesn't teach this anymore. If you are closing one eye you are not seeing your environment and that is a good way to end up dead.
Both eyes open
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Army doesn't teach this anymore. If you are closing one eye you are not seeing your environment and that is a good way to end up dead.
todayzprophet
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Army doesn't teach this anymore? Funny...I just spent my entire summer at Fort Jackson, SC and most of the fall in Fort Huachuca, AZ. Yes, that's what we are taught. I may not be an expert but I am a marksman. Most people cannot focus on a target with both eyes open. It is usually best for most people to find their dominant eye and close the other. However, as I stated, people should do what produces the best results for them. For me, I will continue to close my left eye due to being right eye dominant. Also, I am sure no one is actually running around like Popeye with one eye closed. You would only close one eye to take a targeted shot, not when someone is in your face or you are moving around. Common sense must always be applied. Again, people should do what gives them the best results on their target. Period.
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kwelz
Member
Interesting. Lots of friends of mine are currently in the service and not a single one was taught to shoot with one eye closed. Marksmanship is different of course. That is a completely different type of shooting.
todayzprophet
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You're correct, Taliv. Focus on that front sight and ensure it is on target. Center mass at 100 meters. However, I believe the question of the thread is to what technique do different people employ while focusing on that front sight. Do they fire with both eyes open or one eye closed? Of course, I've already stated my viewpoint so I will leave it at that.
I had the same problem when I started keeping both of my eyes open a few years ago. I tried focusing on the front sight so much after I fired a couple rounds I started to see doubles.
I then started to focus more on my target while still being aware of exactly where my front sight was. Now I am focused on the target, draw and get a good/quick front sight aquisition, press the trigger, through the recoil I am still focused on the target, the front sight snaps right back down on the target, and I fire again. The more I practiced the faster I got and was able to know exactly where my front sight was while still focusing on the target. The closer I get to the target I tend to natural increase my rate of fire. As I back away from the target I naturally slow down my rate of fire as well as naturally close my non dominant eye depending on what kind of distances I have backed up to.
I then started to focus more on my target while still being aware of exactly where my front sight was. Now I am focused on the target, draw and get a good/quick front sight aquisition, press the trigger, through the recoil I am still focused on the target, the front sight snaps right back down on the target, and I fire again. The more I practiced the faster I got and was able to know exactly where my front sight was while still focusing on the target. The closer I get to the target I tend to natural increase my rate of fire. As I back away from the target I naturally slow down my rate of fire as well as naturally close my non dominant eye depending on what kind of distances I have backed up to.
Sauer Grapes
Member
I try to shoot with both eyes open. Depends on what my eyes feel like on any given day......
First thing to get out of the way: I shoot a handgun with both eyes open and I don't ascribe to the "front sight focus" method.
Here is a visual description of what you see with both eyes open, looking at the target vs. looking at the front sight:
The picture on the left shows what you do when you bowl, pitch a baseball, shoot a shotgun, shoot a rifle with a red dot, and is what you've been doing with your pointer finger since you could crawl. It's totally natural and it's what will happen, whether you want it to or not, in a SD situation, so don't fight nature, learn to use it.
Perhaps you've seen the optical illusion where you hold a paper towel tube up to one eye and your hand next to it while focusing on the wall on the other side of the room? Your brains will see an image of your hand with a hole in the middle.
It happens in reverse when you shoot pistol with a target focus - you see a ghost image of the front sight on the center of the target -- just like pointing your finger at an object across the room.
Your brain automatically knows which of the "two" front sights to line up with the target, you've been doing it since you were a baby... but just in case you have to analyze it... if you are right eye dominant the front sight on the left is the one that should line up with the center of the target. IOW the target, front sight and dominant eye are all in a line and the non-dominant eye will produce a second image which the brain (my brain anyway) ignores... hence the notion of a dominant eye.
By the way, I am left handed and right eye dominant and I shoot right handed - I've always done it, and nobody had to tell me to do it that way.
Here is a visual description of what you see with both eyes open, looking at the target vs. looking at the front sight:
The picture on the left shows what you do when you bowl, pitch a baseball, shoot a shotgun, shoot a rifle with a red dot, and is what you've been doing with your pointer finger since you could crawl. It's totally natural and it's what will happen, whether you want it to or not, in a SD situation, so don't fight nature, learn to use it.
Perhaps you've seen the optical illusion where you hold a paper towel tube up to one eye and your hand next to it while focusing on the wall on the other side of the room? Your brains will see an image of your hand with a hole in the middle.
It happens in reverse when you shoot pistol with a target focus - you see a ghost image of the front sight on the center of the target -- just like pointing your finger at an object across the room.
Your brain automatically knows which of the "two" front sights to line up with the target, you've been doing it since you were a baby... but just in case you have to analyze it... if you are right eye dominant the front sight on the left is the one that should line up with the center of the target. IOW the target, front sight and dominant eye are all in a line and the non-dominant eye will produce a second image which the brain (my brain anyway) ignores... hence the notion of a dominant eye.
