Can cops pull up # o/ guns you own?

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BamBam-31

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I was in Turner's Outdoorsman in Pasadena the other day, and the salesman behind the counter was saying that when cops pull you over for a traffic stop, they can run your DL and find out how many guns you own.

"No way. They can't do that," I sez.

"Legally, they can't. But technically, they do," he sez, chuckling.

:confused:

Okay, I know that 4473's can be abused (like in the DC "sniper" case), but is there an actual list of firearms registered to my DL? This guy made it sound like a dirty little cop secret, but I think he's just misinformed. Or maybe I am. Which is it?
 
The only way i know, that cops can pull up your guns is if you have ever pawned one. but, you do not own it, because you pawned it.
 
In California, your carry permits require you to list the guns you're going to carry, right? So maybe he means the ones on your carry permit?
 
Nah, he meant ALL guns owned, not CCW guns. The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced this guy was full if it.
 
Well, it depends on the state. States that require registration or permits could do it very easily and probably do. As for the rest of them, officially they do not do this but in theory they could- the law says that dealers have to retain their 4473s which are subject to inspection or collection at any time, and the only thing keeping the ATF from forming a database using these is their assurance that they will not. And if they started collecting forms from dealers regularly, word would get out.

So i guess what i'm saying is that it's possible that they could do this, but if they could you'd probably know it or it would be a VERY well kept secret.
 
I am pretty sure they don't know for a couple of reasons. One, some pro-gun cop or a hundred of them would tell us about it. Two, in the PRK it doesn't even say if you have a CCW. I know this because I know a PD dispatcher and I just asked her about the CCW coming up. She said it doesn't. So if the PRK isn't keeping track of CCW holders I doubt they are keeping track of your firearms. Especially if the only person that technically knows what you have is your FFL with the 4473. Sure handguns have a serial number put down in the database, but not long guns.

I think the dude was full of crap.
 
This could happen in states where you must have a permit to own a gun. But in Texas this would be pretty much impossible. Just about all my guns were bought through private sells anyway. Unless they have placed hidden cameras in my house, they don't have a clue what I have.
 
The answer is YES they can.

Will any LE here will admit that fact?

I was handed a printout by LE, with my name on it, listing most of my guns.
It would have had them all except that the query return was set at 25.

I do not have a Ca CCW, I have never "registered" a gun.

Flame away, but I have seen it with my own 20/20 eyes.

P.S. I will not reveal the source except to say that it came from an ordinary, everyday, LE type.

edit to add: The only possible explanation I can see is that the 4473's are databased somewhere.
 
The answer is YES they can.
Click to expand...

The answer is "It would be pure-t impossible in most states, which have no gun registration."

I don't even know the exact number of guns I own off the top of my head, and I'd be willing to bet my next paycheck that the TN heat is even more clueless about the total than I am. :scrutiny:
 
Psssniper,
To your knowledge, have you been the subject of any criminal investigations?

As Tam said, that'd be awful difficult in most free states. I'm sure the Feds could eventually piece together the firearms I've bought from licensed dealers, but something makes me doubt that it's as simple for police to obtain as SELECT TOP 25 * FROM tblGuns WHERE Owner='Psssniper'; However, if you had been the subject of an in-depth criminal investigation, and if you've always purchased from dealers, I can see how it might be possible that a few agents were able to track down a decent list of most of your firearms.
 
During at least one period here in TN, the TBI could pull up every gun you had obtained through an FFL, via the background check. How do I know? When my FFL ran a check, the person doing it started listing everything I'd bought through the FFL for the last few years. Apparently, she was just absentmindedly running through the records on her screen.
 
Simply not possible here.

Even if the Federales went to every store I ever bought a gun from and copied the 4473 in the database...they don't have a clue about the guns I've bought from private individuals, inherited, been given as gifts, etc.

Of course, several of the local SO and HP have seen most of my guns anyway. :D

Smoke
 
Exactly...I sold a coworker a G26 yesterday. You think the federales have a clue, or even care?

