Fatigued barrel

[shotgun12321]

Unfortunately on July 4, 1999 I was shooting with my dad at a local gun club and the double barrel 12 ga. I was shooting (not sure model or year, but a fairly old gun) and then barrel gave way out the left side and took a part of me with it.



It sucks, but ya know, stuff happens.

 

[rcmodel]

Dollars to donuts it had Damascus barrels, which have been known for many years to not be safe to shoot with modern smokeless powder loads.

They may blow up right where your fingers are located on the forearm.

Too bad you had to learn this well known fact the hard way!

rcmodel

 

[Titus]

Sorry to hear that. Was it a case of shooting smokeless loads in an old black powder rated gun?

 

[Jim Watson]

My neighbor the gunsmith had a Damascus double on the wall, with about two inches blown out of the left barrel, right where a right handed shooter would have his left hand on the forearm.

Sorry you had to learn the hard way.

 

[RobNDenver]

I am so sorry to hear that this happened to you. I have a Parker Damascus 12 Ga. that two gunsmiths have told me that I could shoot, using very light loads. (7/8 with #7 or #8 shot.

I am just not willing to do that and after seeing your misfortune I am really adamant about not shooting vintage guns with modern ammunition.

A friend of mine who has every Gun Digest published ( or close to it) pulled out a 1962 issue and let me read the article about how Damascus barrels fail from the inside out. Even though the barrel walls are sufficiently thick, there is no test to determine whether or not they will fail.

 

[shotgun12321]

Yeah luckily im a left handed shooter, because my left thumb would have been taken if i was right handed

 

[PJR]

Without knowing the particulars of the incident (gun, load, potential for obstruction) that resulted in the above pictured injury it is a real stretch to condemn all damascus barrels. There are many that are in service today with nitro proofs that can be used with modern loads.

Sherman Bell did extensive testing on damascus barrels a few years ago for Double Gun Journal. His conclusion disputed the contention that all damascus barrels are accidents waiting to happen. A damacus Parker didn't let go until close to the 30 thousand psi mark or 2.5 times the pressure of a standard 12 gauge load.

I'd shoot low-pressure modern loads in damascus barrels that were nitro proofed, made by a reputable maker and after the gun had the thumbs up from a qualified double gun smith that included bore and wall thickness measurements. I would feel exactly the same about a fluid steel of the same vintage.

 

[rcmodel]

that included bore and wall thickness measurements.

1. There is no known way to measure the strength of the weld seams between the different layers of steel in the Damascus wrap.

2. Smokeless powder reaches maximum pressure further down the barrel then the black powder they were proof-tested with.

3. To further compound the problem, all of those guns are old enough to have been used with corrosive primers of the day, and it is a rare one indeed that doesn't have pitting in the bores.

4. How deep into those seam welds does the pitting go?

Only the Shadow knows!

rcmodel

 

[PJR]

1. There is no known way to measure the strength of the weld seams between the different layers of steel in the Damascus wrap

True but proof testing has shown that properly made damascus barrels can be safely shot with modern loads.

2. Smokeless powder reaches maximum pressure further down the barrel then the black powder they were proof-tested with.

Not all damascus barrels were proof tested only with black powder. Depending on when they were made they could well have nitro proofs.

3. To further compound the problem, all of those guns are old enough to have been used with corrosive primers of the day, and it is a rare one indeed that doesn't have pitting in the bores.

That can just as easily be said about fluid steel barrels as well. There are many vintage shotguns and rifles, shot with corrosive primers that were cleaned properly and show little sign of pitting. The greater concern is that the barrels were honed to remove pitting making the barrels unacceptably thin but this is not exclusive to damascus.

 

[Jim Watson]

True, but the problem is finding a Damascus barrelled gun that was nitro proved and is still "in proof" as the British say. And the British have done a lot of work with nitro proved Camascus. A sound Parker or Purdey might be ok, but a hardware store special is risky.

A guy here routinely shot a Damascus Remington, but he had done a lot of research on it and used a powder, load, and wad that never exceeded BP presssures anyplace down the barrels.

 

[9x19sig]

Wow, that's sad to hear that happened to you. How long did it take to fully heal?

 

[shotgun12321]

Fully heal, about 4 months, with physical therapy and stuff.

It was so long ago and I was kinda young so i dont really remember

 

[9x19sig]

Can you come up with some pics of the doomed shotgun? Just curious to see exactly what happened.

 

[shotgun12321]

See, i would but we actually took it to the Police station to get it destroyed.

Wasn't my idea, i would have saved it

 

[Jeff Mull]

All damascus guns are unsafe, especially the really pretty ones.

Send them to me, postage prepaid and I'll put them in a nice safe place so you can sleep at night.

Jeff