Evading Tracking Dogs

[Cob]

This may not be the best place to put this post, but was hoping somebody could give me some information on evading tracking dogs.

EDIT: This is a Training Scenario by Local Authorites:
Two brothers are boating, when a major catastrophe occurrs. Boat is wrecked, one brother is severely injured (& ultimately drowns), the other Brother goes for help thru the woods for help, and gets lost. The local emergency managment team & sherrifs office gets called on scene, and realize they have to use tracking dogs to find the lost person.The Terrain is flat, on a River in north FL, & consists of flood plain, Oak/ Pine forest on public land surrounding the scene. Due to Dry weather there is no water in sloughs, except for the river.

I'll be the Bro that goes for help, and will have a 2-3 hour head start on the dogs. I am required to walk about 2 miles to closest road. During the scenario, I become incapacitated ( you pick: heat-stroke/ heart attack/ broken leg...) I ultimately want to be found, but also want to make this task a little more challenging for the team that is in rescue mode.

How would you evade the dogs?

 

[MtnCreek]

I ultimately want to be found, but also want to make this task a little more challenging for the team that is in rescue mode.

That's a little strange. Are you working with your local S&R handlers on some kind of a project?

 

[Telekinesis]

I'm confused....

You have just been in a boating accident where the boat is destroyed, watched your brother die, got lost in a forest, and then suffer an injury serious enough that you are unable to move or aid the rescuers in any way, and your first reaction is "I haven't had a bad enough day, I want it to take longer for help to find me"

You might as well come up with something believable as a reason for wanting to evade SAR dogs.
As to how you would do it, I believe military pilots are given a powder (possibly a pepper based compound or even a powdered/solid form of the active chemicals in tear gas) which they spread around the ground near their last known position to confuse the dogs. Well, it doesn't so much confuse them as screw up their sense of smell long enough for you to get out of the area.

 

[Odd Job]

You want to evade a tracking dog?
I suggest you watch the film "Headhunters" if you want to see the ultimate solution

 

[Cob]

I'm working with local Sherrifs office, emergency management, and Dept. of Corrections (who is providing the S & R dogs), in a training exercise to keep skills up to date. Its taking place on a tract of state owned forest land that i routinely work. (I'm a Firefighter & Forester in FL)

I only have a small part in the whole scenario, & was wanting to make the search and rescue part of it a bit more challenging. No-one will be really hurt (hopefully), the scenario is just a routine exercise. I was thinking about the dog aspect of it, & in this "game" what steps could i take to evade the dogs, or is it even possible?

I know there are some dog hunters here - with info from their worst case failed hunts that their dogs might have encounted in the past, and i might take a few lessons/quirks they might have encountered in the past to learn from.

 

[Rail Driver]

Have the "injured" parties double back on their trail several times, have them step on large rocks to avoid leaving tracks, cross stream beds in order to break up scent continuity... If you want it to be as "real" as possible for the dogs (which is what I assume your part of the scenario is meant to be training for - the dogs and their handlers), you do not want to lay down CS or pepper.

 

[Sky]

I only have a small part in the whole scenario, & was wanting to make the search and rescue part of it a bit more challenging. No-one will be really hurt (hopefully), the scenario is just a routine exercise. I was thinking about the dog aspect of it, & in this "game" what steps could i take to evade the dogs, or is it even possible?

that makes sense now

 

[birdshot8's]

A dog handler will not appreciate you doing things to throw his dog off track. It is a training drill and they want the dog to be successful so they can reward the dog, to reinforce prior training. In Florida dogs can not follow track very far before overheating becomes an issue. As a handler I would like you to ask me what type of track I would like you to lay down, then know you were going to stick to game plan.

 

[MtnCreek]

Stay high and dry. Travel open areas when possible and don't touch stuff. Moisture is you enemy, whether it’s moisture on you or moist ground / grass… Any attempts to backtrack will likely result in you loosing time because the dog is just going to do the same or circle and he’ll do it faster than you. I would also ask the S&R guys what ‘OUT’ command they use (this is for when he finds you).

