Chokes for sporting clays

[Oldnamvet]

I warmed up with skeet today and shot my average (23) before trying sporting clays for the first time. It was a humbling experience but what a blast! I ended up with a 30, not exactly stellar. I only had skeet tubes in my sxs and felt on some of the stations that the dinky birds were sneaking through the pattern on the longer shots. I also didn't take enough ammo with me so some singles that got away wouldn't have if I would have had enough shells to take a second poke at them. But the main question is: which choke tubes are best overall for sporting clays? Do you change from station to station or just leave one set in?

 

[PJR]

It's not hard to fall into the trap of thinking too much about chokes. However, it was written years ago that chokes give you inches while we miss in feet.

I head out on the course with light modified chokes in my gun and skeet and improved modified in my shooting bag. The skeet come out for very close targets while the improved modified is called upon if the presentations are beyond 50 yards. Each choke gives me .010" of constriction difference. I've done enough patterning to know that the differences between .005" aren't enough to matter.

The biggest mistake many shooters make is reaching for the wrench before they have sorted out a plan of attack at the station. When do you first see the bird, what is the target line, is it edge on or do you see the full face, where do you want to break it, what is the gun hold and insert position, where do you position your feet? Then watch the bird's flight very closely. Is it doing anything odd in flight such as dropping or curling away, is the background decieving in some manner? Have you seen a target like this before and how did you shoot it? Where do you want your gun for the second bird?

If I've got that sorted out then I'll consider whether I have the right choke. If I run out of time then I'll just stay with the light modified. The only time I'll reach for the wrench first is if the previous station was close and the next is an eye-popping long presentation. I don't mind being overchoked but hate the feeling I might not have enough.

About 75 per cent of my shooting is done with light mod and if I've left my chokes in the car I don't worry if there's only light mod in the gun.

 

[BozemanMT]

It's not hard to fall into the trap of thinking too much about chokes. However, it was written years ago that chokes give you inches while we miss in feet.

boy, is that well written.
I've found that I switch shot sizes more than I switch chokes.
close easy shots get 9's, all the way down to far away shots get 7.5's.

I usually shoot C/IC although my IC is pretty tight (patterning boards tell you a lot) in my SxS
My buddy is a slightly better shooter than me, he changes his chokes all the time, we are always within a couple birds on the course (mostly him, sometimes me, but he's a better shooter, his trap scores prove it)

The shots that are 45 yards away doing 60mph on a true crosser, well I'm not hitting them anyway.

I shoot skeet with the same C/IC combo

The one situation that I pay attention to chokes is mini's, mini's counter-intuitively require a tighter choke. Try it, you'll be a amazed (they fly through the holes on the looser chokes)

 

[RNB65]

I've tried all combinations -- using #8 shot and IC for everything, using #8 shot and changing chokes based on distance, and only using IC choke and changing shot size (7.5, 8, 9) based on distance. The results? No difference in scoring, I shoot the same scores no matter what combo I use. My shooting limitations are between my ears and not with my equipment. Vision problems are also a limiting factor -- I'm cross dominant and have poor distance vision due to uncorrected astigmatism.

I currently use #8 shot for everything and change chokes based on distance. I use IC about 75% of the time and use CYL for the really short stuff and occasionally MOD for long crossers.

 

[sm]

It's not hard to fall into the trap of thinking too much about chokes. However, it was written years ago that chokes give you inches while we miss in feet.

Paul's words need to be Chisled in Granite!

Umm, Last Sporting Clays I shot I used a NEF Youth 20 ga, single shot, fixed modified choke and stacked the loads. Never missed a bird!
Granted I was walking the course and not really shooting the thing, instead "coaching" someone else - but hey - I can at least say I shot a perfect 'round".
5/5


--

I believe in having various loads to choose from and not changing chokes.

Stacked Loads we called them

I really feel screw in chokes have "hurt" more than "helped" shotgunning in a lot of ways.

I used a Citori 3 barrel Skeet set with fixed chokes a LOT, 20 ga for longer courses, and 28 ga for sure on shorter courses. I reloaded hard nickle plated shot in #8 for the "longer shots".

12 bore, such as my SX1, and only one barrel, Shot using a .720 external knurled choke. I had chilled shot, and hard shot, in both 2 3/4 dr, 3 dr loads.
Shot sizes # 8.5, # 8, and maybe a # 7.5 - depends on course and presentations.

I personally feel a two barreled gun - 12 bore - fixed choke mind you - in Skeet I and Skeet II would not only work for Sporting Clays, but take care of 90% of what anyone would do with a Shotgun - no matter what.


