can U do this??

Discussion in 'Blackpowder' started by khegglie, Jul 4, 2011.

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  1. khegglie

    khegglie Member

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    Can you shoot round ball over Pyrodex pellets in a 1:28 twist in line rifle?? Dont expect any particular accuracy, just wondering if it's possible.
     
  2. arcticap

    arcticap Member

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    It sure is possible. But the higher the velocity the worse the accuracy.
    Stick with light loads and they may shoot fairly well out to 50 yards.
    Hornady makes "Hard Balls" which are special sabots fitted with round balls.

    http://www.hornady.com/store/50-Cal-.485-Hard-Ball-System-20-Per-Pkg/

    I've never heard how well they shoot from an inline rifle but maybe they shoot well.
    I suppose that it's also possible to shoot regular sabots fitted with a round ball if the ball is the proper size.
    For instance there are .451 revolver balls and .50 sabots that are made to fit bullets of that same size.
     
  3. khegglie

    khegglie Member

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    thanks ARCTICAP.
    Any issues with Pyrodex 50/50 pellets vs powder with a round ball?
    The sabot balls sound interesting.
     
  4. arcticap

    arcticap Member

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    It's safe to load a patched ball with a pellet as long as the ball is seated in contact with the pellet.
    Even though the pellet is flat and the base of the round ball isn't, that miniscule amount of air space isn't significant enough to cause any concern.
    However some folks do prefer to routinely to use a filler like Cream of Wheat, grits or corn meal over the powder to cushion the round ball which can produce better accuracy even if loading with loose powder. The filler would also take up any empty space even though that's not the primary reason for using it.
    A pellet also doesn't allow for adjusting the powder charge like loose powder would. And with consistent compression, loose powder can burn more consistently than the pellet which also helps to produce better accuracy.
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2011
  5. khegglie

    khegglie Member

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    THANKS, will try 50-80 grain equivalent loads.
     
  6. Pancho

    Pancho Member

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    The only downside to pellets is that I've found that the best load for a given gun doesn't end up in convenient 50 grain or 25 grain measures. I've got about 20 muzzleloaders rifle and pistol and not one of them optims out at a load that is suited to pellets.
     
  7. khegglie

    khegglie Member

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    "The only downside to pellets is that I've found that the best load for a given gun doesn't end up in convenient 50 grain or 25 grain measures. I've got about 20 muzzleloaders rifle and pistol and not one of them optims out at a load that is suited to pellets."
    thanks Pancho...

    I will prob use Pyrodex R/S powder as well when I get more experienced with the loads
     
  8. ElvinWarrior

    ElvinWarrior Member

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    When I first came to THR, I was of the oppinion that, (A) you dump your powder down the barrel, (B) you ram your patched ball down on top of the powder... and (C) you prayed like hell it works out okay...

    There is a certain romance and appeal to that kind of simplicity...

    Now... through the wonders of better living through expert advice... I have come to the conclusion that I was way too child like in my approach to muzzle loading....

    Now, I religiously do the following...

    A) Swab the barrel with a home brew swabbing liquid, such as a 40/40/20 mix of water, rubbing alcohol, and extra virgin olive oil... (EVOO)..., Use a moist patch, not a saturated patch, you want to moisten the barrel, not drown it....

    B) Toss down 5 to 10 grains of "priming mix", this is a 50/50 mix of 4Fg actual REAL BP, mixed with flash powder, angle the barrel, towards the nipple or flash hole, give the barrel precisely 3 hard thumps, to gather the priming mix towards the ignitor hole.

    C) Stuff down a small tuft of gun cotton, to seat the the cotton on the pile of priming mix. This keeps the priming powder from migrating about the breech, insuring it is properly exposed to the priming flash.

    D) Now, measure out your powder charge, remembering to reduce the grainage by the amount used by the priming mix charge. Obviously, big bores and shot loads, use 2Fg, smaller calibers, use 3Fg. Thump the side of the barrel, precisely 3 times, two quick thumps, and one, long thump... Toss a few grains of salt over you left shoulder to dissipate the scent of the powder, that some game can detect.

    E) Take out a properly sized pre-lubed 100% Pure Virgin Felt Wad, that you made yourself, from a custom made punch you ordered from Lee Precision for the bargain basement price of $297.42, And carefully lubed at home, with a home made (Secret), recipe you mail ordered from "John the Lube guys" home page. Carefully seat the lubbed wad down on top of the tamped powder charge.

    F) Take precisely 7.35 grains of actual real cream of wheat, slightly moistened with premium imported yak urine. DO NOT BREATH THE FUMES, as they will cause halucinations !!! Pour the "Yaky Cream" mix, as I like to call it, down the barrel, again thump the side of the barrel EXACTLY THREE times, two short thumps, and ONE LONG thump...

    G) place a small dollup of homemade barrel lube in the muzzle end of the barrel, the same "Secret" formula you used for the lubed patch.

