Educate Me: AR15/AK47/SKS

[Wolfpackin]

I own two handguns, in .40 S&W and .38 Spcl., and one shotgun but I know almost nothing about rifles.
I'm interested in getting an "assault weapon" (sorry, I hate that term too) mainly for fun and plinking but also as a reliable high powered SHTF/Zombie situation weapon. I know there are better choices for plinking but I really want something useful for the worst case combat scenerio. And they're cool, of course!

What are the main differences between the AR15, AK47 and SKS?
It seems as though at least the AR and AK can be chambered in 7.62X39 or .223 Rem. What is the difference between the two rounds? (bullet weight, size and velocity)
Are they treated equally as far as AWB's?
Any input on the really, really cheap Russian, Romainian and Yugo. models of AK?

Thanks!

 

[roscoe]

Wow - a lot of ground to cover.

AR15 - civilian version of M16. Accurate, ergonomic, easy to shoot, can be less reliable under some circumstances, shoots the .223 round and effective out to 400 yards, or more. Many manufacturers and range from ~$700-$1500. Also, many after-market widgets available.

AK - you probably have read all about it - durable, reliable, somewhat less ergonomic than the AR15. Available in a variety of calibers. Accuracy varies, partially due to the relatively primitive iron sights. Many manufacturers, and several calibers, but typically in 7.62x39, which is considered to be limited in range to 300 meters, but a more powerful round than the .223. Accuracy varies a fair bit, but they can be accurate if you know what to look for. $300-$800

SKS - a more traditional looking rifle, and has a fixed 10-round magazine. Several versions from several countries, all of which shoot the 7.62x39 round. All are very reliable, durable, and reasonably accurate. $125-$350. The Yugoslavians with grenade launchers are a bit heavier, the Chinese are the most compact. In California, the SKS is the only way to go of the three, although other semi-autos are available that pass their AWB

It very much depends on what you want from the rifle, and how much you want to spend. You will have MANY replies offering advice, but it often comes down to price, and if you are careful, you can get a terrific rifle for a reasonable amount of money.

All of these rifles have been discussed at great length here at THR and all are good rifles, so you should not go too far astray if you read some of the old threads.

I have a Chinese SKS with a Tech-Sight installed, and it is a terrific rifle, and very capable, from hunting to SHTF. I also have a .223 AK47 variant known as the Saiga, and it is also terrific. They were both under $250 each. My brother has a tricked-out AR15 that he has spent over $2000 on, and he loves it as well, so there you go.

I wanted one each of the .223 (5.56x45) and 7.26x39. The .223 is a lighter, faster round that is easier to shoot at longer distance, but some argue that it is less effective at stopping threats due to its small size. The 7.62x39 is bigger, but slower, so it is harder to shoot at distance, but makes a bigger hole when it hits. Either is plenty effective, in my opinion, since they are standard military calibers, and they are both pretty cheap to shoot. The .223 gives less recoil, but both are easy to shoot.

Go to the range and rent/borrow several of each. Have fun!!

 

[busy_squirrel]

You can also get some AK style weapons in .308Win (7.62x51).

 

[RockyMtnTactical]

AR15 - Modular, accurate, popular, ergonomic, light recoil (relatively), easy to scope, reliable, fun to build, etc... Downside is they are more pricey and super addictive...

AK - fun blaster, durable, venerable rifle for less money than an AR. Ammo is cheaper too. A bit more reliable than the AR. Downsides are, hard to scope, lousy ergonomics, sub-par accuarcy...

SKS - The best bang for the buck in combat rifles. 10 round fixed mags and stripper clips are what most people dislike about them, but you can reload stripper clips extremely fast with a little practice. Better long range than the AK, not quite as good at short ranges (in general), because of the barrel length, short mag (for prone shooting), and lack of pistol grip.

I own all three, but I own 4 AR's and only one of each of the other two. Guess which one I like best?

 

[No_Brakes23]

Roscoe and Rocky both covered it pretty well.

