DUI w/ Gun

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I NEVER drink if I'm going to be in possession of a loaded firearm in public, regardless of whether it's on my person or in my vehicle.

+1 i stopped going to bars a long time ago due to money and concerns for driving and getting nailed for only drinking 2 beers. It's just not worth it, and the CCW is the last thing on my mind. In AZ, mandatory 10 days in tent city for 1st offense. It can go to 180 days if the Judge wants.

With regards to my firearms, nothing is so important EXCEPT my family to jeapordize my rights.

I am not looking for an AA meeting, just information. Thanks.

Then why did you ask in the first place? Sorry you didn't get the information you WANTED, but you did get some great information that may be good in the future.
 
I'm aware of no law making it illegal to operate a motor vehicle with a BAC UNDER the legal limit.

Some states do have a lower level, driving while impaired, statute. Having a BAC less than .08 and doing something that makes a cop want to stop and check your BAC, is pretty much enough to qualify for it.
 
790.151 Using firearm while under the influence of alcoholic beverages, chemical substances, or controlled substances; penalties.--

(1) As used in ss. 790.151-790.157, to "use a firearm" means to discharge a firearm or to have a firearm readily accessible for immediate discharge.

(2) For the purposes of this section, "readily accessible for immediate discharge" means loaded and in a person's hand.

(3) It is unlawful and punishable as provided in subsection (4) for any person who is under the influence of alcoholic beverages, any chemical substance set forth in s. 877.111, or any substance controlled under chapter 893, when affected to the extent that his or her normal faculties are impaired, to use a firearm in this state.

(4) Any person who violates subsection (3) commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.

(5) This section does not apply to persons exercising lawful self-defense or defense of one's property
Interpitate it for yourself. Since you will be the one doing it, you will be the one trying to explane it to the law officer. Everybody will read it differently and come to a different idea on whats what.
 
Drunk driving is an illegal act. It is no different than saying "If I were to go out and shoot some people...?"

We don't discuss illegal acts here. At least we didn't use to....
 
Just for example, in Utah, you can drive under the legal limit, but if you are in an accident, you will be cited for DUI anyway. Happened to my neighbor, she had opened a beer, drank less than half of it, her husband called to tell her he had broken down and needed a ride, she went to get him and was in a minor accident. She admitted to the cop she had been drinking, and BAC wasn't relevant. At fault, DUI. Lost custody of her kids to her ex. THINK REALLY HARD.

To answer the question, I have to imagine keeping it in the trunk should protect you from a carrying while drunk charge, but it won't keep you from losing your permit anyway from a DUI charge.

Uncomplicate life. Eliminate the grey area. Grab a six pack on the way home, wait til you get there.
 
I am not looking for an AA meeting, just information.

Then start here http://www.leg.state.fl.us/STATUTES/ instead of posting on a public forum. Happy McDogooders are everywhere to judge first and provide information last. Don't forget that their personal opinion and condemnation of your behavior/proposal/question will be interpreted as providing valuable information.

.08 is .08.....nobody can handle .08 better than anyone else...

Really? That is odd. I have an Asian friend who is the same size as me who falls down drunk puking after a single beer. Makes a complete red-faced jerk of himself. So, would you like to put that flawed opinion to a fact check? Bring me two beers, it will take less than 10 minutes to show you how wrong that opinion is.

Everyone handles and processes alcohol differently, the fact that you admit that one can ACT more sober than another discredits your entire argument. Acting, in and of itself, is a summation of an individuals abilities (both physical and congitive) to function a certain way. Therefore, logically, their "functionality" maybe better, in the area of "acting", than another person of equal intoxication. All drugs affect different people in different ways.

However, I do think you should try that one again, you almost had a good point at the end when you talk about your soldering skill, i.e. the ability to perform routine tasks while imparied based on skill level and practice. You have an excellent point to make there, which will, unfortunately, prove that everyone does indeed handle alcohol differently. Which is relevant to the OP if he is trying to act his way out of a ticket.
 
