m0ntels
Member
By the time the sensor hears the shot, wont the bullet already be in something?
Randy
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Coffee cans in crime fighting. (Mpls)
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By the time the sensor hears the shot, wont the bullet already be in something?
Randy
lance22
Member
The Cost of Crime Responding
When I worked in downtown St. Paul, during lunch I saw people deal drugs daily, out in the open, in the same place every day. Every day, the same thugs with baggy pants and dew rags crowding around the same phone booths, harassing people. Cops just drive by, oblivious.
If they REALLY want to deal with crime, why don't they just arrest these thugs who are out in the open? But they buy these expensive toys as if they are searching for crime with a microscope and can barely find any. :banghead:
When I worked in downtown St. Paul, during lunch I saw people deal drugs daily, out in the open, in the same place every day. Every day, the same thugs with baggy pants and dew rags crowding around the same phone booths, harassing people. Cops just drive by, oblivious.
If they REALLY want to deal with crime, why don't they just arrest these thugs who are out in the open? But they buy these expensive toys as if they are searching for crime with a microscope and can barely find any. :banghead:
KnightHawk67
Member
IIRC They used the same type equipment trying to catch the Columbus Rt 270 shooter. Did not seem to do much good, his family turned him in.
Nortonics
Member
Great idea. Just another tool too. Lot of people out here don't see the possibilities of such a system. It's an amazing technology that has proven itself in other cities already Not only can it detect the shot to within 75 feet, but it can also determine direction, elevation and azimuth. In this digital age just imagine a 3-dimensional real-time map of an area with all projectiles mapped, and can overlay historical maps for a view of exactly where most activity occurs. Now imagine the ability to take that info in real time and immediately bring up and record from any number of thousands of cameras positioned all around the twin cities that are already in place.
You may think this is science fiction, but it's not. It will work at least to the level indicated above - the military has been using this incredible technology for years with both visual and acoustic weapon fire signatures - ever watch the Discovery Channel, TLC, National Geographic, etc ?. Believe it or not, that cost is a drop in the bucket on the budget - to not embrace this tried and true technology tool for such a low cost would in itself be poor decision.
Some may even argue that it's just another tool for big brother to further monitor it's citizens. To just toss it to the wind and say "how stupid, it'll never work, can't detect between a firecracker and a gun shot, what a waste of money" would certainly be a miscalculated afterthought.
You may think this is science fiction, but it's not. It will work at least to the level indicated above - the military has been using this incredible technology for years with both visual and acoustic weapon fire signatures - ever watch the Discovery Channel, TLC, National Geographic, etc ?. Believe it or not, that cost is a drop in the bucket on the budget - to not embrace this tried and true technology tool for such a low cost would in itself be poor decision.
Some may even argue that it's just another tool for big brother to further monitor it's citizens. To just toss it to the wind and say "how stupid, it'll never work, can't detect between a firecracker and a gun shot, what a waste of money" would certainly be a miscalculated afterthought.
Zen21Tao
Member
How long before they learn to spoof the detectors with firecrackers or some other means and watch with amusement as several cars are diverted from their regular duties to investigate?
Wow, what a great tool for criminals. Have a guy fire a couple shots in one part of the city then when all the available cops respond his buddies commit their crimes at the other end of town without the fear of being caught by a near by cop.
wheelgunslinger
Member
Nortonics wrote:
JOOC, Nortonics, what's your interest in this subject? You seem awfully informed.
Some may even argue that it's just another tool for big brother to further monitor it's citizens. To just toss it to the wind and say "how stupid, it'll never work, can't detect between a firecracker and a gun shot, what a waste of money" would certainly be a miscalculated afterthought.
JOOC, Nortonics, what's your interest in this subject? You seem awfully informed.
Nortonics
Member
No particular interest other than living in the Minneapolis metro, along with a career in computer engineering. Interesting, high tech stuff is all...
Jim Diver
Member
Sounds alot like what Vin Suprynowicz wrote about in The Black Arrow.
