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Detained for his choice in music!!

Discussion in 'Legal' started by mr_dove, Apr 6, 2006.

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  1. mr_dove

    mr_dove Member

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    This poor guy was detained and questioned because a taxi driver reported his Vietnam Era classic rock as "terrorist music". My gosh, did this crap happen during the vietnam war too?

    I wonder if this could happen in the US as well? (this happened in Britain)

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/li...rticle_id=382039&in_page_id=1770&in_a_source=

    A mobile phone salesman was hauled off a plane and questioned for three hours as a terror suspect - because he listened to songs by The Clash and Led Zeppelin.
    Harraj Mann, 24, played the punk anthem London Calling and classic rock track Immigrant Song in a taxi before a flight to London.

    The lyrics to both tracks made the driver fear his passenger was a terrorist.

    The words of the Clash track begin: "London calling to the faraway towns, now war is declared and battle come down." And Led Zep's Immigrant Song goes: "The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands, to fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!"

    Mr Mann, of Hartlepool, Teesside, had boarded the plane at Durham Tees Valley Airport when the flight to Heathrow was stopped and he was arrested by police.

    He said he was told he was being questioned under the Terrorism Act and his choice of music had aroused suspicions.

    Mr Mann said yesterday: 'The taxi had one of those tape deck things that plugs into your digital music player.

    "I played Procol Harum's Whiter Shade Of Pale first, which the taxi man liked. I figured he liked the classics so put on a bit of Led Zeppelin - Immigrant Song - which he didn't like. Then, since I was going to London, I played the song by The Clash and finished up with Nowhere Man by The Beatles."

    Mr Mann said he was 'frog-marched off the plane in front of everyone, had my bags searched and was asked 'every question you can think of'.

    He added: "It turned out the taxi driver alerted someone when I arrived at the airport and had spoken about my music. He didn't like Led Zep or The Clash but there was no need to tell the police."

    Durham Police said the action was taken 'as a result of information received' and the flight was stopped before take-off.
     
  2. Cosmoline

    Cosmoline Member

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    The UK, London in particular, is an Orwellian police state. There are cameras watching your every move and spies everywhere. The scary thing is a lot of "terrorism experts" point to London as an example of what the US must become in this latest "war."
     
  3. Autolycus

    Autolycus Member

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    Cosmoline: I hope your wrong and that we do not end up living in fear of imaginary terrorist boogeymen. It seems that the majority of people are willing to become complete sheeple.
     
  4. David W. Gay

    David W. Gay Member

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    When did people loose the rationallity to say "so what?", to idiotic "fears". Do people really think that a terrorist is going to telegraph his terroristic intentions via classic rock?

    It's kinda ironic that I heard War Pigs on the radio a couple of days ago. First time I've heard that song in years. And I'm pretty sure the police didn't rush to the the radio station and "detain" the DJ for questioning.

    Carry on your wayward son...
     
  5. the Juggernaut

    the Juggernaut member

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    I'm starting to think more and more that Alex Jones is right about the coming (or present?) police state.
     
  6. tellner

    tellner member

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    With the Cold War over how else can we keep the Huddled Masses scared and compliant? Those in power need the queers and the nebulous terrorists to ensure their grip on power. Pat Roberts (you can look this up on crooksandliars.com) came out with a good one recently "Dead people don't have civil liberties." The White House has just declared in its extra-constitutional "signing statements" that its power can not be fettered in any way by any law or act of Congress and that it has the right to interpret the law as it sees fit. John Yoo has declared that the government can "crush the testicles" of an innocent ten year old to get vital information.

    No checks. No balances. The President is above the Law. No act is too heinous as long as the POTUS orders it. Ave Ceasar!

    The DHS now has an office whose sole purpose is to funnel money to religious groups. The implications are terrifying. Either they expect some sort of Orwellian quid pro quo or it's an out and bribe - public money for spying or public money for special interest votes.

    Lyin' B. Johnson would have had a stroke. Nixon would have died of shame. Even Spiro Agnew would have scrupled at this.

    And all because of terrorism. Maybe the terrorists "hate our freedoms", but no amount of bombing or planes dropping out of the sky could destroy our liberty more thoroughly than we have allowed our own President and his neo-Con Cabal to do.

    Ah well. I'm just sorry I lived to see the day that we entered the Post-Constitutional era.
     
  7. dfaugh

    dfaugh Member

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    Good thing he didn't whip out the Sex Pistols singing "Anarchy in the UK"...Probably would've ended up in jail!
     