Skeet I - .005
Skeet II - 0.12

 

[Dave McCracken]

PGC's course can pretty much be shot with a LM choke and 8s. Mod and/or 7.5s on a few presentations.

Don't get Choke Fever. Stick with a moderate amount of choke. IC or LM will get you 90% of the birds on most courses if you point right.

There's something to be said for using more choke than necessary for practice. The solid hits will build confidence.

 

[PJR]

The subset of choke twirling is shell changing. I went though that phase too and carried a mind-boggling combination of shells including spreaders, various shot sizes, loads, velocities, dram weights and shot hardness.

On a competition course where you don't know the presentations until you get there I'd have 250 shells in my bag for a 100 round course. On more occasions than I'd care to recall I'd end up digging through my bag looking for a specific shell only to discover they'd been used earlier in the round.

I was going into the box thinking I didn't have the right shells in the gun. In hindsight that errant and irrelevant thought cost me targets.

The epiphany on chokes and loads came a few years ago during a review of notes from an instructional session I'd just taken. One phrase jumped out at me: REDUCE THE VARIABLES!

The point the instructor made was there are many variables beyond our control but reducing the variables we could control would result in more focus on breaking the targets which is why were there in the first place.

It dawned on me that while I could take the physical burden of an extra heavy load of chokes and shells, it was the mental burden of having to think about them that was taking away from focusing on the target.

I immediately dumped the contents of my shooting bag (now reaching duffel bag proportions) on my work bench. I found an older, smaller shooting bag and took a minimalist approach. In went skeet, light modified and improved modified chokes, ear and eye protection and a choke wrench. I thought of every sporting course I'd ever shot and what I really needed and in went 4 boxes of 1 ounce hard #8 and two boxes 1-1/8 of hard #7.5 both loads in the 1200-1250fps range. A spare set of batteries for my head set, a multi-tool, wad knocker, a little bottle of Tylenol and some Kleenex were also added. With the addition of some bug spray in the summer and a bottle of water that is about what you'll find in my shooting bag today.

Less thinking about trivia and more thinking about targets has improved my scores.

The minimalist approach also applies to HD shooting as well. Fewer choices to make in the heat of the moment is always preferable.

 

[Oldnamvet]

Thanks for all the input. Looks like if I just put in one skeet tube and one IC, I should be good to go. I shoot 1 oz #8s all the time so will stick with those. I like this -- I won't have to buy anything in addition to what I already have. I think my most exciting station (don't know the numbers yet or the names) was where a true double goes up at about a 60 degree angle in front of you .. I got them both with one shot. I do that every now and then on doubles at skeet but it is more accident than anything else. This time I saw them both, let them get closer to gether and fired between them getting them both. Lots of visceral satisfaction watching them both break. I am going to have to join another Sportsmans club so I can do this more often. Only $30/year membership and costs $11 a round for sporting clays. My present club has only trap and skeet (but they have pistol and rifle ranges as well). Good thing I'm retired.

 

[sm]

PJR,

I came to the same conclusion : Simplify!

I shot a lot of fixed choked guns -

1. what raised with, as we did not have screw in chokes back then.
2. still hate to this day keeping up with a choke tube wrench, all mine are external knurled chokes
3. words from Mentors keep screaming in my head "just shoot the durn gun. Do NOT ever let some of the 90% [Mental game] get bled off into the 10% [Physical game].

I knew all this, heck I had some barrels with the marking of what the choke was, removed on purpose and folks would hit, and whatever they "thought" the "choke" was - I said it was. I mean same gun, same barrel and folks "said" anyting from Cyl to Full. They were hitting and breaking targets because they focused on target and all the things one is supposed to do upon slapping the trigger, not mentally stressing about the gun, barrel , choke or loads.

All I had done was patterned various loads with that barrel/ choke and handed them that ammo for task. [Skeet, doves, duck...].

Matter of bore - not choke. - Brister

I know that, shot a lot of 12 bore. I finally just went to having fun, I had had my competition stuff, and used my 3 barrel Citori Skeet, fixed choked barrels, to shoot everything.

Started shooting one load.

20 ga loads and 28 ga loads of Hard #8 for most courses, and 5 stand, and shorter courses I'd use hard # 8.5

On doubles, often times best to take second bird first, and keep on swinging to catch the first bird and pop it.


I was lucky , or smart in some ways, some due to NOT having some of all this new stuff to confuse me.