BigRobT
Member
The problem is Minneapolis is far too PC to deal with the actual problems. I work near the Ford Bridge (between Minneapolis and St Paul). The bridge is tagged with numerous gang related graffiti. There have been sever spray paint cans and lids found, turned in and discussion was to not bother with it because it was a waste of time. My feelings are, tackle the gang problem at the lowest level and it'll get their attention. It may also lead to future arrests of higher up gang members. Minneapolis also whines about being undermanned, LEO-wise. The bigger problem is that Minnesota cops, on the whole, just don't do their job very well. They refuse to make the stupid taillight out traffic stops that often lead to arrests of criminals. I could go on and on, but I'll keep it short. Quite hanging out at the local diner and hit the streets. Oh yeah, now MPD has those fancy schmancy Segways. Maybe they will prove to be a benefit, but right now, I see them as an unnecessary tax burden. Oh...... and let's not get into the physical shape of many of the LEOS. Many of these guys I've seen would be on the "fat boy" program were they in the military. They're definitely not representative of how I picture a LEO should be. Should they all be poster boys?? Definitely not. However, they shouldn't be clinically obese, either.
larry_minn
Member
So they have $350k in money. Couldn't they hire some more Officers. Lets say at $50k each we should have four more Officers and equipment. 200k and 150 for squad cars/training/etc. pay for next year (plus maintenance costs) So they could buy two squad cars/training for it.
wheelgunslinger
Member
BigRobT wrote:
From an article on the KARE 11 website
Police Sergeant "working his butt off" to help fund Activities League
"... with my size you don't get a lot of grief," says Sergeant Jim Novak.
He's a big man, at least 6-feet-3-inches tall. He has run two Twin Cities Marathons, the last, just fifteen months ago. He's taken a state power lifting championship. He's a fitness instructor for the police department.
Nevertheless, the nine year veteran admits to being "overweight." He plans to lose more than 30 pounds so his sponsors will help fund his passion.
For the last year, Sergeant Novak has been director of the Police Activities League, the Minneapolis police sponsored program for kids.
It's a less active job than his previous street cop assignment.
"The police department donates one police sergeant, two police officers and one police civilian to the Police Activities League," he says, "and we have to raise $200,000 for programming ourselves."
The Police Activities League has a membership list of 1,500 Minneapolis children, mostly inner city youngsters, and gives them experiences they would not ordinarily get to enjoy. For example, more than 200 inner city kids are scheduled to go tubing January 4, at no cost to themselves. The trip will cost the Police Activities League about $2,500.
Sergeant Novak figures if he can get pledges of $250 per pound, and loses 40 pounds, he and his sponsors can fund four similar outings. As of January 3, he had pledges of $219 per pound.
To further the project, he weighed in at the Arena Athletic Club. Witnessed by Police Sergeant Rick Altonen and Arena Personal Trainer Sarah Sillers, he addressed the scale.
"Do you know how high it goes?" he somewhat jokingly asked Sillers.
"Nope," she said.
He stepped up and Sgt Altonen and Sillers peered.
"Shall we say 340.9?" asked Altonen, which sounded good to Sillers.
They duly noted the weight.
"The reason this is important, Sgt. Novak said, "is because I'm using this for fundraising, so the weight has to be verified."
Then Sillers served up a surprise when Sgt. Novak asked how much weight she thought the he could lose in a month, she answered, "Safely, they say two pounds a week... one to two pounds per week."
The Police Activities League Director frowned.
He was planning to lose significantly more than that in a month to help fund his passion. Looks like he's going to be working for a few months.
For more information, please click here
If you'd like to help fund the project, call Sergeant Novak at (612)627-5107. He'll be out tubing Wednesday morning, but he'll get back to you.
You're also welcome to send a donation to:
Police Activities League
1025 Broadway Street NE #48
Minneapolis, MN 55413
By Ken Speake, KARE 11 News
(Copyright 2006 by KARE. All Rights Reserved.)"
Big Rob, you could always encourage this guy by donating to his cause.
incidentally, you're not really that far off in your assessment.
l am, however, encouraged by the number of officers I work out beside and sometimes with, in my gym. There are a lot of very fit officers out there.
Which brings us back to the thread. Why spend 300k on a neato whizbang device that helps pinpoint gunshots if the officers, in general, aren't capable of handling a more dangerous "smoking gun" type of situation that's bound to be more dynamic than if you took the usual hour or two to get there. Perhaps the coffee cans should be put on the back burner in favor of a more pro-active fitness program, the hiring of a couple of trainers, and maybe a dietician?