  8. stevelyn

    stevelyn Member

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    Hmmmm............As I sit here reading this, I'm listening to Queensryche's Anarchy and Revolution Calling.
    I wonder if that makes me a terror suspect in the eyes of the Limeys? :rolleyes:
     
  9. TarpleyG

    TarpleyG Member

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    I smell something fishy here...

    The lyrics in that song are REALLY hard to understand, especially if one were not a native English speaker (article doesn't state either way so I am speculating), so how did this driver think this was somehow terroristic? People are getting dumber everyday thanks to our "War on Terror."

    Greg
     
  10. SaintofKillers

    SaintofKillers Member

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    +10 Stevelyn

    Queensryche is such an underrated band.

    Gods forbid that the gummit ever finds out what I am listening to.

    Megadeth
    Black Sabbath
    Iron Maiden
    Motorhead
    Rollins Band
    and the list goes on and on.
     
  11. real_name

    real_name member

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    He was detained because he was a Muslim and listening to those songs. Check his first name again.
    I concur that the UK has a lot of surveilance cameras, both visible and hidden cameras are everywhere. I've read that the average 5 min walk along a London street enables you to appear on 30 cameras. Very useful when you think how quickly British Police had a detailed background to the July 7th bombers and how disaster was averted on the attacks in the weeks following.

    I agree how here in the USA it's seen that it detracts from the civil liberties of the people there but I find that for those that actually live in the UK and/or London do more than just accept the cameras, they welcome how they have turned a lot of undesirable neighborhoods into safer areas again.
    In Bow (East London), a notoriously violent, drug economy part of town there are now cameras on the housing estates (projects) that are linked to channels on cable TV, the elderly people in the area monitor these channels from their homes and can call in to a non-emergency Police number if they see violent crime or robbery.

    I can appreciate how this is 'spying' to some here but in my mind it isn't, the East of London was traditionally a very tight knit community not too many decades ago, now with all the social change and migration the social fabric has gone and so crime took over. The cameras are a way to redress the balance. In the 1940's kids wouldn't mug old women because 'everyone was watching and everyone would find out', what is happening now is the same principal.
    I am English, I have lived in East London.

    I am not saying that the USA needs these methods everywhere, small town USA can probably say it's sense of community is still strong enough to continue without assistance, but in some of the larger urban areas I think the cameras are coming (already arrived in some cases) and will just have to be accepted.
    Instead of perceiving the camera as watching you and infringing your rights, it is watching your back.


    I think the taxi driver was still shaken by the July 7th bombs and was being vigilant, no harm done. I don't think he was 'spying' as has been said of the British in a previous post. There's a large difference between watching your back and and 'spying'. He was IMO just watching his, and others back.
     
  12. Augustwest

    Augustwest Member

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    ?!?!?!?!? :banghead:

    A guy was forcibly detained and missed his flight because he likes Joe Strummer's and Jimmy Page's guitar playing. Plenty of harm in that.
     
  13. real_name

    real_name member

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    No harm done.
    Until you have lived in London its hard to put all this in context. To you in your environment it would be a gross infringment of liberty, whereas there (especially after the July 7th attacks) it is less so. I'm sure he was annoyed but he won't litigate. That is the difference.
    So, no harm done. We all get there in the end and if we allow ourselves to get too annoyed by life and it's hurdles we will get 'there' a lot faster due to a heart attack.
    I realise I am probably in a minority of one but remember I am English living in the USA and due to take my citizenship oath in two weeks, this gives me a unique perspective on this and similar issues.
    I don't want Americans to lose any rights. I do however see the benefits in being vigilant in this age of imported terrorism.
    BTW, I grew up in the era of IRA bombings in England. People used to get arrested for 'being Irish' when I was a kid. Now it's the Muslims who are targeted by the overly cautious.
    The taxi driver made an incorrect assumption but what if he had seen the signs and chosen to ignore them as he didn't want to infringe someones liberty? And then the guy proceeded onto the plane and blew it up?
    We all just need to look out for one another and realise that life is complicated enough without getting stressed out so much if we get inconvenienced because we fit a profile.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2006
  14. Master Blaster

    Master Blaster Member

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    Right you are!!! those cameras are so good that they helped the police in London spot a suspicious person of interest wearing an inappropriate coat entering an appartment Council Block.

    They were later able to follow him when he emerged from his apartment building, hold him down in the subway and shoot him in the head. Only one problem he was an innocent electrician. I'm still waiting to hear that the PO PO were brought up on charges of murder for murdering in cold blood with premeditation a person
    whom the cameras had identified as a potential terrorist.

