Current state of the Union...

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I will not be bullied into accepting insanity just to be liked or thought well of.
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I will not be bullied into accepting and spouting anti-establishment vitriol just to be liked or thought well of.

I would always rather be right, than admired.
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There are many versions of "right", with each usually as smug as the next. The trick is to have persuasive arguments for ones choice and to be open to changing ones view.

To cut to the chase, the real challenge politically is to find a candidate who really represents us and has some prayer of getting elected.
 
I will not be bullied into accepting and spouting anti-establishment
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Good thing our founding fathers did not feel that way.
Anti-establishment is not anti Constitution, the establishment has changed, not my beliefs.
How can you change what you are afraid of even apposing?
 
I assume you mean your "anti-establishment" remark.
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No. The strawman is the setup to characterize me as "afraid". You know you violate good form when you try to make it personal and demeaning, veering into personalities instead of ideas.

All I tried to do is show how points of view can vary and that it doesn't fly to be too smug.
 
OP: Im with youthere, 18 years ago, I and some friends did a intensive study of "the state of the union" and came to the conclusion that CWII would happen in 20-30 years.

Now were down to 10-12. We as a group have lost touch for the most part, but we still get together once every 2 years to re-evaluate the situation, and have seen nothing to indicate that our government is going to fix itself, I dont know what the trigger will be, but there will be a trigger, and all informed patriots need to be ready for it.

To the negative posters. Eh, Nevermind, Ill just tune you out.

To all positive Posters: Do as many have done, Know 5-7 others in your area that are concerned, and armed, You may need them someday.

To the OP again, Using our own forces to disarm the citizens of this country would IMO be a trigger, and I think some of the congresscritters know this, It is much more likely that they will ban all firearms, and turn our neighbors into informants, we could only hope to have some emulate the Danes from WWII

To all: there is a good chronology of the Chinese revolution here: The parrelels are fairly obvious.

(History, Doomed, Ect)

Morcoth
 
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No. The strawman is the setup to characterize me as "afraid". You know you violate good form when you try to make it personal and demeaning, veering into personalities instead of ideas.

All I tried to do is show how points of view can vary and that it doesn't fly to be too smug
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Sir, it was YOU that made it personal and demeaning. I agreed with you about taking the high road, and against anarchy. YOU then labeled me as trying to bully folks into anti-establishment (as if that is so bad). I never said to be smug, just that I would rather be right than admired. Is that wrong? You would rather be wrong and liked?
 
Real gun I don't think anyone believes you are afraid. You just seek compromise. This is good. This was country was built on compromise and the one major time that it failed we went to war and killed off a good percentage of the population.

You can not have compromise unless you have fervent believers on both sides. The problem is right now most of our political representatives are so similar there are hardly two sides to any issue represented publicly any more.

Even the issue that got the repubs thrown out 'The War'; the dems have taken no substantial action on it. If you look at all the front runners for president and their view on an issue of say gun control there is little difference.

We will not decay into anarchy. Our society will not experience wholesale collapse (short of a nuclear war and that is still a maybe) but freedom will likely lose. We will move closer to a police state like China and China will move closer to us.

For those of us who love freedom and liberty we must fight this creeping incrementalism. Compromise on civil rights is actually just a smaller defeat. In the end we will likely lose but if we do not fight we will lose anyway.
 
Dr. Dickie and RealGun, stop right now. you are both entitled to your opinions, don't argue about them here.

As for not quitting, I haven't. In fact, in an effort to try and put a stop to stupidity and ignorance, I have decided to not answer stupid questions. As a result, a lot of people have been yelling at me, but I don't care.
 
DI,

Don't worry about being ordered to disrm the people of Vermont. They are a well-armed lot, and have enjoyed their freedom to carry for too long to be disarmed. They will shoot back, or give you the Lorcin .25 for your time. Disarming Vermonters is a non-starter.
Second. DO NOT GIVE UP! It's up to people like you to do the right thing every time, all the time. You are one of the people who can make a difference in this matter. Guardsmen have a duty to protect and defend the constitution, if given unlawful orders, it falls to you to make things right. We're behind you. (I might just be standing next to you)
 
DI, I miss VT....lived there for 5 years and think about moving back every single day.....NEK is great....spent some time ice climbing up at Lake Willoughby while I was up there.....beautiful country.....the biggest threat to Vt is the Latte Sipping Libs in Southern Vt.....good luck FINDING most Vermonters that don't want to be found let alone disarming them <lol>
 
It is not your guns they are after. Your holster is not the target, your wallet is. Those guns you will lose by default. The economy will defeat us. It is and has been a rigged game. I think we are already beaten, we just don't know it yet.

In 1929 a greenback dollar would buy one silver ounce, or twenty greenbacks would buy an ounce of gold. What is the story today. Hell, a one ounce Gold Eagle is now labeled as a 50 dollar gold coin. And it cost $703.45 in greenbacks to buy one today! Wonder what the Government will give you in greenbacks for that one ounce gold coin you have, when it is seized by the government? Maybe 50 of them? FDR did much the same thing back in depression days when he took us off the gold market. Inflation is the game that beats us down and no one is bitching enough about it.