The listening devices may be a good program, but you can't forget the basics no matter what you're doing.
Oh...... and let's not get into the physical shape of many of the LEOS. Many of these guys I've seen would be on the "fat boy" program were they in the military. They're definitely not representative of how I picture a LEO should be. Should they all be poster boys?? Definitely not. However, they shouldn't be clinically obese, either.
From an article on the KARE 11 website
Police Sergeant "working his butt off" to help fund Activities League
"... with my size you don't get a lot of grief," says Sergeant Jim Novak.
He's a big man, at least 6-feet-3-inches tall. He has run two Twin Cities Marathons, the last, just fifteen months ago. He's taken a state power lifting championship. He's a fitness instructor for the police department.
Nevertheless, the nine year veteran admits to being "overweight." He plans to lose more than 30 pounds so his sponsors will help fund his passion.
For the last year, Sergeant Novak has been director of the Police Activities League, the Minneapolis police sponsored program for kids.
It's a less active job than his previous street cop assignment.
"The police department donates one police sergeant, two police officers and one police civilian to the Police Activities League," he says, "and we have to raise $200,000 for programming ourselves."
The Police Activities League has a membership list of 1,500 Minneapolis children, mostly inner city youngsters, and gives them experiences they would not ordinarily get to enjoy. For example, more than 200 inner city kids are scheduled to go tubing January 4, at no cost to themselves. The trip will cost the Police Activities League about $2,500.
Sergeant Novak figures if he can get pledges of $250 per pound, and loses 40 pounds, he and his sponsors can fund four similar outings. As of January 3, he had pledges of $219 per pound.
To further the project, he weighed in at the Arena Athletic Club. Witnessed by Police Sergeant Rick Altonen and Arena Personal Trainer Sarah Sillers, he addressed the scale.
"Do you know how high it goes?" he somewhat jokingly asked Sillers.
"Nope," she said.
He stepped up and Sgt Altonen and Sillers peered.
"Shall we say 340.9?" asked Altonen, which sounded good to Sillers.
They duly noted the weight.
"The reason this is important, Sgt. Novak said, "is because I'm using this for fundraising, so the weight has to be verified."
Then Sillers served up a surprise when Sgt. Novak asked how much weight she thought the he could lose in a month, she answered, "Safely, they say two pounds a week... one to two pounds per week."
The Police Activities League Director frowned.
He was planning to lose significantly more than that in a month to help fund his passion. Looks like he's going to be working for a few months.
For more information, please click here
If you'd like to help fund the project, call Sergeant Novak at (612)627-5107. He'll be out tubing Wednesday morning, but he'll get back to you.
You're also welcome to send a donation to:
Police Activities League
1025 Broadway Street NE #48
Minneapolis, MN 55413
By Ken Speake, KARE 11 News
(Copyright 2006 by KARE. All Rights Reserved.)"
Big Rob, you could always encourage this guy by donating to his cause.
incidentally, you're not really that far off in your assessment.
This according to some data gathered by real live scientists shows that cops are literally killing themselves doing the job.Unfortunately, the average life span of an officer is 59 years young. Furthermore, male officers over the age of 50 are twice as likely to acquire diabetes than males in all other occupations - so says UNC Chapel Hill in a 1999 research study. Why do law enforcement officers die of heart disease and acquire other ailments much younger than the general population? The answer is simple......lifestyle choices. Poor diet, smoking and the lack of exercise are a just a few reasons
l am, however, encouraged by the number of officers I work out beside and sometimes with, in my gym. There are a lot of very fit officers out there.
Which brings us back to the thread. Why spend 300k on a neato whizbang device that helps pinpoint gunshots if the officers, in general, aren't capable of handling a more dangerous "smoking gun" type of situation that's bound to be more dynamic than if you took the usual hour or two to get there. Perhaps the coffee cans should be put on the back burner in favor of a more pro-active fitness program, the hiring of a couple of trainers, and maybe a dietician?
The listening devices may be a good program, but you can't forget the basics no matter what you're doing.
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