Happy McDogooders are everywhere to judge first and provide information last. Don't forget that their personal opinion and condemnation of your behavior/proposal/question will be interpreted as providing valuable information.

You have just summed up exactly what I've wanted to type many times...and worded it perfectly. Bravo! I might have to steal your "Happy McDogooders" name. I love it.
 
To advise on the real question of the OP, if you're ever in doubt of what is considered armed for the purpose of operating a vehicle under questionable circumstances (regardless of why) it might be wise to disarm.

In California you cannot transport a loaded weapon, and cannot transport an unloaded weapon that is not secured. It must be in a locked container that is not your glove box. You can lock it in your trunk, but you have to lock it and it must be unloaded. If those stipulations are met you can go totally Mel Gibson on an officer that pulls you over - and he can't charge you for anything regarding the weapon.

The best advice is please be responsible whatever you do. Don't forget that us gun owners don't need any negative publicity.

-MW
 
It's not illegal to be drunk while armed in Florida. We even have a self-defense-while-drunk provision in ch 790. I don't think that there is an enhancement for dui while armed. I suppose there would be problems if you ended up being charged with a felony while in possession but
I think glove box isn't considered possession in a case like this.
 
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Its not illegal to carry in Oregon while drinking either, we can even carry in bars. However our chl is provisional based on the opinion of the county sheriff. I'm sure if you were found drinking and driving or just smashed drunk walking around town and an leo saw that you had a ccw there is a pretty good chance word may get back to the sheriff and he/she would decide that you don't have the right to carry any more.
 
It is likely a state law issues and thus you need to research state statutes and cases but I know of a supreme court case Muscarello v US in which the Court ruled that "to carry a gun" included in a gun in a locked glove box or even in the trunk.
 
To answer the question in regards to FLORIDA law. Having the firearm within your vehicle secured in a case, holster or glovebox and not readily accessible is perfectly legal w/o a permit. Having the permit in this case, as you have said it is secured in the glovebox is irrelevent. There is no enhanced penalty for the DUI for merely having the firearm.

Now here is where it can get interesting. Let's say you get your first dui and are convicted. You can retain your permit to carry. Second conviction? Lose your permit to carry and indeed your right to own because now you are a felon. 3rd time stopped and popped then you have a problem because now you are a felon in possession of a firearm.

FLORIDA does not have a duty to inform that you are carrying. That topic has been discussed ad nauseum elsewhere but I firmly believe that if any of your actions are going to place your hand anywhere near that weapon, you better tell the officer. Don't take a chance that your guy/gal is the fearful one who pumps you full of holes.

DISCLAIMER I am not an attorney. This is my personal opinion after having carefully read the pertinent statutes. Want to learn more in layman's terms? Check out http://www.floridafirearmslaw.com/p/Florida-Firearms-Law-Use-Ownership-Book.html.
 
In Florida the cops seem have some leeway but it may vary from county to county. In Lee and Collier counties people I know were carrying when stopped (and charged) with DUI and neither had a bad time getting their gun back a day or two later. There was no increase in the ramifications due to CCW (bad enough). Both were first timers so that may have something to do with it. Gun in latched glove box or "securely encased" as per State law should be a non-issue assuming no other firearms related restrictions on the driver or passangers. Best advise is to not be drinking and have to drive home. A Lawyer acquaintance says caculate how much alcohol will give .04% and stay under that. Collier Deputy says any alcohol what ever can result in DUI charge if suspect fails "field sobriety" test. How good are you at standing on one leg even with no alcohol?
 
I know you don't seem to want to hear this again but Im gonna say it anyway...

cars and guns = no problem
alcohol and guns = not worth the risk
alcohol and cars = not worth the risk
alcohol and guns and cars = the recipe for major legal problems


It's really pretty simple, and I am pretty sure it is the same in every State.
 
