Draw First, Ask Questions Later

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SkyGuy

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"Three people found officer Jensen unconscious with handcuffs in his right hand near a bus stop on Costilla Street just west of Hancock Avenue. It appeared he was shot in the head.

Police received a tip about 10 a.m. Wednesday that Lamberth would be in the area of Costilla Street and Hancock Avenue. Lamberth has been wanted since Feb. 2, when he allegedly stabbed his sister more than a dozen times.

Jensen, an officer with the Metro Vice, Narcotics and Intelligence Unit, was in an unmarked car, wearing jeans and a sweat shirt.

He radioed dispatch at 10:40 a.m. that he had spotted the fugitive near a bus stop, police said.

Backup officers arrived after the shooting, Police Chief Luis Velez said. It's at the officer's discretion whether to wait for backup, he said.

Within four minutes of officer Jensen's radio call, dispatchers got calls about a shooting in the area, Velez said. Officer Jensen didn't return fire, Velez said, and apparently didn't have time to pull his gun."

So, I say draw first, ask questions later!

**************

Edited for content. This could be a good discussion if it's allowed to be.
If not, it'll get another padlock.

Gentlemen...Go to your corners and wait for the bell!

Cheers!

The Tunerfish
 
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Well since I'm not a cop a discussion on whether to attempt to apprehend a suspect without backup doesn't interest me.

Sky, why do you think this is High Road material exactly?

Doesn't appear to be much non-LEOs can learn from or add to this.
 
The unedited version refered to mind set. If you pull your weapon what mind set do you or should you have? With that in mind I think anyone with a ccw can relate. If you pull your weapon what are your intentions at that point? Do you intend to shoot? Did you pull your weapon with the intentions of showing serious intent and hoping the BG wil get the message?

This is a question everyone has asked themselves at one time or another, no matter if they have ever had to pull their weapon or not. I for one think you should anticipate certain senarios and have your mind made up prior to the incident happening. It is not as hard as you might think. The real issue is having your weapon on the BG before he has it on you, and of course if it is a shooting incident pulling the trigger with the hope you will stop the BG from pulling his. You have heard the statement "it is a game of inches" well this is the ultimate game. Little things add up, any indecision you can eliminate will increase your odds. We have had several sighted vs unsighted discussions on this site. Bottom line is, if you can anticipate and minimize decisions, and movements you have increased your odds.
Jim
 
Based on the NYPD's SOP 9 stucy of some 4000+ police combat cases:

65% of the officers who had knowledge of impending danger, had their revolvers drawn and ready.

This is proper tactically for several reasons, the first being that holsters which are designed with the proper element of security in mind, do not lend themselves to quick draw. The old bromide, "Don't draw your gun and point it at anyone unless you intend to shoot" is a tactical blunder.

Situations in which rapid escalation occurred, were most often activities considered routine, such as car stops, guarding, transporting or fingerprinting prisoners or handling people with mental problems.

Family disputes did not prove to be high on the police danger list. Sniper and ambush incidents represented less than 1% of the cases reported.

Reports on incidents involving police death revealed that the officer was alone more often than not and that he was confronted by at least two people.

..........

Anyone know of data that updates or is different from the above?? Link??
 
Draw!

Points:

Police officers aren't the only people who find themselves thrust suddenly into a killing situation, so this can apply to all of us who keep and bear.

The fastest draw is having the gun in hand before the trouble starts. Often
that alone causes a cessation to hostilities. Even most nominees for the Darwin Award are smart enough to know that they probably can't beat the drop.

If you wait until it's time to shoot to go for your gun, it could well be the last thing that you ever do...unless you're in the same league as Bill Jordan or Jelly Bryce.

Carry on!
 
When I took my CCW class, our instructor told us to have our gun in hand, if in a dark parking lot late at night. Especially if something didn't feel right. Don't go waving it around, just keep it at your side. Some states this could be brandishing, but it seems fine in others. So far I have never found myself in the position where I thought it necessary. Hopefully never will.
 
Gunner, you have brought up some interesting points. Some members here I am sure do not agree with having your weapon out.:what: I have mixed emotions about that but have to say I've done worse. What your instructor was doing though I totaly agree with. One be in a heightened state of awareness, having your gun out will certainly help with that. Two was to trust your instincts. Who knows why you sometimes feel that something is not right. Being prepared because of that feeling costs you nothing. I never dismiss an instictive feeling it truely can save your life.
Jim
 
Comment deleted

Sky...I didn't vote to reopen the thread so that you could continue to bait your fellow High Roaders. One more time and it's gone for good.

Regards

Tuner
 
Not hard to argue at all.
1911Tuner's first reaction was correct.
Should have been closed.
 
First Response

This is a valid discussion that would give us all something to think about before that dreaded moment of truth falls on us, and that's why it was reopened. Discussions like this provide different perspectives and encourages
logical choices.

Please...Let's stick to the pros/cons and point/counterpoints...and leave the
personal conflicts on the sidelines.

Cheers!
 
On the few occasions I have felt I might have to shoot someone I have had my firearm in hand, either at the low ready or as inconspicuous as possible behind a leg. This includes long guns.

On one or two of those occasions I may have been pointing that firearm directly at someone, through a one way mirror, but those were special circumstances.

Usually when the threat in question sees the firearm in your hands the threat leaves the area rapidly and does not come back.

Just my two cents.:)
 
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