Factory second bullets...

[Poper]

It is not unusual for me to buy these "blemished" bullets when Midway has a good sale on them - heck, I am still shooting some .277 cal. 130 grainers I bought over 5 years ago - and I always sort them by weight and measured diameter. I sort them +/- .1 grain of the nominal weight. Some times the bullets vary a lot. Sometimes not so much. I figure if I get a 75% yield, I am doing pretty good and a 60% yield is what I expect. If I am looking for competition use, I then sort them to diameter and then again by length (from base to ogive) with a comparator. The culls make for some pretty cheap shooting.

So I bought 500 factory second, .243, 90 grain bullets from Midway for my new Mauser M18 in .243 Winchester that came last week.
Midway buys them from a manufacturer in large quantities and re-packages and re-labels them. At $0.21 apiece, these are a pretty good buy. Many of them have no visual defects at all. Some have discoloration that appears to be die lubrication during set-up operations or something, but nothing that would hamper anything but appearance. This batch looks like they could be / may be 90 grain Hornady ELD-X bullets - judging by appearance.

Today's weight sort yielded 67% (335 of 500) plus one .35 cal., 200 grain, flat base, plastic tipped bullet.

 

[troy fairweather]

I've had good luck in the past with there blems, but this last year they have been horrible from midway.
Ones from rmr and sps have been just fine.

Try some speer bullets there ~ 20¢ new.

 

[George P]

I bought "factory seconds" from RMR in 9mm; they work as well as regular bullets and at a great price.

 

[AJC1]

There is zero chance I think 60% of a 21cent each is a good deal. Maybe check the math on that to reconsider

 

[Poper]

There is zero chance I think 60% of a 21cent each is a good deal. Maybe check the math on that to reconsider

That depends.
When I sort bullets for competition, I sort by weight first (+/- 0.1gn), then by diameter, then by length (base to ogive). With most mfr's it is rare to have a yield of more than 35%. Bergers (and similar high end) target bullets will typically yield 85% +. I no longer sort Berger bullets. But then they typically run $0.45 or more each.

The culls, after sorting bullets like the ones noted above, make excellent practice and sight-in rounds. Whenever I take a newbie to the range, I bring plenty of factory seconds "cull" bullet reloads to shoot. I really do not like to use "best-run" bullets for practice and general low-grade paper punching or plinking.



I'm thinking I might just cut one of these bullets full length just to see if these are indeed Hornady ELD-X bullets.

 

[MDof2]

My kids gotta eat, and I don't hate money. I love the seconds for range time, plunking, gas guns, etc.
Match / Precision / Bench, I stick with the high dollar slugs.

 

[AJC1]

That depends.
When I sort bullets for competition, I sort by weight first (+/- 0.1gn), then by diameter, then by length (base to ogive). With most mfr's it is rare to have a yield of more than 35%. Bergers (and similar high end) target bullets will typically yield 85% +. I no longer sort Berger bullets. But then they typically run $0.45 or more each.

The culls, after sorting bullets like the ones noted above, make excellent practice and sight-in rounds. Whenever I take a newbie to the range, I bring plenty of factory seconds "cull" bullet reloads to shoot. I really do not like to use "best-run" bullets for practice and general low-grade paper punching or plinking.



I'm thinking I might just cut one of these bullets full length just to see if these are indeed Hornady ELD-X bullets.

Ok I follow now, competion cull not 4 grains off in the trash can cull. My brain is back in the casting pot cull mindset right now.

 

[jeeptim]

My second story.
So I got 1000 223 55gr FMJs loaded them all had several that pushed in tha case some fell out maybe a dozen. Measured those offending bullets found they were a tad bit smaller so 900 or so had to run through a factory crimp die. So no more seconds for me.

 

[Laphroaig]

I think that most of Midway's Factory Seconds come from Hornady. I've been buying, and using, many of the factory second 30 caliber bullets for some time. Mainly 155 Amax, 168 Amax, and 168 HPBT versions. I find them to be suitable for 200 yd. CMP GSM type competitions and have shot some of my best scores using them. In fact, almost all of my purchases have not shown any flaws that I could detect. I've seen a few that had some surface tarnish but that didn't affect performance.