To answer the question in regards to FLORIDA law. Having the firearm within your vehicle secured in a case, holster or glovebox and not readily accessible is perfectly legal w/o a permit. Having the permit in this case, as you have said it is secured in the glovebox is irrelevent. There is no enhanced penalty for the DUI for merely having the firearm.

Now here is where it can get interesting. Let's say you get your first dui and are convicted. You can retain your permit to carry. Second conviction? Lose your permit to carry and indeed your right to own because now you are a felon. 3rd time stopped and popped then you have a problem because now you are a felon in possession of a firearm.

FLORIDA does not have a duty to inform that you are carrying. That topic has been discussed ad nauseum elsewhere but I firmly believe that if any of your actions are going to place your hand anywhere near that weapon, you better tell the officer. Don't take a chance that your guy/gal is the fearful one who pumps you full of holes.

DISCLAIMER I am not an attorney. This is my personal opinion after having carefully read the pertinent statutes. Want to learn more in layman's terms? Check out http://www.floridafirearmslaw.com/p/Florida-Firearms-Law-Use-Ownership-Book.html.
Actually, it's not until 4th offense that it becomes a felony - for a standard DUI, no bodily injury or property damage.
But if you have a CWFL, You'll lose it after the 2nd conviction - within 3 years.
 
Not trying to ruin your day but .08 refers to the percentage of alcohol in your system. It has nothing to do with your "build". The fact that you don't realize that is a little disturbing. And whether you choose to believe it or not, .08 will and effect you.
 
To play Devil's advocate ... the measurement of B.A.C. by breathalyzer is notoriously inaccurate, and even a blood test with 100% accuracy wouldn't measure impairment, which is what really matters. The measurement method of "only a drink or two" is, of course, total crap ... it doesn't account for your initial condition, whether you are drinking on an empty stomach or if you just had a big meal, or your general state of impairment in the first place (that's a polite way of saying you might be an idiot driver before drinking).
Now, I have no sympathy for people who; drive, operate complex machinery, go shooting/hunting, or otherwise endanger the public while impaired (and yes, that includes applying makeup, popping zits, reading a map, jabbering away on the phone, or txt msg 2 ur bff jill, jkas), and very little faith in someone's ability to determine their own impairment. So questions about how to handle "stopping for a drink or two and hitting the road" will be met with skepticism every time, because finding someone who admits to being a lousy driver is about as common as finding someone at the gun shop who claims to be a lousy shot.

As I said above, if you NEED a drink to have a good time, seek help. Otherwise, the answer is fairly obvious,
 
For someone my build a .08 is not even enough to consider a buzz let alone drunk. I am not trying to get toasted and I am extremely responsible. I am not looking for an AA meeting, just information. Thanks.

Blood alcohol level is based on percentage of alcohol in your system, and is not altered by your "build". It takes more alcohol for you to get to .08 because you have more blood diluting it. How fast you metabolize alcohol may be effected by build, metabolic rate, and liver function, so you may lose intoxication faster. The BAC is however still based on the percentage of alcohol in your blood, and .08 percent is .08 percent.
So just as much of the drug is effecting your brain through your circulatory system when you have .08 BAC as when a tiny person has a .08 BAC.

I'm aware of no law making it illegal to operate a motor vehicle with a BAC UNDER the legal limit.

In many states you can be found guilty of DUI even when below .08 at the discretion of the officer. They are often separate offenses. Driving above the legal limit, and driving while impaired.
I know sober people that cannot pass some of the impairment tests, and as a result if they have had any alcohol to drink, even just a sip and are not under the effects of alcohol at all would still be found impaired by an officer and guilty of DUI.
A pass and fail is also somewhat discretionary. If the officer feels you are intoxicated and you are at .01 it is still DUI. Counties and cities make tons of money from DUIs. A DUI costs many thousands of dollars, and most places are having serious financial problems right now. So there is a lot of pressure and incentive beyond just safety concerns to charge with a DUI even below .08 BAC.