Hey Smoke...I seem to remember that you have an 870 with leather shell holder. Where'd you get that thing?
 
$tinfoilhat->("on");

If I was designing a database for NICS system, I'd have a set of columns with things like name, address, ssn, and then several flags to say various reasons that you could be denied -- for instance, a felony conviction flag, a domestic violence flag, etc. Of course, it would probably have to be normalized a bit, and such, but that's minor.

If I were a bit more paranoid or concerned about keeping an eye on the number of guns out there, I'd have another column that would be 'number of checks' and would be incremented each time an FFL calls up to check, so more or less each time you buy a gun from a dealer.

Of course, even if that weren't allowed, I'd also have logging of each check, at least for a while, to make sure it was working right -- and those logs could be parsed and tabulated fairly easily.

$tinfoilhat->("off");

I'd imagine it's likely that *someone* knows how many guns I've bought from dealers, since the NICS system has been in use(I didn't buy any before that, though.) Since I'm in Michigan, I have to register handguns with the police, oh, I'm sorry, Safety Check. Given that, I assume that the police anywhere in the state can see just how many handguns I have, and I would assume that someone in the NICS system -- probably a database administrator or some such, could see how many times a NICS check has been run.

*Supposedly*, they should not be able to see which longguns I have (or really, which handguns, although the MI police could), unless the FFL that I bought them from has lost his license/gone out of business/whatever. At least, that's how I understand it.
 
buzz_knox,

During at least one period here in TN, the TBI could pull up every gun you had obtained through an FFL, via the background check. How do I know? When my FFL ran a check, the person doing it started listing everything I'd bought through the FFL for the last few years. Apparently, she was just absentmindedly running through the records on her screen.
Click to expand...

Did that happen at Guncraft?

If so, are you sure it wasn't the computerized Point-Of-Sale computer system they use? AFAIK, the NICS/TICS check machines don't spit out anything on the little display.

Check with Marko, Craig's uses one of the machines. We're too cheap to get one; we just use the old-fashioned tepholone. ;)

We couldn't tell you what you bought in the past week without rummaging through filing cabinets and various in-boxes. :D
 
Did that happen at Guncraft?
Click to expand...

Nope. The FFL I use for transfers doesn't have a shop or computer records. But he recalled what I had bought and it matched what he was told over the phone by the TBI folks.
 
In California, I know they can. We were burglarized a couple of years ago, and the thieves made off with my P228 and HP22. I don't recall how the subject came up, but the officer taking the report had access to that information over the radio.
 
BamBam-31,

Pasadena is my home town. I lived in Pasadena CA for most of my life until I got out a couple of years ago. I have dealt with Turners there on Arroyo Parkway and have bought more than one gun from them. I found that most of the sales persons there don't have a clue. They do run good sales from time to time and that is the only reason to go there.

I got pulled over alot by the "police" if that's what they call themselves, (I prefer other names), and I had a number of guns and never was asked about them. I have some stories about the Sherriff's Dept that are very disturbing. That dept. should cease to exist if they persist in hiring only Nazi SOB's.

Know what you are buying before you go to Turners. The salespersons will not be able to help or explain 99% of any of your questions. They probably get paid doodily so what can you expect.

BTW, was it a big fat guy with gray hair who told you that?

Russ
 
heehee...

You're absolutely naive if you think every weapon that you had to fill out a form for is not in a database and as easily extractable as popping in your Drivers lic/SS #s...that's just the way it is. Whether it pops up on a traffic stop, I don't know....the rest is a fact...doesn't matter if you bought it at Sears or at the local shop down the way. Where do you think all those records went to? The dumpster out back?

ban.gif



lol...too funny...
 
Russ,

Nah, haven't seen that guy around for a while now. If you've visited lately, most of their employees are new. I think it has to do with their recent burglary. It was done w/ enough precision that I think Turner's suspects an inside job. Hence the new faces.

Same story about not knowing anything about anything, however. I just nod my head and say, "Oh, really?" to all the misinformation.
 
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