Back in the 70's, I bought gasoline for 0.299 a gallon. Rent was 125 dollars on a two bedroom apartment. A good meal was well under 5 bucks and I ain't talking MickyD's.

Yeah, after the collapse, the Sheriff will show up to foreclose over past due taxes. I don't think he is going to let you move out with much, especially your guns. Homeless people with guns are kind of frowned upon.

Jerry
 
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Good thing the sheriff is in my unit then;)

Seriously though, don't worry guys. I'll never give up. I've heard about a movement to have Vermont seccede from the union. Right now it would never happen, but if there is an economic collapse... maybe I'll be meeting quite a few of you in the Republic of Vermont.
 
Vermont? No way; too cold for me. Besides if Vermont goes how far back is Texas anyway? It has been it's own country in the past. Several of the elected state reps have advocated leaving for many years now. One even flies a banner in his office. Texas also has it's own militia in case things get ugly....

Anyway I am sure Vermont and Texas would get along just fine as peaceful nations.
 
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Ours is a society in decline, and it gets worse every day. With each new
stunt the government/military/industry pulls, we lose more and more of
our money and our rights. Taxes up, wars that never end, education is
in the toilet, etc. We are becoming a nation of mindless and spineless
television drones. Pharmaceuticals, insurance, and illegal aliens are beginning
to affect middle America in ways never before thought possible. The lines
between the media and the government are increasingly blurred. It has
become a society of FEAR and BLAME.

Pathetic.

People who pretend that America is the America of yesterday are ridiculous.
This society can in no way be mistaken for decades past. Our founding
fathers would roll over in their graves if they were witness to this age's
crimes. Hangings from the nearest tree would go on for days. Makes me sick!

I'll be meeting quite a few of you in the Republic of Vermont
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I would be among the first citizens of that country were it to actually
happen.
 
The Drill Instructor said:
Personally, I took an oath to support our constitution; and if I’m ever ordered to disarm the people of my town as a Guardsman, I don’t think I could do it.
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Would you be okay with disarming the people of someone else’s town? What if your boss told you that some of them were members of a terrorist organization?

~G. Fink
 
Good thing the sheriff is in my unit then
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I hope it works for you. Here in Ohio, we had a sheriff for Warren County. He refused to foreclose on laid off blue collar workers. This got him all kinds of local praise. He even got elected to federal office. It appears he was not quite up to snuff. They finally got him. Convicted him, sent him to a federal prison and then expelled him from office. He used the term "Beam me up, Scotty!" a lot. Bet that rings a bell.

I hope I don't know my a$$ from a hole in the ground. But, things look pretty gloomy to me.

Jerry
 
Would you be okay with disarming the people of someone else’s town? What if your boss told you that some of them were members of a terrorist organization?
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Which is a great point Gordon. A sudden and complete collapse is unlikely. The road so far has been restrict and redefine (assault weapons anyone?).
Katrina in NO was an anomaly, the place was gone before the hurricane, all Katrina did was uncover it, not create it.
It is the slow slide on the slippery slope of PC rhetoric and demonization that will lead to us all being branded “gun nuts,” or disarmed. And perhaps at that point, it may be truely hard to tell what is the right thing to do.
Vigilance now can prevent a bad choice later.
 
Katrina in NO was an anomaly, the place was gone before the hurricane, all Katrina did was uncover it, not create it.
It is the slow slide on the slippery slope of PC rhetoric and demonization that will lead to us all being branded “gun nuts,” or disarmed. And perhaps at that point, it may be truely hard to tell what is the right thing to do.
Vigilance now can prevent a bad choice later.
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It is alledged that the worst offenders in NO were outside police who volunteered to go to NO. Not that the locals were choirboys.

Jerry
 
TDI,
I feel the exact same way you do. I was part of a JTF on the US/Mexico border in 2002. We were tasked with building a mile long anti-vehicular barrier. Every morning we arrived at the border and saw dozens of people heading North. All of us were active duty. We couldn't do anything. We watched as our country was invaded ever single day and were powerless to do anything. The border patrol agents didn't do anything either.

I swore an oath and don't remember that oath having an expiration date.
 
G. Fink-

When I say disarming the people of my town, I kinda meant that like the people of america. I don't think anyone could convince me that Joe-Bob Redneck is a terrorist, no matter what they claim he's a part of.
 
DI, know exactly how you feel. Watching one's country go down the drain is a heart-sickening business, and of course especially this country. I think of others in history who went through this, many others; never thought I'd live to see the day. Growing up in NW Montana during the 50's was a wonderful thing--geez, Montana was barely on the map back then! I try to keep up hope and spirits by occupying myself with building up the stash: food, water, gear, guns and ammo. My husband and I have been retreating from the insanity for about ten years now, couldn't stand it otherwise. Our own little piece of Idaho!
 
marie, thats exatly what I wish I could do! But the way things are going, by the time I'm old enough to start it the country will have already gone to hell.
 
And then, depression set in.

There's that bumpersticker. " When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns."

Would you be an outlaw?

Am I the only guy who doesn't get this? You lays your bets and you takes yor chances... there are no guarantees in life. What if they legalized weed and 16 year old girls. Ya, then guys like that could feel good about themselves again. Are you kidding? Snap to. It don't matter man. You play it by ear. You do what you got to.
 
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