I personally make good decisions intoxicated, little different than sober, but I know many who do not. In fact I actually tend to have a bit more patience intoxicated.
Yet many who make horrible decisions intoxicated also would think they are not that different, so people are generally a poor judge of themselves.
However regardless of how good a decision maker you are while intoxicated your response time is reduced by a central nervous depressant. Meaning it takes you a split second longer to react, and thus making you more dangerous driving a vehicle.
Motor skills are also impaired even if at undetectable levels during normal anticipated movement.
That kid who runs out in the street, or car that pulls out in front of you may result in injury or death because it took you .5 seconds longer to react. It does not matter that they are at fault or did something unexpected or wrong. Your longer reaction time is what insured thier mistake resulted in much more serious consequences.
You may also over correct and flip your vehicle or hit something else due to excessive reaction increased through intoxication.
You could make the right decisions (except driving to begin with) but still put other people at extra risk because you will make those 'right decisions' a split second later.

Now most of that is not in play while simply carrying a firearm, the decision making process is primarily important. Reaction time, coordination etc is less important while it is not in use or being handled. Yet because so many people have a level of reduced judgment while intoxicated, easily over half of the population, the population in general is uncomfortable with intoxicated people having a firearm. There is certainly a high percentage of men that would be more inclined to hurt someone over an argument while intoxicated, or escalate a situation through bravado. Ironically such bravado seems even more widespread in the South where firearm culture is greatest. Where a larger portion of the population feels it is culturally acceptable or expected to assault or attack someone over perceived insults to honor. Or at least not de-escalate situations.
So some of the areas with the greatest firearm rights are likely to have the least acceptance for someone intoxicated having a firearm.

With firearms rights also strongest in very religious sections of the nation, that certainly further demonizes it among the firearm rights supporters of society. There is a large section of the nation where simply having been intoxicated when something happens results in the assumption of guilt because intoxication itself is evil and leads to evil.
So a major portion of society most inclined to support firearm rights is much less likely to view alcohol in a positive light. I certainly wouldn't want to defend myself while intoxicated in Utah for example. If it was not an absolutely clear cut case you would likely be behind bars for a long time.

There is a lot to consider when you choose to drink.
 
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I live in a dry county, so you not only would be charged with carrying a gun in a vehicle without a permit(which is void the minute you take the drink) but DUI, operating a vehicle while "under the influence" AND VPL(Violation of Prohibition Law).
 
Why is this even a question? With our gun rights hanging in the balance, how can somebody sit here and offer advice on how to push the limits of responsible gun handling, much less how can somebody even bother asking how they can get away with drinking and carrying? *** happened to common sense?
 
I was on a jury involving a DWI and firearm possesion. The man got the reduced DWAI (driving with ability impared) but not the gun charge. His 2nd Amendment rights don't end because he had beer in his car and happened to have a gun under his seat.
 
zoogster said:
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I'm aware of no law making it illegal to operate a motor vehicle with a BAC UNDER the legal limit.
In many states you can be found guilty of DUI even when below .08 at the discretion of the officer. They are often separate offenses. Driving above the legal limit, and driving while impaired.

That's the case in NC. Two separate things. It is against the law to drive with a BAC over .08%, and a police officer can charge you with DWI based on his observations of your condition and actions, including erratic driving, slurred speech, eye test thingy, field sobriety test, etc. even with a BAC under .08, and it holds up in court just as well as an intoxilyzer result.

I, for one, wish the law in NC allowed concealed carry with a <.04% BAC (like jfh says Minnesota allows). But NC law says 0% for concealed carry, so I obey the law. I never drink and drive, because luckily, I've got a wife that is happy to pass on the spirits and be the DD if we go out and I imbibe. So... Choose your woman wisely, and then treat her well. :D

Les
 
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