If you want an EBR, (Evil Black Rifle,) the SKS will be less satisfying in that reguard, but it is still a quality economical rifle worth purchasing.

The AK is extremely rugged, and I have seen Saigas shoot sub-MOA, (But they are bo no means to be considered sub-MOA rifles.) I have personally kept to 3MOA out to 300 yards shooting an already hot rifle from the low-kneeling, firing as quick as I could regain sight picture. That's 20-30 rounds in 9" @ 300 yards or a pie-plate, or Minute of Bad Guy. Not as accurate as the AR CAN be, but from a practical, functional standpoint, that is not bad at all. The WASRs, Maadis and MAK-90s might not do that, but the Saiga sure can, and I hear good thigns about Arsenal AKs as well.

The AR is what I am most familiar with, and certainly the most modular. You can get downright silly with the Tact-i-cool stuff you can throw on it.



Obviously, if you could afford it, I would suggest at least one of each.

 

[ConfuseUs]

What are the main differences between the AR15, AK47 and SKS?

The most significant difference is money! The AR is most expensive and the SKS is cheapest. If you want something that takes big magazines of ammo the AR or AK are the way to go. SKS hi-cap mags are a retrofit and a lot of them don't work that well.
The AR has the best open sights and is the easiest to mount optics on. (as well as every conceivable accessory).
AR magazines are nowhere near as durable as AK magazines, nor are they as cheap.
The AR is hardest to strip and clean, the AK is easiest.
The AR is easy to build, an AK is challenging to build, why build an SKS?

It seems as though at least the AR and AK can be chambered in 7.62X39 or .223 Rem. What is the difference between the two rounds? (bullet weight, size and velocity)

The 7.62x39 has a 122-150 grn bullet and .223 usually has a 55-62 grn bullet. The 7.62 rd is more powerful.

Are they treated equally as far as AWB's?

Yep, or practically so. Get while the getting's good. Move out of Denver if you live there.

Any input on the really, really cheap Russian, Romainian and Yugo. models of AK?

THere are no cheap Russian AKs in the US. If there are any they are all hideously overpriced collectors items. THe same applies to Russian SKS rifles. I have an el cheapo Romanian WASR-10 and it works fine. It is not as well made as my AR-15, but I trust it a lot more. (Carefully inspect a Romanian AK prior to purchase!). Yugo SKS rifles are very well made; I assume that a Yugo AK is well-made too. The Yugo AK will cost you about $100-200 more than a Romanian one. One last note on the AK: if you must have a folding stock, go with a side folder. The underfolder stock is not as strong and I hear it's uncomfortable too. Whatever you get is going to be fun.

 

[rkh]

I suggest you go with a quality AR.

You'll never get bored with a rifle that shoots better than you do, and most off-the-shelf ARs can hold 2 MOA or better. Few AKs or SKSs approach that degree of accuracy.


If you're interested in reloading, check out some of the unusual AR chamberings. 6.8 SPC and 6.5 Grendel are ballistically interesting, and are probably superior zombat cartridges. I would consider buying one if only I weren't married to the .223.

 

[Wolfpackin]

Thanks to all for the responses, a lot of my questions have been answered. I knew I was asking a lot and you guys came through, especially roscoe.
Some of you have stated that the SKS has a fixed magazine. However, I have seen a few Norinco SKS's that have detachable 30 rd. mags. For example the paratrooper version. Any reason why I should avoid that one and what is a stripper clip? BTW, I know I am looking at very low end but that's OK for my needs as long as it works most of the time. I just want something to add another dimension to my range visits...and of course something for the zombie attack.

Thanks again!

 

[Hokkmike]

These categories are all very subjective, and - of course, my opinion. But I have owned and shot all three. Curretly I have an AK and an AR. I sold my sks. They practically ALL need trigger jobs. If you can afford an AK or AR, I wouldn't even consider an sks. Also, except for the sks, you can but veru differing qualities of AK's and AR's. A great AR will beat a cheap AK and vice-a-versa. If I had my druthers an expensive (polytech legend) AK would do it all.