I know there are some dog hunters here - with info from their worst case failed hunts that their dogs might have encounted in the past, and i might take a few lessons/quirks they might have encountered in the past to learn from.

In that case, run and fight like a boar bear. Don’t stop till you cross two counties. The handlers will pick up the dog’s carcass from the mechanic shop (two counties over) three days later (after dog gets into anti-freeze).

 

[Cob]

I understand that handlers will be involved, and will abide by rules provided by Sherriffs office/ emergency mgt. I don't want to make it easy on the handlers or the dogs. If my brother really was near death, I would go for help, & believe being erratic/ irrational may be a reasonable reaction of the person going for help. If lost, i would walk in circles, and retrace steps back to known landmarks to find bearing in quest to find help.

I hope that whatever "real" situation the handler may discover after the exercise will be easier than i have provided during training. I will not use pepper, as that could be harmful to the dog, and a person looking for help would not leave "booby traps". I have been instructed that the search may last for several hours, and that i should pack a lunch, & bring water. (starts at 8 am tomorrow)

The dogs area combination of ground sniffers and air sniffers, and will be used in combination.

 

[MtnCreek]

It sounds like a lot of fun. Don't use pepper! If these dogs are still being trained, you could end their career in S&R. FYI: The dogs will circle if they get into an area with too much traffic. Looping around and doing a bunch of crazy stuff like that will slow them down, but it will slow you down a lot more. I kinda wish I was doing this. It sounds like a lot of fun.

 

[Flintknapper]

What breed(s) of dog will be used?

Some are much more cold nosed than others, but in any case…a decent dog should be able to follow a “track” that is only hours old with relative ease.

The ABILITY of a dog to follow a reasonable scent trail will not be as important as the skill of the handler to “put him back on track” when issues arise, I.E. water crossings, doubling back, non-target scents, vaulting, etc.

Any good dog will intuitively “zig-zag” in order to recover a lost scent trail…but in cases of water crossings…where man (or animal) has traveled in the stream bed (parallel with it) for some distance, the handler (or dog) must be willing to search the bank (both directions) for quite a long distance…or risk losing the trail.

If the person/animal simply crosses and pops out on the other side, any decent dog will find that track and resume trailing.

Same thing with “back trails”….the idea is to confuse the dog and then “vault” yourself off the back trail in hopes the dog will not find your new direction. In this case….the handler needs to first let the dog “work it out”.

The dog will follow the “freshest/strongest” scent….but they are constrained by their nose and do not “look” or “reason”. A good handler might spot tell-tale signs that the “target” left in another direction or simply “reason” that a particular direction is most likely.

A good handler knows when to trust the dog and when to help it out.

The question has already been asked….why you would want to make this more challenging than seems necessary, but I guess you have your reasons.

To that end, some of the simpler methods to confuse a dog will be:

1. Traverse surfaces that do not hold scent well (dry, hard, non-porous).
2. Travel up (or down) waterways for long distances before exiting onto the bank.
3. Back track in an “X” fashion then “vault” yourself off of the trail by means of jumping or using a walking stick of about head height. This leaves a longer distance between scent deposits and might be enough for a dog to miss (He’ll go back to the last site of strong scent).
4. Wear rubber boots to leave less scent than conventional footwear.
5. Avoid touching foliage with your body as much as possible, dogs will follow ANY scent they can find, not just foot traffic.
6. If time permits, make a half circle that cuts your original trial, drag an article of clothing while doing so. Leave that piece of clothing (partially covered) at the spot you began your circle and again “vault” off of the trail and continue on.

Of course the “injured” condition you describe would not allow for evasive techniques as described….but your real intent is to be found, (you just don’t want it to be a cake walk for the dogs or handler). Who knows why?

