.455_Hunter
Member
I have shot quite a few Trapdoors and have never seen brass like that. I would have a detailed look at the chamber and probably do a chamber cast to assess.
Can straight - walled trapdoor rifle cases be "Fireformed" and "Neck Resized" in the same way one does bolt gun bottlenecked cases?
Howdy
First off, 45-70 brass is not truly 'straight walled'. There is an ever so slight taper from front to back, that's why there are no carbide dies available for 45-70.
Here is the official SAAMI drawing of the 45-70 cartridge and chamber.
View attachment 1010415
Yes, that bulge can probably be ironed out when resizing your brass, but be sure to use plenty of case lube. I use Winchester brass for all my 45-70 loads. A bunch of years ago I had some Federal 45-70 brass and no matter how hard I tried I could not get that stuff through my RCBS 45-70 sizing die. No matter how much case lube I put on it. I have not tried Starline 45-70 brass, but I have shot tons of their 45 Colt, 45 Schofield, 44 Russian, 44-40 and 38-40 brass and I have no doubt their 45-70 brass would be top notch.
bear166: Not that it really matters but I don't believe you mentioned the bullet weight you are using.
Here is one of my 45-70 rounds on the right, with one of the original copper cased, Benet Primed rounds that were so prone to problems with the early Trapdoors. The soft copper cases expanded in the chamber and got stuck. The extractor tended to rip right through the soft rim. Modern cartridge brass is 70% copper and 30% zinc. When fired it expands to fill the chamber, but it has enough 'memory' to shrink back slightly in size so it does not become stuck in the chamber.
View attachment 1010416
The big bullet 2nd from the right is the 405 grain bullet I use with my 45-70 reloads.
View attachment 1010417
I don't have my reloading notebook handy, but I seem to recall I am putting about 70 grains of Schuetzen FFg into my Winchester brass. I trickle it into the cases with a 24" drop tube, then I use a compression die to compress the powder I don't recall exactly how much. Then a thin card wad, then I seat the bullet. Yes, I do put a bit of a crimp on my 45-70 rounds, but not a whole lot.
I seem to recall my Trapdoor was made in 1875, but I can't swear to that right now.
View attachment 1010418
Anyway, I suspect at some point your chamber was bulged slightly, perhaps by somebody putting a Smokeless load through it. All the other answers are correct, you could take a chamber casting, but with a bulge like that you might have just as much trouble removing the casting as you do removing your bulged brass. You could take it to a Trapdoor expert, but I suspect the only real solution would be to have the chamber machined out and a new one sleeved in, or perhaps bore out the entire barrel and have a new sleeve installed. I suspect the cost would be prohibitive.
I do suggest you limit shooting your Trap Door with Black Powder loads. I don't know how old your Trapdoor is, but if it is an old one with a slightly bulged chamber I would not put any Smokeless loads through it.
I'm thinking an original machining goof. Back in the day, people were not usually shooting reloads, and the military certainly wasn't issuing reloads. Perhaps when it was new, it didn't have an ejection problem. ? So she flew under the radar for 100 years or so.
I don't think the loads have much to do with it. My rifle fires 80 grains of Swiss under a 400 grain bullet, with no issues. I'm glad you don't shoot smokeless though. Intelligent!! As far as a smokeless load bulging the chamber, I think other parts of the action would have failed before the chamber would bulge.
I think re-lining the barrel would be "worth it". At the least a noble cause to preserve the rifle, and worth it in the long run. I wonder if it couldn't be bored, rifled, and rechambered, or re-lined to 50-70 or 50-90? That would be cool. Also, if one is starting from scratch with a re-lined barrel and chamber, I've always thought a Trapdoor would be cool in .45-90. I'd load it with 80 grains, and have room for a big old 500 grain bullet. !!! But I hunt in Grizz country, so I'm weird that way.
Good luck and I hope you keep the old girl shooting. Not too long ago, I was shopping for a Trapdoor barrel, and there seem to be plenty around for around one hundred bucks or so. That might be less expensive than a re-line. If you spent $100 on a new barrel, and another $100 for the gunsmith to screw it on, that's way cheaper than another rifle.
The Springfield Single Shot Rifle was manufactured on the best equipment available at that time. The bores were well rifled. There were no “inconsistencies” in the pieces. The chambers were reamed, just as they are today. If yours is bulged, it happened after it left the factory.
You mention that the extractor does remove the fired case. Either you have a faulty extractor or the bulge is preventing it from working properly. My guess, the latter situation. How it happened? Who knows but I would guess a too hot reload with smokeless.
Can it be repaired? How much are you willing to spend.
Kevin
Thanks. Well, the 50-90 conversion is just kind of a personal fantasy of mine. Keeping it .45-70 certainly makes more sense. When I got my first Trapdoor, (I have a massive collection of two) I was set on a 50-70, but good examples were just a hair over what I wanted to spend.
Anyhow, what a mystery. Not just a slight bulge, but a big bulge. When it's all said and done, we'll refer to this project as the battle of the bulge.
MidwayUSA had chamber casting alloy on sale last week. Still might be?For a minimal outlay of probably $15-$20 you can buy a chamber casting alloy and do a chamber casting yourself. At least at that point you'll have an idea of what you have and an idea of what to do going forward, if anything.
But...but...I think the fired case shows/illustrates the problem What difference would a chamber cast make? It would look like the fired case.?? Asking for a friend.
For a minimal outlay of probably $15-$20 you can buy a chamber casting alloy and do a chamber casting yourself. At least at that point you'll have an idea of what you have and an idea of what to do going forward, if anything.