By the way, I am left handed and right eye dominant and I shoot right handed - I've always done it, and nobody had to tell me to do it that way.
which eye?
i actually shoot more accurately 3-7 yds focusing on the TARGET with both eyes open. i practice with my laser and am almost always dead on. this seems to go against everything i read about target shooting. any ideas or is it just "do what works for you"? i've always heard focus on the front sight is right...
i actually shoot more accurately 3-7 yds focusing on the TARGET with both eyes open. i practice with my laser and am almost always dead on. this seems to go against everything i read about target shooting. any ideas or is it just "do what works for you"? i've always heard focus on the front sight is right...
jcwit
member
Some of the targets I shoot at aren't there any more at a 100 yds when I focus on the front sight.
brandon_mcg
Member
there is no way that i could shoot with both eyes open....
NMGonzo
Member
For self defense practice I just bring the gun up and I hit what needs to be hit at 10 yards.
Took a while but I got to that point.
Both eyes open, double action.
Just like playing tennis, man.
Took a while but I got to that point.
Both eyes open, double action.
Just like playing tennis, man.
Floppy_D
Member In Memoriam
Interesting. I'm right-handed/left-eyed, and I always close my right eye. I had a right eye injury when I was sixteen (I couldn't use it for a week, and it was impaired for several weeks/months afterwards) and have astygmatism in the same eye, and have a very dominant left eye. I close my right eye, and manage to shoot expert rifle/pistol to USN standards.Lee Lapin said:
The ONLY time I shoot with both eyes open is with a shotgun, and I never noticed that until Mr. Lapin pointed that out. Huh.
Bulldawg55
Member
For self defence ranges, get a laser. You could use your left eye, right eye or both and you'll know right where the bullet is going!
NavyLCDR
member
I am left eye dominant, right handed. I don't see the need, when shooting handguns, to switch my shooting hand. I just use my left eye to aim with and keep my right eye open.
You might want to try shooting lined up directly in front of your left eye, and then lined up directly in front of your right eye and see if one or the other doesn't work for you. You non-aiming eye should really just be for peripheral vision anyway.
When I shoot rifle, I have to close my left eye and use my right eye.
I'm getting lasik done in three weeks. I can't wait to see what a curve ball that throws at everything!
You might want to try shooting lined up directly in front of your left eye, and then lined up directly in front of your right eye and see if one or the other doesn't work for you. You non-aiming eye should really just be for peripheral vision anyway.
When I shoot rifle, I have to close my left eye and use my right eye.
I'm getting lasik done in three weeks. I can't wait to see what a curve ball that throws at everything!
benEzra
Moderator Emeritus
I have the same problem; I don't really have a dominant eye (years ago I was very mildly cross-dominant but now both eyes are equal). If I try the "look at an object across the room and make a circle around it with your fingers" test, I get different results if I do it multiple times. So, I just shoot right-eyed since I am right handed.
I shot for years closing the left eye, then was able to shift to just squinting it a little, and now can shoot both-eyes open. With handguns, I do find it easier to do when shooting from an isosceles stance rather than a Weaver stance, for some reason. With rifles, get a red dot and you can shoot both-eyes-open with either eye regardless of eye dominance.
I shot for years closing the left eye, then was able to shift to just squinting it a little, and now can shoot both-eyes open. With handguns, I do find it easier to do when shooting from an isosceles stance rather than a Weaver stance, for some reason. With rifles, get a red dot and you can shoot both-eyes-open with either eye regardless of eye dominance.
Hmmm ... you're going to have tunnel vision anyway, so go ahead and close one eye. Sure, let's exacerbate what is already a limiting factor in high-stress situations.
Natural instinct is to close one eye. Tell that to someone who's never fired a weapon before and has never received any instruction on doing so.
I'm not here to force anyone to shoot one way or the other, but those two statements made my eyes bug out (both of them - I didn't naturally close one and allow only the other one to bug out)!
Seriously, if you want to learn to shoot with both eyes open, start close to your target - maybe a couple yards - focus on your front sight and increase the speed and distance as you get better. I shoot much more accurately at common self-defense distances with both eyes open.
If you don't want to learn to shoot with both eyes open ... don't.
Natural instinct is to close one eye. Tell that to someone who's never fired a weapon before and has never received any instruction on doing so.
I'm not here to force anyone to shoot one way or the other, but those two statements made my eyes bug out (both of them - I didn't naturally close one and allow only the other one to bug out)!
Seriously, if you want to learn to shoot with both eyes open, start close to your target - maybe a couple yards - focus on your front sight and increase the speed and distance as you get better. I shoot much more accurately at common self-defense distances with both eyes open.
If you don't want to learn to shoot with both eyes open ... don't.