Personally, I would just thermal imaging equipment to find you.

 

[Cob]

What breed(s) of dog will be used?

I do not know, never seen them. One of the deputies informed the dogs would bite a moving target, and that i should bring a heavy jacket. (do not know if he was joking or not).

Of course the “injured” condition you describe would not allow for evasive techniques as described….but your real intent is to be found,

I am not injured for the first two miles of walking, but become injured, and have to be extracted from found location by EMS.

(you just don’t want it to be a cake walk for the dogs or handler). Who knows why?

If this were an escaped convict scenario, i could have more fun with it, but it's not that. I can't say why making it challeging for the handlers/ dogs "is what it is?". - Maybe making it more challenging is sort of matching ones wit's with that of the multiple Dog/ Handler teams. I'm a hunter, and enjoy the pursuit of game. In a weird sense, I feel that being "the game" for this exercise would be a neat experience.
- The public tract of land is only 330 acres, yet I aquired the use of private land (unbeknownst to handlers), & was able to expand search area to about 600 acres of public & adjacent private land. There are some old (100+ year) phospate mines on the private tract that pose some difficult terrain, that one might expect a person to get lost in, and there are some unique sinkholes along the river that provide more terrain. Outside of the river itself, a sole spring exists that offers water. No other known water exists. Brush, woods, and briars are abundant. Wind will be blowing northeast, the direction i'll be heading.

 

[Telekinesis]

I'm working with local Sherrifs office, emergency management, and Suwannee Corrections (who is providing the S & R dogs), in a training exercise to keep skills up to date.

Ok, that makes sense now. While I don't agree with the scenario, I know that as a participant you take what's given to you and can't really change the terms.

I will not use pepper, as that could be harmful to the dog, and a person looking for help would not leave "booby traps".

In my defense, people evading search dogs for reasons other than training generally don't have the luxury of putting the welfare of the dog above their own But I agree, in this scenario using those substances would be bad for all involved. If only you'd told us this was a training exercise from the beginning we could have avoided all of that...

 

[1911Tuner]

Evade a tracking dog? I assume we're talkin' about Bloodhounds.

I've seen Bloodhounds work. They can smell what you had for breakfast the day before yesterday, right down to the peach marmelade that you licked off your wife's spoon.

They can smell three skin cells that you left when you stopped to get your bearings...a week ago.

They can detect your scent if you take a bath in cologne during your escape and evasion.

If you leave decoy scents, they'll ignore them and get right back on yours within 30 seconds.

You ain't gonna get away from a Bloodhound unless you get in a vehicle and roll the windows up..and even then...the handlers have to forcibly take the dog off the trail. They won't give up until they find you or die in the attempt.

 

[Cob]

If only you'd told us this was a training exercise from the beginning we could have avoided all of that..

I don't think the dogs know the difference.... but fixed the first post to reflect that

 

[Magoo]

I applaud you for participating in this training exercise. And it does sound like it could be fun to play the "prey" in a dog hunt. But...

I'd try to talk to the highest ranking person in charge of the dogs and see what he'd like from you as a "searchee" in terms of behaviors. This is a training exercise for them. Let the trainer(s) make the call on how they'd like you to act. I just don't see it as your place/job/role to decide what you think is best for the dogs and their training. Even if you were a professional dog trainer yourself, these are not your dogs.

ETA: If these are S&R dogs I think you can sleep safe thinking they aren't going to bite you and it was a wink-wink joke.

 

[snakeman]

stay in the shallows of the river

 

[Cob]

I'd try to talk to the highest ranking person in charge of the dogs and see what he'd like from you as a "searchee" in terms of behaviors

Ironically, i do not think i will ever be given a chance to talk to the dog handlers in advance. As a part recording reaction time, i do not know even if they realize it is taking place yet, or cerating componenets of the EMS system. I did call one of the dog handlers I know today, to see if he was aware of it, and he is off work tomorrow.. I will be in communications with everyone on scen with the scenario, and will go by whatever rules they give me.