By price:

#1. sks
#2. AK
#3. AR

By accuracy:

#1. AR
#2. AK
#3. sks

By reliability:

#1. AK
#2. sks
#3. AR

By overall value:

#1. AR
#2. AK
#3. sks

My choice: (having owned and shot all three -which one would I keep?)

#1. AK
#2. AR
#3. sks

 

[rbernie]

The one detachable-mag SKS that I shot had a very finicky mag well/release, and mag changes were really very slow. I don't consider the SKS-D (or -M or whatever the importer called it) to be the equal of the AK in terms of mag changes, and I certainly wouldn't pay the asking price for one when a decent AK can be had for not much more.

I have built a bunch of AR-15s; two in 7.62x39, two in 6.8SPC, close to a half dozen in 5.56 NATO, and I have two more builds in progress (another 6.8 and a 204 Ruger). The AR-15 is my favorite rifles in terms of ergonomics and accuracy; it's what I used for deer/hog hunting, for example. They are not cheap; the least-expensive yet decent (not bottom-end parts) AR-15 will cost almost twice as much as my Romanian AK-74. But they are neat; highly modular, easy to modify, and highly-precise well crafted machines. You can buy one rifle and then buy additional uppers chambered in different calibers down the road; that's a really nice feature that lets you use one rifle for both hunting (bigger chambering like 6.8SPC) and SHTF work (5.56NATO). Uppers are readily swapped out via push-pin retainers that hold the upper to the lower - nothing could be easier to update than an AR.

I also have a Romanian AK-74 (AK rifle chambered in 5.45x39, ballistically similar to the 223/5.56 NATO commonly used in the AR-15) and its build quality and relative accuracy are superb. I bought it a month ago, and it cost me $420 shipped to my local FFL. It's just about my favorite AK pattern rifle of the half dozen or so that I own, although I have a bunch of Saiga (sporter Russian AK-design imports) rifles that I'm quite fond of as well. I think that everyone should have at least one AK, and barring finding a really nice non-CAI Romanian or Bulgarian, I don't think that anyone can go wrong with a converted/EBRified Saiga. I just bought a lightly-used converted Saiga in 223 for $430 shipped; that gives me a Russian AK chambered in a round commonly found in the US and reasonably effective for most anything short of huntin' big-boned game.

If I had to choose one rifle for all time and I felt comfortable that I'd rarely need to use it when it was full of mud or sand (e.g. under reasonably controlled conditions), I'd pick an AR-15 in either 5.56NATO (common and effective for social work) or 6.8SPC (not as easy to find but packing more punch for social work or hunting).

If I had to pick one rifle for all time and I felt that it would almost certainly be used in muddy/sandy conditions when I could not clean it out before use, I'd pick an AK. The question at that point would be which AK; 7.62x39 (the original), 5.45x39 (the current Russian standard round), 5.56 NATO (for US ammo commonality), or 308/7.62x51 (for serious punch). I'd probably choose 7.62x39 as the best all-around chambering of the lot.

 

[redneckrepairs]

The AR you can shoot little bitty things a long ways off with .

The AK you can pitch in a compost heap for a year or two , shake it off and it will run fine .

The sks you can not only use to row your canoe with but drive in tent stakes , hell you can use it for a tent stake if it has the folding bayonet LOL . It will run if drug from dallas to ft worth behind the pickup .

 

[Frog48]

I own an AR and SKS, and have shot a few AK's. I like them all, and they each fill a particular niche. However, the AR is my favorite.

 

[roscoe]

Don't think that the SKS cannot be accurate - mine can hit the lid of a coffee cup at 100 yards all day. If you get one with a decent bore and crown, and put Tech-Sights on the back, it is as accurate as you would need. Also, the 10-rounders are much more reliable than the higher-capacity aftermarket magazines, and with a little practice with stripper slips, loading is plenty fast. Another bonus: stripper clips are like .10 to .25 each. Compare that to prices for magazines.

My Chinese SKS is one of the most handy, reliable, and useful rifles I can think of, plus it is CA legal.

Stripper clip: