Bullet Porn? (Naked AP Pics)

[SDC]

Ed, I do these all with hand tools (Dremel to start, but I finish everything flat with files). I usually slit the neck of the case so I can pull the bullet, dump the powder, then kill the primers with WD-40. I slit the cases down to the head with the Dremel, then go through the head with a hacksaw, then finish half the case flat with a file. For a bullet with a core that my files won't cut, I have to slit the bullet all the way around with a piece of fine-tooth hacksaw blade, then lift the core out and file everything flat again, then reassemble it.
The cores on the .30 M2 measure .242, and .422 on the .50 M2.
Here's a closer shot of the .30 M2 against a piece of 3/4" mild steel that I shot through with one; the lead "point filler" at the nose of the core is supposed to help the core "plant" against a hard surface while it's penetrating, so it supports it for a fraction of a second until the core starts to pierce; they used to use the same technique for anti-tank artillery rounds up to WW2, but shaped-charges made it obsolete for artillery.

 

[cpileri]

curious

Thanks for the measurements and one question: how in the world did you safely dremel a API round without igniting the incendiary compound?!?!

C-

 

[SDC]

MOST incendiaries have a fairly inert filler that requires a lot of pressure and/or heat to ignite, so to be on the safe side, I use a piece of fine-tooth hacksaw blade (as above); for rounds with a WP filling (like the blue-tip Italian API), I have to do them completely underwater, to avoid self-ignition when the air hits the phosphorous.

 

[cpileri]

gutsy

Underwater: there's a good idea.
A fair amount of pressure or heat, huh? i wonder if anyone has looked into how much: that is, if one downloaded 50bmg, what is the lowest velocity at which the 'I' compound would ignite??????
Hmmm....
Or maybe downloaded with the tip of the jacket scored (weakened) in a cross patern to facilitate flattening on impact???
That might be neat to find out just for chagrins.
C-

 

[artherd]

SDC- you have bigger balls than I. Infact, they may be made of Tungsten

So, can anyone state with authority whether my M2Ap .30-06 ammo is Tungsten or Steel cored? The headstamp reads only:

"43 TW"

 

[SDC]

Artherd, the "bible" on US military ammo is Hackley, Woodin, & Scranton's "History of US Military Small Arms Ammunition"; they state that up until 1942, the cores in .30 M2 loads were 4% tungsten, but were then changed to a manganese-molybdenum alloy (presumably because the tungsten could better be used in machining tools for the war effort). Your rounds were loaded at the Twin Cities Arsenal (Minneapolis) in 1943, so they presumably have the manganese-moly cores.
PS. I really enjoy my hobby, but I hope no-one takes it as a green light to start cutting open old ammo; I wouldn't want to feel responsible if someone was to lose an eye or finger

 

[Third_Rail]

I still say that the cores in my AP ammo are almost pure tungsten. We're talking 90% or more.... which doesn't work out with what you just said. I wonder where the hell mine came from, then?

 

[Suomipoika]

Anyone got photos from API hits?

 

[Oleg Volk]

While on this topic: http://www.olegvolk.net/gallery/album19/golddot40sw?full=1

Fully mushroomed .40SW bullet - big file.

 

[Suomipoika]

While on this topic: http://www.olegvolk.net/gallery/alb...ddot40sw?full=1

Nice pics . Shot api-pics, anyone?

 

[artherd]

I have shot some unknown 1/2" plate with a factory Barnes XLC load, went clean through and looked like an AP core (clean .30cal hole, no mushrooming or splatter.) Federal factory XLC .30-06 180 grain load.

I need to discover some .338 LM AP. The Barnes .338 may be as close as I get.

 

[clubsoda22]

ban on steel core 7.62x39 is kind of a moot point...i don't think regular FMJ ammo in that caliber would have any problem slicing through 3A kevlar.

Gotta tell my buddy about the available .30 AP bullets...he's building a savage in .300 WUM and is the kind of crazy mother who would reload that stuff.

 

[Edward429451]

I managed to get a core out undamaged. I dremeled off the bottom and the core 'cap' came out. Couple'a twists with some pliers and out she came. Seems to be capped for & aft. Dunno why.

It did stick to a magnet. I presume this means steel core but I don't know if tungsten is attracted to a magnet, or the magenese ones. Anyone know?

 

[Third_Rail]

Nope, tungsten and manganese aren't magnetic.

 

[SDC]

The elements Tungsten and Manganese aren't magnetic themselves, but when alloyed with steel (as in the .30 M2 cores), they should still stick to a magnet.

 

[J-Man]

Check out:

http://www.argospress.com/jbt/Volume3/3-3-2.pdf

 

[Third_Rail]

That's because the magnet is sticking to the iron, not the other elements. They're just along for the ride!

 

[Sam Adams]

Any recipes for reloading the .30 cal. AP into .30-06 or .308?

 

[The Grand Inquisitor]

Is it just me or is Olympic Arms very often connected with assinine and moronic moves that do more to hurt firearms enthusists than to benefit them.

 

[Master Blaster]

The problem is not the arms manufacturers (even Olympic) but the Government.

 

[Edward429451]

Any recipes for reloading the .30 cal. AP into .30-06 or .308?

Just use recipes for that bullet weight range out of the book. Since they're 163gr, you could use data for a 165gr bullet. Technicallyu speaking, you should use 7.62 brass rather than .308 Win because I've heard that since some .308's have been chambered in pistols, and you can't have AP pistol ammo, that the BATman could get a hard on for you if you do. I've never heard of a pistol chambered in 7.62 X 51

Stay a full two grains below max when using .308 data in a 7.62 case because the brass is thicker and pressure curve is different.

Try IMR 4895 to start. 43.0gr is a starting load/46.5 would be a max load.

 

[Sam Adams]

Thanks, Edward.

 

[uglygun]

Take care with the 163s though....

They have much more bearing surface coming into contact with the rifling so pressure signs could start pretty soon.

Here's a picture of a 163grn AP bullet in line with an older 168grn Amax and a 180grn Sierra Match King. The 180grn Sierra MK doesn't even have as much bearing surface as the 163grn bullet.


It's the volume of the 163grn bullet in comparison to a 180grn lead bullet that makes me question the alloy of the 163grn bullet's penetrator. If it were pure tungsten it is likely that we'd see a much more compact bullet thanks to tungsten having a density higher than that of lead. And certainly the bullet wouldn't be larger in volume than a 180grn lead bullet....