    H) Place a homemade pre-lubed round patch over the muzzel of the barrel, Precisely centered. Make you patches out of the most expensive imported Irish Linnen you can find, pure virgin cotton, pure white, hand loomed, 234 Thread count, .015" thinkness, with the lube soaked in.

    I) Place your properly sized, hand made, custom pure virgin new lead ball in the center of the patch. I will not discuss the details of cast balls versus swagged balls, or cast balls that have been, filed, ball milled, and rock tumbler polished, as this is an advanced topic, and I haven't finished my research on the subject yet, but, in a month or two, I will be releasing my book on the subject, "I Gots Big Balls", "A definative guide to Muzzle Loading Round Ball Selection and Use". 14.99, paperback, 149.99, Hard Bound in Morracan leather with gold leaf lettering, from the Mormon Temple Press.

    J) Using a solid maple with formed brass tipped ball starter, gently "nudge" the ball down the barrel to the halfway point of the ball, lightly tapping, now that is "TAPPING", on the ball starter with a seasoned, vintage nerf hammer, as used by Davie Croechette, in the Hollywood Version of his life story.

    K) With the ball and patch firmly lodged halfway down the diameter of the ball, take out your patented, hand made, exact reproduction of an 18th Century Pocket Patch Knife, as discovered laying on the battlefields of the Revolutionary war, and carefully reproduced by DGW of Tennessee, in absolute accuracy, and carefully trim the excess patch material away from the ball. Pay special attention to this process, as this is an entire chapter in my new book, You want to carefully "saw" through the excess patch material, not scoring the lead ball at all. If you score the ball, you must remove it and start over.

    L) Using your solid maple ball starter, using the long end, seat the ball, the full length of the long rod length of the ball starter, again, using the seasoned nerf hammer to gently "nudge" the ball down the barrel.

    M) Put away all of your possibles into your Signature Series 40lb possibles fringed leather back pack. ($387.55, at the possibles shop).

    N) Draw out the ramrod from the gun (Of course, you have replaced the ramrod that came with the gun, which is only a "presentation" rod, only for looks, with an actual real, functioning rod, custom made from the finest hand forged Swiss spring steel, from, "Rods R Us", of Bethsamanie. Rhode Island)... Place a dollup of barrel lube into the muzzel end of the barrel, Use the special "snake oil" and "bear grease" variation of the basic barrel lube recipe for this process.

    O) Place a square lubbing patch over the muzzle of the barrel, and using your long ramrod, push the patched ball down the barrel and seat it FIRMLY against the powder charge. Give it one last "PUSH", to gently "Compact" the priming powder, gun cotton wad, powder charge, Cream of wheat filler, lubbed wad, and lubed patch/ball combination all together into a nice, firm, tight and compacted unit.

    P) Draw out the ramrod, wiping down the rod, the barrel of the gun, and your hands with your handy-dandy Gun Wipes, available from the "Specialty Outfitters Store".

    Q) You are now ready to prime your gun... This is not a simple subject, and I may, write an entire other book just on this subject alone. But for now, Only use certified, bonified, registered and trademarked #11 Remington Caps, if using a percussion model gun, and ONLY prime your priming pan with your custom mixed priming mix as discussed earlier. Only fill, the priming pan HALF FULL of priming mix powder, too much powder, actually slows the ignition of the barrel charge, as time is wasted burning off the exess powder, obviously, not enough powder will result in a fizzle fire... It has to be precisely the right amount of powder, sized specifically to the exact size of your particular pan... This may take two or three years of intensive testing on your behalf to determine the exact amount of priming mix powder to use in your particular gun. Cock the Flint Hammer into Half-Cock position, and close the frizzen over the pan.

    Your gun is now loaded...

    I can't tell you how much I have learned in my brief few months here on this forum, it has helped me, and increased my knowlege base tremendously. I am no longer the green horn novice I was when I first came wandering up to these noble hallways... I am now, and shall allways and forever more be, an informed, litterate, and educated Black Powder EXPERT !!!

    LOL !!!

    Good Hunting Boys !!!

    Sincerely,

    ElvinWarrior... aka... David, "EW"
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2011
  9. col.lemat

    col.lemat Member

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    O.K.

    you got to be kidding! You and me agree on a lot of things, but after 50 years of bp shooting I am still going to use your first method. At my age I dont have that much time left for the second method.
     
  10. ElvinWarrior

    ElvinWarrior Member

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    Col, LeMat,

    Of course I am kidding !!! It was meant to be a lighthearted joke, poking fun at all the falderall and fiddle-faddle we get ourselves involved in when in pursuit of our hobby...

    It was intended to be a humorous version of how some of us get all overdone in everything we do, over complicating the simplist aspects of muzzle loading into a burdonsome and overcomplicated approach that turns everything into a process requiring a college degree, instead of just keeping it all fun and real.

    I was, going to put a step in the middle, where, you break for lunch before you finish loading the gun... LOL !!!

    Sincerely,

    ElvinWarrior... aka... David, "EW"
     
  11. khegglie

    khegglie Member

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    URFF! I got the joke Elvin... the pellets just keep looking better and better :p
     
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