KBintheSLC
Member
Learning to shoot with both eyes open is a bit challenging at first, but it becomes very fast and very natural with some training. I have been using this method for several years now with pistol, rifle and shotgun. It allows a for a heightened sense of visual awareness compared to the one eye method. http://brasstard.com/2009/12/29/pistol-sighting-201-point-shooting/
The one eye, front sight focus is still useful for long-range precision work, but I am convinced that using both eyes, and focusing on the target is superior for CQC.
The one eye, front sight focus is still useful for long-range precision work, but I am convinced that using both eyes, and focusing on the target is superior for CQC.
ny32182
Member
I'm left handed, and can't determine an eye dominance using the at-home tests.
To me, shooting one eye closed is natural; I should know because I've never had any formal training, and that is what feels most natural to me in almost all circumstances (rifle with a red dot being the exception). And it is what I did for years.
For pistol, I started trying to do some "both eyes open" shooting over the summer. I shoot IDPA. At this point it has become a balancing act between speed of sight acquisition and speed of (especially longer) target transitions.
With both eyes open I can often see peripheral targets sooner depending on their placement, but don't pick up the sights as well due to the "two guns" out front, and vice versa; sight acquisition is quicker with one eye closed. So what I do now is kind of a happy medium; I do a slight squint with my off-side eye that ghosts the "extra" gun enough so I don't pay attention to it, yet lets me still see targets to the right if I'm slicing the pie left to right. If I'm five yards or closer I will pretty much focus on the target. Even 7 yards on out, I find myself focusing on the front sight.
Rifle with a red dot feels great both eyes open to me, and the reason is that the dot is in enough of a tube that my weak side eye can't see it. Thus I only get one dot instead of two, and can also focus on the target.
To me, shooting one eye closed is natural; I should know because I've never had any formal training, and that is what feels most natural to me in almost all circumstances (rifle with a red dot being the exception). And it is what I did for years.
For pistol, I started trying to do some "both eyes open" shooting over the summer. I shoot IDPA. At this point it has become a balancing act between speed of sight acquisition and speed of (especially longer) target transitions.
With both eyes open I can often see peripheral targets sooner depending on their placement, but don't pick up the sights as well due to the "two guns" out front, and vice versa; sight acquisition is quicker with one eye closed. So what I do now is kind of a happy medium; I do a slight squint with my off-side eye that ghosts the "extra" gun enough so I don't pay attention to it, yet lets me still see targets to the right if I'm slicing the pie left to right. If I'm five yards or closer I will pretty much focus on the target. Even 7 yards on out, I find myself focusing on the front sight.
Rifle with a red dot feels great both eyes open to me, and the reason is that the dot is in enough of a tube that my weak side eye can't see it. Thus I only get one dot instead of two, and can also focus on the target.
Sheepdog1968
Member
Funny you should mention that, I did some clay sport shooting last week and yes, trying with one eye was problematic since it was harder to pick up on the moving target. For self-defense and shotgun, rifle, pistol use one eye works. If I were to get serious about clays (or bird hunting) I'd have to explore it a bit more.
BLACKHAWKNJ
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IMHO there is no "One Size Fits All" technique. I personally did not become a
good pistol shot until I started practicing Bullseye, part of proper technique is closing the non shooting eye in a relaxed manner so you don't strain yourself. In BCT in 1967 it was close the non shooting eye, concentrate on the sights, in Vietnam it was point and spray due to the thick foliage and shadows it created, I suspect it's the same today for troops operating in urban environments where close ranges make quick reaction even more critical.
good pistol shot until I started practicing Bullseye, part of proper technique is closing the non shooting eye in a relaxed manner so you don't strain yourself. In BCT in 1967 it was close the non shooting eye, concentrate on the sights, in Vietnam it was point and spray due to the thick foliage and shadows it created, I suspect it's the same today for troops operating in urban environments where close ranges make quick reaction even more critical.
BLACKHAWKNJ, I suspect you're onto something. If you're shooting stationary targets while standing still, one-eyed shooting probably works well. I haven't done much of that since I owned a pistol with a scope.
If you're shooting IDPA or USPSA or any other practical pistol shooting, I can't see how closing one eye can help you.
In my Army training, the instructors berated you and punished you for closing an eye to shoot. (You want to sleep? Get down in the front leaning rest and close your eyes!) We learned two COM, one to the head with both eyes open. Then again, this wasn't marksman or basic training.
If you're shooting IDPA or USPSA or any other practical pistol shooting, I can't see how closing one eye can help you.
In my Army training, the instructors berated you and punished you for closing an eye to shoot. (You want to sleep? Get down in the front leaning rest and close your eyes!) We learned two COM, one to the head with both eyes open. Then again, this wasn't marksman or basic training.
In MY case, it all depends upon what I'm shooting and why. I have astigmatic vision in both eyes, I see clearly at reading-a-book distance but at across-the-room distance I can't tell Adam from Eve without my glasses. When I target shoot or practice SD drills with a handgun, I do MUCH better with both eyes open and point shooting at 7-15yds. If I'm practicing with / sighting in a hunting handgun or longarm, I always fire right-handed/right-eyed (wearing my spectacles!)
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