I did all my research and testing from a standpoint of being curious and educating myself - NOT from the equipment race attitude and perspective.

Brister, Baker and others were facinating to read and learn from as were other folks.

Sporting Clay courses being more limited - I did a lot of 5 stand. Me, being me, did not like being in the "cage", so observing safety rules and all, I and others were allowed to shoot from in front, and the presentations NOT tossed as usual. We wanted "field" practice. We did not even call for targets, just like we did not for skeet.

Until more recent, when I had something to do, I was doing 90% of my shooting with a NEF Youth 20 ga single shot.
Now that the 'tribute shoot' is over, I will go back to the NEF.

Takes a good partner, and communication, still I/ we were using single shots at 5 stand and a impromtu Sporting Clay set up. Oh we were getting in the practice in shooting - and reloading fast to take doubles, still backing each other up.
Fun, and challenging!

Then again I have some custom rods built on Loomis blanks and Fly fishing stuff...
I have fished more with a cane pole than anything else for a bit now too.

I've gone backwards - or more Simplified - depends on how one looks at it.

 

[TrapperReady]

I just got back from shooting the WI State Sporting Clays Championship. I didn't shoot all the events, but I did shoot 500 registered targets over 5 days. I shot (at) 498 of those targets with a LIGHT-MOD, and exactly 2 with a SKEET.

Personally, I shoot an O/U and carry 2 SKEET tubes, 2 LIGHT-MOD tubes, 2 HEAVY-MOD tubes and 2 FULL tubes. The FULL tubes are only used for trap and for practice rounds. There's got to be something exceptional for me to change up or down from the LIGHT-MODs.

BTW, I shot #8's probably 70% of the time, but changed to #7.5s for rabbits, long targets and when the wind was kicking up pretty hard.

 

[Dave McCracken]

I think I recall Will Fennell saying he uses 8.5s for most shots, 7.5s for the rest.

Next time I do a SC round, I may just screw in the Light Mod and use 7.5s all the way through to see what happens....

 

[TrapperReady]

Dave - I'd wager your usual flagon of mead* that you won't see any decrease in your score, and may see a modest increase. I now shoot all my league and practice rounds with #7.5 shot. I still use #8s (with #7.5s for rabbits and long or windy shots) for competition, but I may very well switch to nothing but #7.5s by next season.

BTW, my favorite use of #7.5s is in relatively fast (1300fps) shells on long teal shots. I'm not sure that the math would show much of a difference, but they sure seem to get there "right now".

 

[PJR]

I agree with using 7-1/2 for rabbits and longer shots. I've gone back and forth on speed versus shot. Currently I want 1-1/8 for the larger shot and will give up 100 fps to save on recoil. But you make a point on the higher velocity on long shots. The fast movers seem to break the targets harder and on the really long pokes you don't have the mili-second delay in the breaks.

None of my decisions are written on stone tablets. I could just as easily see myself shooting nothing but 1 ounce, 7-1/2 at 1350 fps for sporting.

 

[Dave McCracken]

Haven't chronoed my pet load, but the book says I'm getting close to 1300. 18.2 gr Clays, 7/8 oz of 8.5s. Win 209, STS case, CL clone of WAA12SL. It crushes them when I do my part.

I may switch to 7.5s earlier than usual this fall just to try things out. I'll stick with LM (14 POC) for the nonce.

 

[scchokedaddy]

I must have missed the classes on chokes. Mostley shoot 16 gauge 7.5s 1 ounce cheap remington, an old 1148 with cutts mod, spartan ou with imp & mod, or 1100 with imp. Sometimes I'll shoot 20 gauge ou with imp & mod also using 1ounce 7.5s. Every once in a while I'll break out my B80 12 gauge and shoot 8's 1ounce impcyl. Definately not loyal to any gun, just shoot what I grab when I go. But after watching everyone else switching change tubes all day, I wonder if I missed the boat. Just started shooting claya in Feb. The course I started on is a woods course, all singles. Its tough, but fun. Then I got invited to Hanging Rock Plantation in Millen Ga. And I was hooked. My average score is 60. I know that will make you all laugh, but I am trying. After shooting with some of the better shooters, and lots of improtu coaching from them and Robert [the owner] I am seeing where I am going to a 12 gauge ou. It is a SKB 600 with fixed chokes, full and mod. After talking with the guys at compnchoke, I opted to send them the barrells to get the full choke reamed to ic. Then I get a cram course in chokes from you all tonite. Oh well enough rambling. All I realy meant to do was thank you all for the input even though it wasn'[t meant for me .