I wouldn't be surprised if Midway has a contract with Hornady to buy X bullets a month. Hornady sets aside their minor QC rejects for this purpose, and makes up the rest from their regular production. I'll keep buying them when they are offered at 20 or 21 cents each. I haven't been burnt yet.

 

[PapaG]

I used to work about four or five times a year in Boonville, MO, and would arrange to run down to Sedalia to hit the Sierra factory and buy my max allotment of seconds from their backdoor store. I think they ran about 60% and were fine bullets.

 

[right winger]

I agree the Midway seconds are Hornady and they are only cosmetic in my experience. I bought 2000+ last time they were available and got a bunch of .311 150 grs for my nagants and enfields. Even scored some 168 Bthp match. Buy and shoot them w/o worry

 

[LiveLife]

I have bought "cosmetic" seconds pistol and rifle bullets from RMR and have been happy with them.

I am OK with cosmetic blemish on surface as long as "seconds" bullets produce same holes on target.

 

[longdayjake]

The RMR-in house 2nds are usually just the first 20 or so bullets that we catch every time we start the machines. Sometimes there may be some OAL differences because we haven't set the punches to the perfect depth yet when replacing tooling, but for the most part, there is no difference between an RMR 2nd and a first. In fact, because I'm a cheap guy, RMR 2nds are all I ever shoot. I don't even take the time to polish off the draw oil. After a few months they turn pretty dark. But they shoot awesome!!! The other 2nds that RMR sells are typically from other major US manufacturers that ask us not to reveal who made them, but on rare occassions we get stuff from foreign producers but I think it's been years since we've had any foreign produced 2nds.

 

[H&R Glock]

Bullets for the 223/5.56 seconds shoot just fine for me. All my cases are freshly sized and length trimmed. With seconds I notice a great difference in the distance from the cannelure to the case mouth. I cannot determine if this difference is due to a length of bullet or placement of the cannelure.. I do not have the instrumentation to determine it. I never crimp 223 ammo so it is not a great problem.
Has anyone examined this problem?

 

[Walkalong]

Ever since I got burned on some undersized blems (.3085 instead of .312), bullets I am leery of blems. Factory seconds may be different.

 

[cougar1717]

I don't buy blems or factory seconds from midway anymore. You guys can have them. I've just been bit several times and I'm done. I've bought bullets with: misshapen bases, problems with poly tips; misshapen spitzer points; extreme weight variation (ie - they take out all the ones that fall within 1 standard deviation of the mean and leave you with the "tails" of the bell curve); length variation; etc.

I agree that in order to get usable bullets, the way to sort them is: weight - diameter - length.
However, you still may get deformed bases and no amount of sorting can make those consistent.

If you look at the reviews, most of them aren't older than one year. It would appear that they are reset at that interval. Otherwise a track record of these problems would be obviously revealed.

I'm not downing those that purchase them - I have purchased them myself and used them. It's just that everyone should know that it is a lottery.

Some people are going to get bullets that are basically firsts and write glowing, five star reviews. They got a great deal.

Some people are going to get bullets that have some culls or minor problems but generally ok for the price paid. They got an equitable deal.

However, some people are going to get a bad batch of bullets and you as the buyer don't know which ones are the ones to buy or the ones to stay away from. As a buyer, you don't know what you're getting and depending on your quantity, timeframe for testing, and the return policy - they may not be worth returning. Unless they are deeply discounted on clearance, there are usually better options.

I'm sure some have had great experiences with blems, but I have not on the whole. I'm not saying anything that is 60 minutes worthy here since the posted product reviews for factory second offerings mirror my experience.

 

[rkittine]

As a benchrest shooter I am anal about my projectiles. No blemished or seconds for me. Sort by weight, length and bearing surface. For pistol shooting for trigger time I would consider it, but have not found that the prices are really so low that it makes a big difference.

Bob