    Well at least this music lover wasn't tackled and shot in the head for listening to led Zepplin, but hey maybe next week the next person wont be so lucky.:barf:
     
  15. TheEgg

    TheEgg Member

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    Real_name, I invite you to read and think on the following:

    BENJAMIN FRANKLIN, Pennsylvania Assembly: Reply to the Governor, November 11, 1755.
     
  16. HankB

    HankB Member

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    If they're to call a NON-emergency number when they see a violent crime in progress, how serious does it have to be for them to dial the "emergency" number? :confused:
     
  17. David W. Gay

    David W. Gay Member

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    "No harm done"

    To give such a statement in response to the events described in the article, one must have no concept of Liberty. Nothing more can be said.
     
  18. real_name

    real_name member

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    Ok, I'm going to bale on this one as it's quickly degenerating into purely personal attacks on me.
    Carry on assuming you know what it's like in England because you've read about it somewhere.
    I am aware of the quote you offered, I live in America and to gain citizenship I have had to learn more about civics than most Americans.
    People have different opinions, I believe that if I was taken off a plane as a security risk I would be glad that someone was doing that job, even if they were wrong that time. But the difference is I grew up with imported terrorism and here in the USA it's a relatively new situation. It is possible that UK style surveilance will be the norm here in 10 years.
    And if you aren't actively breaking laws that doesn't harm you, excluding occasional inconveniences.
    Anyway, I should drop it. There's enough animosity towards 'limeys' here without me adding to your prejudicial stereotypes by speaking out for what we perceive as common sense.
    I've moved on, it's all yours to discuss now.
     
  19. Sergeant Bob

    Sergeant Bob Member

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    I think I know all I need to know.
     
  20. Zundfolge

    Zundfolge Member

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    $10 says this guy didn't tip well so the cabbie decided to stick it to him by calling in the bobbies.

    :scrutiny:


    Actually his first name looks Hindu to me. So he was a "darky" listening to those songs (which to me would be a sign that he's completely assimilated into the dominant culture, but what do I know).

    yeah, thats so much better. :rolleyes:
     
  21. migoi

    migoi Member

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    Airplane security story....

    In 1998, we were living in Puerto Rico and I had to fly to Virginia for some business. On the flight back when I changed planes in Miami there was some type of delay in our ability to board.

    By the time we were boarding emotions were a bit stretched due to the delay and the lines. The fellow in front of me seemed to be in a particularly bad mood because he simply grunted at the boarding gate lady's attempts at greeting. When she finished with his boarding pass he snatched in from her hand and harumphed down the jetway.

    When I arrived, not in that bad a mood, I offered to rush up and trip the jerk before he boarded the plane. She declined the offer and laughed it off. I went onto the plane and was starting to settle into my seat just before takeoff when a stewardess approached me. "Are you Mr. Migoi?", she asked. I didn't really like the sound of that but figuring the question was simply a confirmation of information she already knew I confirmed my identity.

    She then stated. "Gather your personal belongings and come with me please." At this point I figure I'm in for a missed flight and a couple hourse in a small room with dark suited goons grilling me on why I threatened a fellow passenger.

    Luckily the stewardess was simply moving me up to first class. When I inquired as to the reason... "The gate asked us to upgrade your seat."

    Sometimes crime (idle terroristic theat to other passenger) does pay.

    migoi
     
  22. seeker_two

    seeker_two Member

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    I wonder if the bobbies are taking photographs, fingerprints, & DNA at the theaters showing V FOR VENDETTA??? :scrutiny:
     
  23. one-shot-one

    one-shot-one Member

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    REAL NAME SAID

    "Instead of perceiving the camera as watching you and infringing your rights, it is watching your back."

    Now I am not attacking you but the problem with that statement is that any "help" you get from that camera will most likely be post mortem! That is they may catch your attackers because they have them on camera but you will have already suffered whatever they intended to perpetrate on you.;)
     
  24. JohnBT

    JohnBT Member

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    And Led Zep's Immigrant Song goes: "The hammer of the gods will drive our ships to new lands, to fight the horde, singing and crying: Valhalla, I am coming!"

    I bought that album when it came out and still have it and I never knew what they were saying. THANK YOU.

    John
     
  25. Manedwolf

    Manedwolf member

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    Please do America a favor. Read all of the Federalist Papers. Read all the documents that we've fought for. And revise your opinion, or please tear up the papers and cancel your oath-taking appointment right now. You've not yet learned what it's all about.

    I'm sorry, but saying "no harm done" regarding this sort of thing is NOT what America is.
     
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