 

[Magoo]

That's unfortunate, it seems to me, for the potential effectiveness of the exercise. I hate the phrase, but "it is what it is".

Given that, it'd seem to me you should act as much like the help seeking victim you are. In the given scenario, with the conditions of the day, act as you think an average citizen would. Circling, backtracking, "confused state behavior", etc. may well fit into that scenario. But I wouldn't think it helpful to intentionally "trick" the dogs.

 

[41 Mag]

Having been around a couple of great nosed dogs in my time, I doubt seriously they will not find you. I had a friend up at our farm once. His chocolate lab found me in the back of our place while I was deer hunting. Walked right up to me like I was sitting out in the back yard. He had let him out in the yard and he simply hit my trail down the hill and came to see how I was doing. LOL

I have a dog now that will find anything you put him on. Never specifically trained him to do so other than just telling him to "find it", and away we go. The draw back is when leashed, you go where he goes and that isn't always a fun thing. When you duck to go under branches or vines, he is like a semi and your simply the trailer, he just downshifts and pulls the load along.

The wife and I have "played" with him in a similar manner to what your doing, where she will take him for a walk while we're in the woods, and tell him to find Pop. It doesn't take him long to do so at all, even if I drive back down into one of the pastures.

I do not unleash him when we look for things, as he will go until he finds it no matter where that might be, and sometimes I'm not quite as enthusiastic to go there as he is. He, like the ones you will be working with, knows when the leash is snapped on, it's time to get serious. We usually "look" for hogs that have been hit, or are known to be down, and he does enjoy his time when he finds them. Finding them isn't always a priority, but if they are a good one we will look harder.

(this big boar was already dead when he found him, but he had to get in on the fun as well. In fact he drug him out of the tractor bucket three times before I could get it up high enough he couldn't jump in with it.)

He gets rewarded no matter if we find them or not. To him it's simply a game, but to the ones your working with it's WAY more than that.

 

[303tom]

I agree with 41 Mag & especially if it is a Bloodhound, Myth-Busters proved it, you don`t evade them...........

 

[Sheepdog1968]

Myth busters had two episodes dedicated to evading them. They went to great extremes and were unsuccessful in avoiding being tracked. I don't think it can be done from what I saw Mythbusters try.

 

[MrDig]

When I was in the Military there was a myth that sprinkling black pepper around your room would throw off dogs sniffing for drugs. I say myth because the one idiot who tried it got busted sure as day, the dog sneezed a couple times and went strait to the drugs he had stashed after he sneezed. (No I was not the idiot who tried it)
Scent Dogs are amazing to watch work and hounds are frightening in their abilities if you are on the lam and they use dogs to find you you had best get into the water and travel hundreds of miles away or them hounds will in fact find you.
There is very little you can do in an S&R simulation that will even throw them off a little bit.

 

[buck460XVR]

I'd assume since this is practice for a S&R that one would want to duplicate that scenario as close as possible. If someone is going cross country to get help, they are not going to waste time backtracking and wading miles thru water. They may lose their sense of direction and walk in circles, but they are not going to go to great lengths to not be found. Wildlife can sometimes avoid dogs by being evasive enough to distract the dogs long enough to outrun them. This is not true of humans, especially one with "heat-stroke/ heart attack/ broken leg". I'd say if you are trying to duplicate a S&R then that's what you should do. If you are trying to duplicate a fugitive from justice, then that's different.

One of the deputies informed the dogs would bite a moving target, and that i should bring a heavy jacket.

A S&R dog that bites the person it's supposed to find? I doubt it. What if it's looking for a lost child? If the dog has been trained to attack, it probably will be on a leash or at least be trained to attack on command. A rescue dog that bites anyone that moves is not a asset, but a liability and I would tend to think it would need training other than scent trailing.