creedmore sights

[bender]

I'm interested in picking up a single-shot bp cartridge rifle, such as a Sharps, or whatever...

I have trouble shooting well with normal open sights due to my old eyes. I have had Lasik done on my right eye (for distance correction), so now close items are a little blurry (rifle sights are blurry). I shoot with a scope on my modern guns.

I was wondering about Creedmore sights. First, are they historically correct? How exactly do they work? They appear to be a rear sliding peep sight, and a front globe sight.

Cimarron sells inserts for their front globe sights... are these "period correct"? Also I see that there are diopter rear sights available.

any comments appreciated... As you can see, I am very interested in "historically correct" replicas. However, I also want to be able to shoot accurately, so I'm interested if Creedmore sights can help me.

 

[adobewalls]

If I remember correctly they are not correct for the days of the buffalo hunter, if that is what you are trying to do; but, they are period correct for the great rifle competitions shortly thereafter.

If you buy, be sure and look into getting a rear sight with a "Hadley Eyepiece". This is the big round rear disk that has several different diameter apertures on a rotating disk. A godsend for old eyes because you can pick the aperture that matches the light level and your eyesight for the day.

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=23126&title=COWBOY+TARGET+RIFLE+SIGHTS

It works the same as the pinhole camera phenomena, in that the light going through the small aperature is sharply focused. Combine that with the the correct front aperture for the target you are using, line these up into three concentric circles, hold hard and squeeze the trigger.

 

[bender]

weird, I never thought of that.

I just backed away from my monitor to where I could not read this thread anymore, then I poked a small hole in a piece of paper and looked thru it, and I could then read the thread....

 

[bender]

so what about the front sight inserts that Cimarron and other companies sell... that go along with the Creedmore rear sights... Were they used any time back in the 1800s, or are they a "modern" convenience ?

also, when you look thru the rear creedmore peephole, you are also sighting thru the front sight, right? So you can have front sight inserts such as crosshairs, posts, or whatever...

 

[Jim Watson]

Tang sights in general are period correct on Sharps et al. The finer and more elaborate the adjustments, the later the design. The Soule windage system came along around 1888 and is the most popular among modern BPCR shooters because of its ease of windage adjustment. There were some earlier rear sight windage adjustments available before that.
Elevation adjustment with a lead screw by the vernier system was available for a long time in the 19th century. Sliding - "graduated" - tang sights were pretty early and would be tedious to work with.

Also, the globe front target sight goes back a long time. Early versions had a fixed pinhead bead; interchangeable inserts came along a bit later. Windgauge front sights and spirit levels are period correct.

 

[bender]

thanks very much, jim watson...!

Windage adjustment was another question I had, so your comment on the Soule system answered that. I will research these old sights for further info.

I'd like to get a bpcr, and with my old eyes, I'd like a sight system that would help me shoot accurately, as long as it was somewhat period correct...

thanks again!

 

[Jim Watson]

Sights: Go to http://www.montanavintagearms.com/
They are not the only period style sight maker (I use a Baldwin.) but they have a range of styles. Plain vernier elevation only (use a windgauge front sight), vernier with windage (at the eyepiece, narrow range of adjustment), Soule windage (under a vernier elevation staff) and Buffalo Soule (a LOT of windage adjustment for extra long range on a windy field.)
They also have front sights including a plain globe with selection of inserts and globes with windage, spirit level, or both.

Rifles: Shiloh Sharps and C. Sharps 1874 Sharps; rather expensive, long delivery unless you catch them with one you like in stock. The C. Sharps 1875 Sharps is the least expensive top quality BPCR and they usually have some in stock. They also make 1885 "Highwall" Winchester repros.
Ballard Rifle Co. makes Ballards and Winchesters.
CPA makes Stevens 44 1/2 of good quality but somewhat later period.
Lone Star makes good Remington Rolling Blocks.
Pedersoli Sharps and Rolling Blocks are the best of the imports, available from Dixie Gun Works and others. But be sure you are looking at a Pedersoli, some importers carry several lines.

A target or sporting model of whichever with a 30" barrel and shotgun butt is the most shootable. Beware of Quigley movie prop guns with long awkward barrels and narrow crooked stocks.

Caliber: .45-70 is the basic; good for about any application, though it might take a little tweaking to do best at 1000 yards. Kicks, though. .40-65 does with a 400 grain bullet what a .45-70 does with a 500. Me? I shoot a .38-55-336.

Real black powder is best. Smokeless and fakes will not do as well. It is not hard to clean a single shot rifle. I can clean the soot out of my .38-55 easier than I can get the copper out of my .308.
There are few good sources of bullets. The successful BPCR shooter is usually a bullet caster.

Mike Venturino's book Shooting The Buffalo Rifles is good. Read about loading black at:
http://www.ssbpcrc.co.uk/Resources/Introduction to BPCR Loading.pdf

 

[bender]

I would probably get a 45-70, since I used to own an original trapdoor springfield back in the 1980s in that caliber. I still have my reloading dies, and even a box of Hornady bullets... I sold that rifle a long time ago when I needed money, doh!

I have the 2008 dixie catalog, and also the Cimarron catalog. I like the sharps 1874 pretty much, but I kind of like the High Wall a little more.

I shoot at 100yds and 200yds at the range I go to (200 is their max). Another range I occasionally go to goes out to 300yds. So 300yds would be the longest I would shoot.

I bought some Triple 7 2f, and some Pyrodex P, and some goex 2f and goex 3f, so I'm ready to load anything. I have an uberti 3rd dragoon on layaway right now... I have a feeling this will be an expensive hobby !

I've seen the Venturino books at a local shop. I may pick up the buffalo guns book and his pistol book.

 

[6mmintl]

If looking for a BPCR or Creedmore rifle read below

WTS 40-72 (405 Win.) BPCR/Creedmoor Rifle

I have the following for sale, I had this built two years ago and shot it once, it can be down loaded for Sillouette, or uploaded for Creedmore shooting.

I am selling it due to heath reasons (Not financial), rifle is "as new" rebarreled with the best/latest methods/materials:

MVA Series 2000 Mildot Scope $985.00
Custom Stepped Rear Scope blocks $30.00
Lija 1 X 13” SSTL 30” matt .410 Barrel, DT reamer $600.00
500 pcs. (300 NEW) Hornady 405 Win Brass $440.00
1885 Browning BPCR Rifle, Orig 45-70 $1400.00
no Iron sights but Drilled&Tapped, dovetailed for front sight.
Redding sizing die set w/expander powder/wad seater $100.00
Buff Arms 40 Cal Wad Punch & mtl. $55.00
200 cast Bullets and 100 rds loaded ammo $60.00
Dewey Cleaning rod, boreguide, and jags $35.00
Blow Tube $5.00
2 sets (low/high) of Oak cross Sticks & Case $45.00
Oak Ammo Box $20.00
Paul Jones, Dan Theodore designed 40 cal 433gr.mold $180.00
Trigger reworked to 2 lbs $50.00
Aluminum gun case $75.00
Total value $4340

First $3000 plus $65.00 shipping/Insurance offer gets it

 

[Steve499]

I've got Lee Shaver's tang sights on two of my rifles. Lee is a long range muzzle loading rifle shooter, ( A good one, too) and knows what the proper requirements for a sight are. I need a tang sight since I can no longer use open sights as well as I'd like, and I'm quite happy with Lee's.

http://www.egunsmith.com/

Steve