Carbine or Full Size FAL?

[ElectricZombie]

I'm trying to decide between a carbine and full sized FAL. Is the accuracy between the two really that different at 200 - 300 yards?

 

[elmerfudd]

I'd go for the carbine with an 18" barrel. That's long enough to get some decent velocity, but still pretty handy. FAL's usually aren't tackdrivers and I don't think you'll notice that much distance out to their maximum effective range.

I'd really only opt for a long barrel with an AR or a bolt action. Those you might expect to shoot out to 800 yards where the extra velocity would come in handy.

 

[iamkris]

Please do a search...this topic comes up quite often on the forum.

between a carbine and full sized FAL. Is the accuracy between the two

Longer barrels do NOT equal greater accuracy. That's a bad "common wisdom" that floats around the gun world.

• Longer barrels do (usually) mean more velocity (if the shorter barrel doesn't let the powder burn fully)
• Longer barrels may allow a longer sight radius (assuming the front sight moves with the barrel length) allowing you to more precisely align the sights
• Depending on barrel thickness, shorter barrels may be a little stiffer, allowing less barrel whip during the shot, possibly allowing better accuracy.

Here's my full sized rifle next to my 16" Para. You can see the length difference. I'll admit, with the shot barrel and lightweight lower, the Para is extremely well balanced...a big reason why it is so popular.

 

[Bwana John]

I like ~18" barrels on my FALs.

 

[Calhoun]

I would go w/the 18" bbl. I have a full lengenth and it is mighty long. I'm thinking about having it chopped down to 18", or even 16", just to make it more managable.

Or, you could always get one of each.

 

[Nightcrawler]

I went from a 20.9" standard rifle with the long faux-Stoll muzzle brake (which made for an overall length a hair over 43") to a 16.25" barrel and a Belgian flash hider, for an overall length of about 37.5". It makes a big difference in handling.

Remember, with an 18" barrel and a muzzle device, a FAL will still be as long as an M16A2 (about 40" overall). With a naked 18" barrel, it'll be just a sliver longer than a 16" with a muzzle device (depending on the device). A naked 16" will make it very nearly as short as an AK. (Bit longer, due to the longer stock and longer receiver.)

If you imagine yourself ever finding a use for the rifle beyond just plinking at the range, I recommend going shorter.

 

[HorseSoldier]

I'd go with the carbine if you're looking for something comfortable and handy. The ballistics aren't that big a deal between the shorter and longer barrels at the ranges you're asking about.

 

[iamkris]

A naked 16" will make it very nearly as short as an AK.

And as an illustration...



Here's a 16.25" bbl Para next to a 18" PTR91 for comparison's sake

The ballistics aren't that big a deal between the shorter and longer barrels at the ranges you're asking about.

Here's a quick drop table calc -- zeroed at 200 yds -- to show the difference of a 16" (assume 2450 fps) to a 21" (assume 2650 fps). Basic difference is 10.9" drop at 300 for the carbine vs 9.1" drop for rifle.

First the 2450 fps

Trajectory Output
Input Data
Manufacturer: Barnes Description: 0.308 dia. 150 gr. XLC™ Boattail

Muzzle Velocity: 2450.0 ft/s Chronograph Distance: 0.0 ft

Temperature: 59.0 °F Pressure: 29.92 in Hg
Relative Humidity: 0.0 % Altitude: 0 ft

Calculated Table
Range Drop Drop Windage Windage Velocity Mach Energy Time Lead Lead
(yds) (in) (moa) (in) (moa) (ft/s) (none) (ft•lbs) (s) (in) (moa)
0 -1.5 *** 0.0 *** 2450.0 2.194 1998.9 0.000 0.0 ***
50 1.4 2.6 0.0 0.0 2349.3 2.104 1837.9 0.063 0.0 0.0
100 2.7 2.6 0.0 0.0 2250.8 2.016 1687.1 0.128 0.0 0.0
150 2.3 1.5 0.0 0.0 2154.7 1.930 1546.1 0.196 0.0 0.0
200 -0.0 -0.0 0.0 0.0 2060.9 1.846 1414.5 0.267 0.0 0.0
250 -4.3 -1.7 0.0 0.0 1969.6 1.764 1291.8 0.342 0.0 0.0
300 -10.9 -3.5 0.0 0.0 1880.8 1.685 1178.0 0.419 0.0 0.0
350 -19.9 -5.4 0.0 0.0 1794.6 1.607 1072.5 0.501 0.0 0.0
400 -31.7 -7.6 0.0 0.0 1711.3 1.533 975.2 0.587 0.0 0.0
450 -46.3 -9.8 0.0 0.0 1631.0 1.461 885.9 0.676 0.0 0.0
500 -64.3 -12.3 0.0 0.0 1554.1 1.392 804.3 0.771 0.0 0.0

And now the 2650

Trajectory Output
Input Data
Manufacturer: Barnes Description: 0.308 dia. 150 gr. XLC™ Boattail

Muzzle Velocity: 2650.0 ft/s Chronograph Distance: 0.0 ft

Temperature: 59.0 °F Pressure: 29.92 in Hg
Relative Humidity: 0.0 % Altitude: 0 ft


Calculated Table
Range Drop Drop Windage Windage Velocity Mach Energy Time Lead Lead
(yds) (in) (moa) (in) (moa) (ft/s) (none) (ft•lbs) (s) (in) (moa)
0 -1.5 *** 0.0 *** 2650.0 2.374 2338.6 0.000 0.0 ***
50 1.0 1.9 0.0 0.0 2544.6 2.279 2156.3 0.058 0.0 0.0
100 2.2 2.1 0.0 0.0 2441.7 2.187 1985.4 0.118 0.0 0.0
150 1.9 1.2 0.0 0.0 2341.2 2.097 1825.2 0.181 0.0 0.0
200 -0.0 -0.0 0.0 0.0 2242.9 2.009 1675.3 0.246 0.0 0.0
250 -3.6 -1.4 0.0 0.0 2147.0 1.923 1535.1 0.314 0.0 0.0
300 -9.1 -2.9 0.0 0.0 2053.4 1.839 1404.2 0.386 0.0 0.0
350 -16.7 -4.5 0.0 0.0 1962.3 1.758 1282.3 0.461 0.0 0.0
400 -26.5 -6.3 0.0 0.0 1873.7 1.678 1169.1 0.539 0.0 0.0
450 -38.8 -8.2 0.0 0.0 1787.7 1.601 1064.3 0.621 0.0 0.0
500 -53.8 -10.3 0.0 0.0 1704.7 1.527 967.7 0.707 0.0 0.0

15 Jan 2008 08:32:51, JBM [http://www.eskimo.com/~jbm]

I bought myself a chronograph for Christmas...I need to get to the range to see what the actual velocity loss is back to back between the two...if only it would warm up from the 14 deg F it is now.

 

[Line Rider]

+1 on full lenght barrels